Beesource Beekeeping Forums banner

181 - 200 of 232 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,332 Posts
I see you have been around since 2016 on these forums. Then you should know that there are no "enemies" or "agendas". Not atleast among the joe-blow-hobby-beekeeper like me. This has everything to do with beekeeping and nothing to do with anything else. You must have seen heated debates in treatment free and other threads when "beliefs", "individual experiences" peddled with no published data to backup, are always met with severe doubt and rightfully so. People like SP go to great lengths to document their experiences openly so people can see for what it is. Scientific claims like the OP making has to meet higher bar.

OP came back again with "only x days left, as new beekeeper the app told me what I would not otherwise known" . Without any data to backup, thats plain predatory marketing carefully crafted to entice new beekeepers.

I will apologize NOW if I missed the "data". What data ? Did I miss a field trial data and verification that said 1000 colonies tested with app against a well known verification method and app correctly identified Foul Brood in 60% of the cases ? Please point me to it.

I have no dog in this fight except to question the claims, especially if they are coming from a team of "professors" who should know better. I am not sure you understand severity of the unprofessional behavior put out by this project.

WHY do you think my app idea is a mockery but the OP app is legit even without any field trial data ? Are you saying looking at the entrance activity does not reasonably reveal the health (queen right, etc) of the hive ? Or are you saying my AI is somehow inferior to MontanaProf AI ? Or is it the name "Sap Sisters" more silly, comedic than "Bee Health Guru" ? Or it is that I didn't claim that bees from different regions "act" differently at the entrance, hence need a "variation" of my app for NewZealand ?
Daisy, why don’t you email Dr. Jerry Bromenshenk and ask him yourself all you questions regarding the data, research, etc. for this app. I suggest, nicely, that you join Bee-l and read the discussion about this app. Deb
 

·
Super Moderator
Aylett, VA 10-frame double deep Langstroth
Joined
·
5,785 Posts
Got an email saying the kickstarter project is funded and they were going to pop my 20 bucks. Total at the $20 level was 653/1000. Not bad. No idea on the other pledge levels.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
6,176 Posts
You sure found your political correctness when I said climate denier. ;-)
ks
Careful now....it's this....

Re: Smartphone app that listens to bees to tell you what health issues they have





 

·
Registered
Joined
·
38 Posts
I hope this app is plastered with "No Liability" warnings because it is just a matter of time before a newbie burns down half a dozen hives because app told him he has AFB. It would indeed be interesting to see some stats around false positive/negative by "issue type".

On a side note, and maybe it's just me, but why are we always trying to automate the very heart of beekeeping? Flow hives, humidity sensors, apps etc... Why? Unless you run a commercial operation it should take you less than a minute to pop the lid and figure out what's going on with the hive. I keep bees to get away from everyday tech and just work with my hands, but that's just me.
 

·
Super Moderator
Aylett, VA 10-frame double deep Langstroth
Joined
·
5,785 Posts
But isn't that the point of this BETA version? To help them fine tune the app to reduce the number of false positives? And false negatives for that matter. I am hands on too, but if I have a hive that I know is sick but I am not sure with what, maybe this app will be able to steer me in the right direction. Do we do away with GPS navigation because some idiot turned left into a lake because the GPS told him to do it? As a hands on guy, do you still use a paper map to find an address?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
907 Posts
Daisy, why don’t you email Dr. Jerry Bromenshenk and ask him yourself all you questions regarding the data, research, etc. for this app. I suggest, nicely, that you join Bee-l and read the discussion about this app. Deb
I read the discussion on forums that SP linked here. Hilarious. Any issues raised by some Peter was blamed on "production team". No data there either. Why do I have to email etc ? OP is the one making claims and OP (David) already made it clear that the results were "secret sauce". Thats code word for "We dont have any real field trails and we are just winging it".

Back to the topic of "Bees and sounds".
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
907 Posts
On a related topic, I dont remember seeing this before. Did anyone notice that kickstarter is updated to say the proceeds are going towards "a data analytics professional". Interesting.

"
Why do we need your help?
The money we raise from this Kickstarter will go to paying for a data analytics professional to help our team improve and update the Bee Health Guru AI algorithms to make the Bee Health Guru app better.
"
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
10,444 Posts
i don't have the expertise to develop such an app, but if i did i would consider kickstarter an effective contempory venue for launching such a product.

sometimes one has to look beyond the letter of the content and seek to understand the spirit.

as with all products, it's caveat emptor, buyer beware. i see no harm no foul here. data analytics professionals have to eat too.

the success rate for the latest/greatest beekeeping gadgets historically is pretty low. lets give this one a chance and see how it fares.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
907 Posts
Daisy are you saying that they are wasting money as you would do it for free.
When the project was first posted, the project stated that the money was going towards improving the app. Then its updated to show its going to A individual. Kickstarter projects don't typically raise money to PAY A INDIVIDUAL.

The success rate of latest (I would not call them greatest) gadgets is LOW because they are built on HALF-TRUTH. Take those "heating devices" for varroa mites for example. There is SOME truth to it, so someone figure a great way to scam new beekeepers by building and selling "Varroa Eliminator Heater" gadget, knowing very well that bees die trying to ventilate the hive with that darn thing. Are they lying ? No. Do they have some science to back it up, Sure. Does it actually work and field trials show proof ? NOPE. Desperate people buy it anyways, and scammers take advantage of it.

There is also science to backup the fact that rotating brood frames reduces of varroa reproduction. And someone is sure to come along and build a gadget and sell it to new beekeepers too.

Backing projects that refuse to SHOW field trials actually hurts real research and product development in the long run. While fancy, useless gadgets get all the attention and money, people and companies who pour money into things like registering oxalic acid etc go broke. If you have extra money burning hole, write a check and send it to those people.

On the topic of Bees and Sounds, I am working an App too. It can answer 6 QUESTIONS, including Foul Brood, Queenlessness etc. A friend, who is a new beekeeper already vouched for effectiveness of it as it told her what she did not know before. I cannot show any proof because its secret sause. Its a tool and anything is better than nothing for the beekeepers. It does use the newest blockchain technology to uncover Secrets Of Hive. I will soon start a kickstarter project to pay MYSELF. Hoping I will get enough people. Care to send some of that money my way ?

Looking forward to you all contributing and helping save honey bees from the perils of CCD.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,908 Posts
Daisy somehow you dont get it,

I am not interested in saving the bees from CCD, as a matter of fact I see more bees dying from PPB. I have paid a little money to see if anything can come of research which is trying to determine whether the honey bees themselves can enlighten the folks listening to the problems the hive might or might not be putting up with in that space in time. I certainly do not need this tool to help with my beekeeping at present, no that is not true as I am desperately trying to downsize my colony counts as I can no longer maintain the numbers I have to the standards I have been doing in the past.
Would you rather this was some government funded research where tax payer dollars are thrown down the drain as most of the funding ends up in administration costs anyhow, the only way we are going to know if there is anything in this little venture is to follow on the integrity of the researchers and let the chips fall where they may. If you consider the minute amount of money involved in this kickstarter thing I would be hard put to think that people of their station would risk their reputations on such a small sum of money, shucks I am sure many of the folks on this forum could have financed the amount asked for without batting an eyelid.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,644 Posts
Daisy somehow you dont get it,

I am not interested in saving the bees from CCD, as a matter of fact I see more bees dying from PPB. I have paid a little money to see if anything can come of research which is trying to determine whether the honey bees themselves can enlighten the folks listening to the problems the hive might or might not be putting up with in that space in time. I certainly do not need this tool to help with my beekeeping at present, no that is not true as I am desperately trying to downsize my colony counts as I can no longer maintain the numbers I have to the standards I have been doing in the past.
Would you rather this was some government funded research where tax payer dollars are thrown down the drain as most of the funding ends up in administration costs anyhow, the only way we are going to know if there is anything in this little venture is to follow on the integrity of the researchers and let the chips fall where they may. If you consider the minute amount of money involved in this kickstarter thing I would be hard put to think that people of their station would risk their reputations on such a small sum of money, shucks I am sure many of the folks on this forum could have financed the amount asked for without batting an eyelid.
:thumbsup:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,044 Posts
i am so up to my neck in bee yard work i really dont know how any of you guys and gals still have the time to be arguing about this.
The simplest resolution is if you are not interested in the app move on. If you are interested kick in the $20 and see if it works...if it doesnt ur out of pocket a measly $20.

Between work, family and the bee work i am flat out...get to check BS quickly and thats about it!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,332 Posts
I hope this app is plastered with "No Liability" warnings because it is just a matter of time before a newbie burns down half a dozen hives because app told him he has AFB. It would indeed be interesting to see some stats around false positive/negative by "issue type".

On a side note, and maybe it's just me, but why are we always trying to automate the very heart of beekeeping? Flow hives, humidity sensors, apps etc... Why? Unless you run a commercial operation it should take you less than a minute to pop the lid and figure out what's going on with the hive. I keep bees to get away from everyday tech and just work with my hands, but that's just me.
I believe Dr Bromenshenk wanted more experienced beekeepers to use this.
 

·
Super Moderator
Aylett, VA 10-frame double deep Langstroth
Joined
·
5,785 Posts
In the spirit of good natured humor, I ecourage folks to recall the weather rock. It had a simple 7 function algorithm that was almost 100% accurate.

https://images.app.goo.gl/v9NTnmM2PhGQDmdFA

Maybe it will make a comeback if I update it somehow and get kickstarter funding? Don't laugh. It wasn't all that long ago that people were selling rocks as "pets".
 
181 - 200 of 232 Posts
Top