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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have a split that I started mid June. It was headed by the original package queen of a hive that attempted to swarm. I started them with in one ten frame medium and boosted them with four frames of brood about two weeks later. They have had spotty brood and have been slow to build up all summer. The mite count is extremely low. Come August, they still had not drawn out three mediums so I started to feed and replaced the queen. Now, two weeks later, they have almost drawn out three boxes (about one frame short). The new queen has a great pattern but she has to do a lot of filling in the blanks left by the old queen. They have very few stores and a small population, not many bees on the top bars. I am feeding now 2:1.

Any thoughts? I have other hives I could add them to. Any ideas about how small is too small for a New York winter?
 

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put on a top tank type feeder to fill up the comb, if you are not using one now. another med. box would be nice but for your NYC climate 3 mediums should do ok for a small side of average hive. you could stick on another med. box they might just draw it out and fill it. sounds like your in better shape than you think.
 

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Put the feed to them with an internal feeder. Getting late in the game for the bees to draw a lot of comb. If you have other drawn comb consider replacing foundation with it as the bees will fill it out a lot faster.
 

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If they have 3 mediums drawn out they should be fine if you feed them. If you want to build their stores you need to put feed to them in a way that they take it down fast and have to store it. A jar or boardman type feeder isn't going to cut it. I would use a top feeder. If you replaced the queen the first of August and it took her a week to start laying, you are still a week away from her brood to start emerging. I would think things should start to look better then. Giving them a frame of emerging brood can only help as well.
 

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>They have had spotty brood and have been slow to build up all summer.
This sound exactly like EFB.

>The new queen has a great pattern but she has to do a lot of filling in the blanks left by the old queen.
She has a great pattern, can you post pictures of the open and capped brood of the new queen.
At two weeks now 1/2 of the capped and all of the open is from the new queen. Is the open brood still spotty? Is there intermixed different aged larva side by side?

>I have other hives I could add them to.
and if it's EFB you will spread it.

Do you use HBH or EOs?
 

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EFB is often associated with mal-nourished bees. it will clear up usually as the bees get healthy and well fed, if not totally out of control. this does not seem like the case here.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
>They have had spotty brood and have been slow to build up all summer.
This sound exactly like EFB.

>The new queen has a great pattern but she has to do a lot of filling in the blanks left by the old queen.
She has a great pattern, can you post pictures of the open and capped brood of the new queen.
At two weeks now 1/2 of the capped and all of the open is from the new queen. Is the open brood still spotty? Is there intermixed different aged larva side by side?

>I have other hives I could add them to.
and if it's EFB you will spread it.

Do you use HBH or EOs?
I know nothing about EFB, I have to do some research, I am guessing HBH is hive beetle, I saw my first one in this hive a few days ago. I have my other hives on a platform above rocks and I never saw them before. I don't think that is the problem. I don't know what EO is. I started the replacement queen in a nuc because I could not find the queen in the large hive at first. The replacement was pulled from her hive and put in my nuc same day and started laying right away. I know her pattern is good because the comb from the nuc looks perfect. The old queen is now in the nuc and I am going to use her for an observation hive. I have to say she looks great and she was great until I moved her after the swarm attempt. I am definitely not ruling out disease or pest being to blame. I will post some pictures if I get a chance. Thanks!
 

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EFB is European foul brood. it is not a common problem in new York state. as I said in post #9, it will usually clean itself up in good times for the bees... look up the bee diseases and pests at the NYBEEWELLNEES website.
 

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HBH - Honey Bee Healthy, a syrup additive with essential oils (EO).

SHB - Small Hive Beetle.

My recommendation when dealing with us beginners: UNAB (Use No Abbreviations)
 

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From what I've seen and read here. EFB is very common (NY I dont know). Dr. Jeff Pettis, Beltsville Bee Lab given in North Carolina is see more cases of it.

HBH - Honey Bee Healthy, a syrup additive with essential oils (EO) kills the bee probiotics that fight EFB, AFB, Nosema and more. If you feed HBH or EOs to your bees and the come in contact with EFB they will not be able to defend from the disease.

http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?298750-Pseudo-Laying-Workers


http://www.ars.usda.gov/Services/docs.htm?docid=7458

Sounds like your hive is recovering from it, look forward to seeing some pictures. I have notices different genetics make a differences.

Keep an eye out on your small 10 frame and less hives seem the most vulnerable, usually EFB is in numerous hives.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Heres the pics. Brood is still spotty.







In this one you can see a slumped larvae I did the tooth pick test and nothing was stringy



this is probably the best looking frame in the hive. You can spot the queen!



Very little stores. Population seems a little bit better, its been three weeks with the new queen, is she just filling in the blanks or is this a bad pattern. When I pulled her frames from the nuc to add them her pattern looked great. Thoughts?
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I did a drop count and a powdered sugar roll 8/2/14
1 mite on a 3 day count
0 mites on a powder sugar roll, 300+ bees

I did another drop count 8/27/14
9 mites on a 3 day count
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I am. Well an assistant who wants to take over the hive. Its at her community garden. I am not very confident she is mixing syrup thick enough even though I have accused her of making it light and explained the ratio about a million times. I got a bad burn from trying to mix some at the corner store so I am walking away from that. I switched to a hive top feeder a week ago and peeked in today and they did not seem to be all over it. I have been having bees regect feed from this feeder all summer. No idea why. Only thing I can think is there is a bit of a flow.
 

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Here is my thinking. If you started out with spotty brood then how is it going to change? The instant the brood hatches the queen is going to lay in the cells again (after being cleaned of course). The has to be a shut down of brood rearing to reset the cells. Don't fight it. Let the colony decide what it needs. Aim for a banner hive next year. Down size the hive if you have to this year and if she is a good queen she will take off next year.
 

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I think the ace has a good point. if your queen keeps filling in spotty brood it will look spotty. it looks like it is being filled in well. looks good to me... when mixing syrup 5:3, sugar to water by weight, it can often be mixed with very hot tap water without extra heat. that is commercial temperature tap water. If you got burned bad the syrup was likely too hot, it is not good for bees to scald the syrup, look this up on another thread, 165 f. should do it. 5:3 keeps pretty well and is ok anytime. from what I can see you really need to put some weight on this hive now. you will need to use some sort of tank type top feeder and it will take gallons of syrup, reduce entrance size. winter is coming in your area you will need 90 to 110 pounds of honey [or capped syrup] in the hive, I would think. never feed hot syrup let it cool below 90 degrees.
 
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