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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This is a question for those of you to respond if you own or use a PRO VAP 110 ( not the jon vap product).

I finally bought switched from lugging a battery to the apiary to using the PRO VAP 110.

I really like it...it makes the whole ordeal go very fast.

The device is set to heat to 230 degrees, but it swings up to on average to 245 degrees.

When I introduce the dose of oxalic acid ( 2g), the temp drop varies from 207-222 then swings back up to 250 before settling back down to a baseline near 230.


Do you see this or any other issues? (It is, according to [email protected] a normal range.)

Another thing I see is inconsistent delivery into the hive. I have been using this for about a month now and twice the cap has blown off because the tube has somehow become blocked. I am going in right now to see if the molten OA is creating an issue at the orifice.


ANy observations or ideas?
 

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Sounds like your temp is too low.What do your directions say to use?

Googled sublimation temp of OA and got 315-372°F.
Could be liquifying and plugging your tube.
 

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Aylett, VA 10-frame double deep Langstroth
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The provap temp controller reads in degrees Celsius. The range you see is similar to what I see with mine, Mine actually has shown 254 at times. But it stabilizes at the 230 if left alone. Only had a cap blow off once in three years but have heard of it happening to others too. Not sure if the tube got plugged with propolis or I simply did not get the cap on correctly.
 

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sounds like your provap is working normal, does the same as mine does. have had caps multiple times, always my fault, if the tub hits a frame it will blow, I drill the whole between the two deeps and never have a problem, also clean the tube every once in a while, i do it once a day
 
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Mine operates the same way that you describe. I've been using mine on about 200+ hives for three years. I've never had a cap blow yet. I did have an o ring break so I ordered extras. Great service got here in two days.
 

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Johno's blows it's cork sometimes too. I think its because the tube is too cool and OA precipitates as it passes through plugging it up. It happens to me on cooler mornings and letting the thing heat a bit longer between treatments seems to work well for me, that way the tube stays hot enough to not cause problems.
Yeah, I know, ProVap only..., I'll find my own way out.
Lee
 

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I should have added that I wrapped mine on day one with muffler wrap using copper wire. That may keep it hotter longer, keeping the tube from clogging.
 

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I keep a small torch nearby and heat the stem every few hives to keep it clear. It can be plugged tight and poof the heat clears it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Thanks for the responses.
thanks for feedback on temperature concern.

I have warm way bases made from 2x10’s and the provap stem was not making it into the base’s cavity. The molten OA was plugging up the narrow 1/4” channel and would impede the vapor and other times block it enough to cause the pressure to build and pop the cap. ( i bought extra caps so i could just go down the line and treat)


i had to go in and auger the hole a little from the inside until i could feel the tube of the provap when inserted.... I will have to go in and do this to two other hives. This should fix my issues.

i think most people just go through the typical thickness of a hive box instead of what i do. Thanks for responding.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
sounds like your provap is working normal, does the same as mine does. have had caps multiple times, always my fault, if the tub hits a frame it will blow, I drill the whole between the two deeps and never have a problem, also clean the tube every once in a while, i do it once a day
I clean it after every use. Having that cap pop was not cool especially if there is molten OA still on it. The last treatment was the final straw before i went in to look closer at why this was happening. i had noticed a blug of molten OA on the tip.... once that molten OA cools it is like glue. i would reinsert the golf tee right after treatment and then four days later rhe tee would almost be impossible to remove. Then it occurred to me was was happening.

btw, the hole is below the base’s screen, and above the IPM slot. When i read the varroa drop 48 hrs post treatment i will usually find a blob of solidified OA on the IPM board.
 

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I beveled the end of my tube with 150 grit so it won't blow when it butts up against a frame.
 

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Aylett, VA 10-frame double deep Langstroth
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If you are pushing the OA vapors through a screen, most of the crystals are adhering to the screen and not making it into the hive. You might be better off vaping through a hole drilled a few inches up from the bottom on the narrow side of the hive body. Just pay attention to frame location.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
If you are pushing the OA vapors through a screen, most of the crystals are adhering. to the screen and not making it into the hive. You might be better off vaping through a hole drilled a few inches up from the bottom on the narrow side of the hive body. Just pay attention to frame location.
I was afraid someone would say something when I used the word screen without saying what it was. It is , industry standard 1/8” hardware cloth that they use for bottom boards and so on. I have used OAV a year before it was legal and had to go through the front entrance and with out the drawn out detail, one little golf tee hole where mine is, is infinitely easier. I should attach a picture of one hive setup that shows the base with the gold tee.....very convenient for me. The front entrance can be seen there. The long slat on the upper right hand side with dual wing-screws, below the screen is the opening for the IPM board and the hole for the golf tee is opposite the front entrance between the screen and level of IPM board, that wasnt drilled yet. You can just see where the iom board slides in and fits to seal off the base. You can also just see a cookie sheet filled with mineral oil for SHB. WHATEVER falls thru the screen and doesnt drown stays down there because everywhere else, there IS window screen That you cannot see For ventilation. Yellow Colorfulness Purple Soil Lavender found a random image of front of base and vent screen.
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What JW was referring to was not that the screen was too fine. The sublimated OA recrystalizes as soon as it cools below the sublimation temp. The wire of the screen acts as a heat sink so often you get build up on the screen which means that what is on the screen is not getting where you want it. Folks that use a pan type vaporizer under the IPM screen sometimes report that their vaporization was not effective not realizing why.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 · (Edited)
What JW was referring to was not that the screen was too fine. The sublimated OA recrystalizes as soon as it cools below the sublimation temp. The wire of the screen acts as a heat sink so often you get build up on the screen which means that what is on the screen is not getting where you want it. Folks that use a pan type vaporizer under the IPM screen sometimes report that their vaporization was not effective not realizing why.
I understand what you are saying, but it appears that JW was indeed concerned that the screen was too fine and trapping the majority of the gas produced and this simply is not what is occuring, at least not in my apiary. Besides, metal will absorb heat quicker than wood and surrounding wood frames, so I am not convinced condensation is a significant concern. I vaporized 2g and 1g of OA when i first got the unit to get a sense of the rate of sublimation. One thing I noticed was this. If the nozzle is not obstructed in any way, the rate of the emerging cloud of oxalic acid occurs almost at once, so any localized condensation within close proximity to the nozzle , imo, would not effect the dispersion of this gas to permeate hive being treated. 1g is almost enough with the PV110. More OA is not necessarily better and may contribute to the excess blobs of OA. I used 2g with the battery powered paddle type vaporizers and continue with the PV110.
 

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Sorry beebad, but I never even considered that there was something finer than 1/8" hardware cloth as your bottom screen. John Davis presented my thoughts exactly, the screen act as a heat sink and a significant amount of the OA solidifies on the wires. I vape through a hole in filler strip at the back of the bottom board. Even still, some of the OA ends up on the screen below. I also use a bit more, a rounded 1/2 tsp. which is approximately 3.5g. I have inserts in but make no attempt to seal up the openings. There are still crystals swirling around after several minutes. Been using exclusively OA now for three years.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 · (Edited)
Sorry beebad, but I never even considered that there was something finer than 1/8" hardware cloth as your bottom screen. John Davis presented my thoughts exactly, the screen act as a heat sink and a significant amount of the OA solidifies on the wires. I vape through a hole in filler strip at the back of the bottom board. Even still, some of the OA ends up on the screen below. I also use a bit more, a rounded 1/2 tsp. which is approximately 3.5g. I have inserts in but make no attempt to seal up the openings. There are still crystals swirling around after several minutes. Been using exclusively OA now for three years.
Window screen is much finer than the 1/8” wire mesh screen you see in the picture, if you are using more than the recommended 1g per brood box, you may see more OA deposits, which makes sense. When i partially dismantled the screen to gain access to auger the hole from the inside there was not a build up of condensed OA on the screen, except where the hole was on the inside of the base before I enlarged it. The hole is a few inches below the frames and the screen but above the IPM board-win win. The screen is not an issue over here but thanks for mentioning it. I am just following best bee keeping practices using OAV. It is all i have used as a final treatment of the year for 5-6 years. I would love to not seal the openings but I wont do that, i like 10 mins. All in all the PV110 is such a time saver. Thanks to everyone for your responses!
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 · (Edited)
I went in today to auger the holes for the PV110 from the inside of my base. I have performed many OAV treatments in the last few weeks and there was not a build up of OA at the screen directly above the PV110 orifice hole....I did see where the outlet/orifice was partially blocked and the OA built up right there, thus the reason to go in and enlarge the hole from the inside. There is, however, a light coating of what I assume is OA above the hole but after 4 treatments, this artifact is inconsequential.

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OA absorbs moisture from the air. The more moisture, the more the tip cools and builds clogs during sublimation. Slows down the process and makes things dangerous.

Dry your OA and things will go much better. I bake mine below the sublimation point for several hours. 185F seams to work in my oven. I then store it in smaller, sealed containers.
 
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