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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Down here in the Southern Hemisphere it's honey harvesting time which I was doing today. Came across an especially vicious hive, badly wanted to requeen, but I didn't have a queen.

Then while doing the AFB check I found 3 supersedure cells. A good thing, but only issue is the resultant queen might turn out to be just as nasty as it's mother.

So, what to do? Alongside the agro hive was a nice quiet hive of golden coloured very gentle bees. I didn't have any queen making gear with me, but using a twig I removed the young larvae from the queen cells, and replaced them with larvae plucked from the gentle hive.

Hoping the bees don't notice and raise one of these larvae to be their new queen. Never done this before so not totally certain it will work, but as the vicious hive was black and the nice hive was yellow, I should be able to tell in a couple of months if there has been a colour change in the black hive.


2 of the 3 supersedure cells




Over at the gentle hive, pared back the cell a bit, removed the larva, and placing a larva from the gentle hive into the supersedure cell.

 

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Down here in the Southern Hemisphere it's honey harvesting time which I was doing today. Came across an especially vicious hive, badly wanted to requeen, but I didn't have a queen.

Then while doing the AFB check I found 3 supersedure cells. A good thing, but only issue is the resultant queen might turn out to be just as nasty as it's mother.

So, what to do? Alongside the agro hive was a nice quiet hive of golden coloured very gentle bees. I didn't have any queen making gear with me, but using a twig I removed the young larvae from the queen cells, and replaced them with larvae plucked from the gentle hive.

Hoping the bees don't notice and raise one of these larvae to be their new queen. Never done this before so not totally certain it will work, but as the vicious hive was black and the nice hive was yellow, I should be able to tell in a couple of months if there has been a colour change in the black hive.


2 of the 3 supersedure cells




Over at the gentle hive, pared back the cell a bit, removed the larva, and placing a larva from the gentle hive into the supersedure cell.

were the age/size the same similar?

may as well remove the other 2 to improve your odds.

GG
 

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I have never seen a successful queen graft with an active uncapped larva more than 18 hours old. Good luck, it will be interesting to see if it turns out. I hope you didn't flip her over!
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
LOL, I never wear gloves, I guess vicious would be by my definition. Which would be making me wish I had a pair :oops:. Also, can't graft with gloves, or at least, I can't.

And yes, replaced the larva in the cell with a similar aged one. The other cell was more advanced so was replaced with a much younger one.

I should be able to take a look in the hive on Friday, so I'll report back. With a pic for proof of course (if the graft took) :)
 

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If they do not take, how long would it take you to get new queen?
Assuming there are no eggs and young brood in the box on the day he did the switcheroo:
On the day he finds out it did not take, he can introduce a 4 day old larva to the box and have a virgin in roughly 12 days from that date. Mated in roughly 24 days from that date.

If he had eggs and young brood in the box on the day he did the switcheroo:
They have likely already realized that their queen cell is not viable and are making new emergency cells now. He will should have a virgin within about 12 days of the date of the switcheroo. Mated within in roughly 24 days of the switcheroo, depending on how long it took them to realize they were hopelessly queenless.

Or he could get one FedEx'd.
 

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I gathered from OT's post that they were in the process of supercedure. The visible cell length suggests to me that is the case. They may well be able to draw some more cells. Have to play detective.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I will update friday.

Yes as per Crofter, the hive has a laying queen, plenty of eggs, just, for whatever reason known only to the bees, they have decided to replace her. If my graft attempt fails (i didn't have my glasses or a proper tool), the bees may or may not decide to build more cells. If my attempt at new genetics fails I'll probably requeen it next spring.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Checked back at that hive today, sadly, the cells did not work out the bees destroyed all 3 of them.

I also found a virgin queen in the hive which I had been unaware of last time, so I don't know if that is why the cells were removed, or if the bees would have removed them anyway.

I'm keeping a grafting tool in the truck now so next time there is an opportunity I'll give it another try and see what happens.

The fun of being semi retired, and having the time to play around with not very efficient, but interesting ideas :).
 

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Checked back at that hive today, sadly, the cells did not work out the bees destroyed all 3 of them.

I also found a virgin queen in the hive which I had been unaware of last time, so I don't know if that is why the cells were removed, or if the bees would have removed them anyway.

I'm keeping a grafting tool in the truck now so next time there is an opportunity I'll give it another try and see what happens.

The fun of being semi retired, and having the time to play around with not very efficient, but interesting ideas :).
+ 1 for the effort and the willingness to try.

maybe the second or third time it works.

I see a lot of cups in the Russians I have, along the bottom on the med frames, Box 3, sometime 3-5 on a frame, You have given me some ideas. At times I need like 3-5 queens, seems these "ready made" cups would be accepted as well as plastic and cost less. Also I do find some with larvae that could goin a starter hive.

GG
 

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Oldtimer, according to my old Queen Rearing by Snelgrove, he refers to an even older report by Herrod-Hemsall circa 1930 that says this does work. The built cell should be at only 2 or 3 days development and the transposed larva the same age. The devil is in the details.
 
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