[William Bagwell]

Nice article in this month's Betterbee 'Buzz' relating to reading bottom boards (which is a key feature of Steve's advice):

Reading Your Sticky Boards in the Winter | Betterbee

Nice! Pictures are a bit small but if you open them in a new tab they get bigger.

 

[drummerboy]

Nice! Pictures are a bit small but if you open them in a new tab they get bigger.

The book is loaded with useful pics, charts and helpful advise regardless of where one is with their beekeeping, whether still treating and wanting to get off that endless treadmill or even for fresh BEEKS getting started without.

Great advise on methods to transition away from treating with precise monitoring of the BB....that leaves sugar dusting and alcohol washes behind for good. Hoo-Ray!!

 

[Some Bloke]

Nice article in this month's Betterbee 'Buzz' relating to reading bottom boards (which is a key feature of Steve's advice):

Reading Your Sticky Boards in the Winter | Betterbee

As a Brit, I am embarassed to pimp my own product, especially as this thread is about someone else's book; but I cover all that and more about debris in my book, pages 158-165: New book: The Observant Beekeeper by Paul Honigmann

The book attempts to index and archive as much of this kind of lore as possible. As someone said to me yesterday, although the internet initially led to a broadening of education (access to novel info), it's settled into a very shallow pool, repeating just a few facts over and over, and knowledge like this is fading.

 

[Kellyb]

Did you already use screened bottoms db?

 

[drummerboy]

As a Brit, I am embarassed to pimp my own product, especially as this thread is about someone else's book; but I cover all that and more about debris in my book, pages 158-165: New book: The Observant Beekeeper by Paul Honigmann

The book attempts to index and archive as much of this kind of lore as possible. As someone said to me yesterday, although the internet initially led to a broadening of education (access to novel info), it's settled into a very shallow pool, repeating just a few facts over and over, and knowledge like this is fading.

No need to be embarrassed. We are proud owners/lovers of your book as well. It's an excellent addition for any beek seeking more precise details - lots of details. 🆒

 

[drummerboy]

Did you already use screened bottoms db?

We used to...for about 20 years. We found them too flimsy/drafty for N/W Wisconsin. We've got a pile of them.

Now we just place a simple piece of 'thick' plastic (we use clear/CHEAP place-mats) slid over the solid bottom boards (least amount of bee disturbance) for a few days every month (more often if an issue is observed), pulling them out and thoroughly inspecting the trash bees left us.

The book provided things to look for that we didn't know to look for, so during the 2025 season we will be utilizing these new (to us) observational methods and manipulations designed to keep our bees TF by 'anticipating' what bees want to do and then acting accordingly to 'satisfy' the bees desires, something we've been developing and incorporating into our practice for several years already.

 

[Berry Lane Bees]

Great presentation from Mr. Steve Riley from this year's National Honey Show just dropped.

He and Dr. Stephen Martin host and maintain varroaresistant.uk and work closely with the growing cohort of TF beekeepers in the UK.

A few slides outline the fundamental dynamics at work in the colonies they have studied:

View attachment 91841

View attachment 91842

View attachment 91843

In my opinion…

I encourage beekeepers to start with a strain of varroa resistant stock and then continue selecting from the best of their offspring.

Also of significant note in the presentation that he believes that “mite biting” or evidence of this was irrelevant to to the bees genuinely controlling varroa…so much so that they don’t use that anymore as a selection criteria.

 

[Berry Lane Bees]

I would bet a large sum of money that there are far more so called "hobbiests" that care about this subject, than the numbers of commercials who do! Most of the commercials are well served by the "meat" bees and ritual treatment.

Granted there is a high percentage of hobbiests who know very little about bees but they are not the major force for status quo. They source their bees regularly from what is majorly available not because they dont care.

The few who are producing far more suitable stock could not presently put a dent in the demand. Build it and they will come! Insults are majorly non productive in modifying behavior.
Makes a person wonder what the payoff is in doing so!

Interesting thoughts.

While I am no expert, I think commercial beekeepers are motivated by the bottom line. If they could have 100% treatment free bees, I am pretty confident they would be super excited…especially if those same bees produced a bunch of honey.

no commercial beekeeper wants to spend thousands treating. Unfortunately, I believe they have gotten to the point where they treat prophylacticly because they don’t have the time to test every hive.

 

[Berry Lane Bees]

And herein is the other issue - the L-word is missing.
.....This is lucky for us because by starting with queens inbred for the trait, a breeder can easily import the trait into his stock at the 50% level. ....

Sure enough the I-word is right there (the importation).
Then everyone jumps on that importation train - heck, even researchers suggest doing the same.

By importation you trying to fix a feature A (because all everyone cares for is the A).
BUT - all the while you screw the features X, Y, Z and more.

SO the Brits are getting it right.
But the US folk are sitting on the quick fix pill - a cultivated trait around here.
Which is obviously not working - the ready-to-go, imported bees.

Import the trait once (pretty much have to in the absence of the native pops).
But then fix the trait in place.
Let it all sit and brew (even if getting thru the bottlenecks). Takes time, patience and luck.

Scale is something we all have to keep in mind.
Britain is literally 40x smaller than the US.
Compound that with commercial beekeepers moving their bees thousands of miles to maximize profit through large scale pollination and honey production…it would be difficult at best to efficiently effect the local feral populations as quickly as local sedentary beehives.

 

[Berry Lane Bees]

I do like the idea of “ importing” to one’s local area once and then continuously selecting for the best traits.

 

[GregB]

Scale is something we all have to keep in mind.
Britain is literally 40x smaller than the US.
Compound that with commercial beekeepers moving their bees thousands of miles to maximize profit through large scale pollination and honey production…it would be difficult at best to efficiently effect the local feral populations as quickly as local sedentary beehives.

https://www.beesource.com/threads/the-honey-bee-solution-to-varroa.377202/page-8?post_id=2038977#post-2038977

 

[Berry Lane Bees]

One thing people should very clearly understand and keep in mind at all times.
This one.
To see just how incompatible the situational contexts are.

View attachment 91943

Nothing like a picture to explain scale…missed that, well done.

 

[Snarge]

Nothing like a picture to explain scale…missed that, well done.

I read that England fits into Alabama with room to spare. Is there much migratory pollination in the U.K.?

 

[GregB]

I read that England fits into Alabama with room to spare. Is there much migratory pollination in the U.K.?

No. Not much.
BUT - they do import queens.
In here the UK guest talks pretty well about their own importation status (don't remember exact minute).

 

[Some Bloke]

I read that England fits into Alabama with room to spare. Is there much migratory pollination in the U.K.?

Our biggest bee farmer has about 5,000 hives. We don't have the same scale of mechanisable, megafarms as the US, because the countryside is largely a patchwork of hills and stuff. The SE and Norfolk are large plains but that's "a small fraction of Alabama". And those grain-growing areas are the areas with the highest introgression of non-native genes.

 

[Snarge]

No. Not much.
BUT - they do import queens.
In here the UK guest talks pretty well about their own importation status (don't remember exact minute).

Just watched it (1.5X) and really nothing new if one has been following the last few years of research to include Dr. Martin’s; maybe just that 60% of beekeepers in the U.K. are hobbyists. Nice review though👍

 

[drummerboy]

Just watched it (1.5X) and really nothing new if one has been following the last few years of research to include Dr. Martin’s; maybe just that 60% of beekeepers in the U.K. are hobbyists. Nice review though👍

...but if ya only see the movie....you won't know what's in the book will ya?

The vid leaves out 90% of what's in the book---just like books made into movies....lots of the good stuff is missing.....

Alas; some folks are more interested in the headlines....forgetting/ignoring the details....

"Humans seek to satisfy their desires with the least exertion" - Henry George (Americas Greatest 'forgotten" economist)

 

[Snarge]

Alas; some folks are more interested in the headlines....forgetting/ignoring the details....

Why don’t ya enlighten us, drummerboy?😉

 

[squarepeg]

"Humans seek to satisfy their desires with the least exertion" - Henry George (Americas Greatest 'forgotten" economist)

as do bees and pretty much all life forms. biologists refer to this as 'parsimonious'. natural selection appears to select for this.

 

[squarepeg]

Why don’t ya enlighten us, drummerboy?😉

yes, please. i must confess that i have not had the time to order the book, but we would love to hear about some of those pearls of wisdom that you have gleaned from it db.