Beesource Beekeeping Forums banner

1 - 7 of 7 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I have a nuc that is queenless but didn't chose to make emergency queen cells when given the chance and I'm wondering why.

This year I tried grafting for the first time (mostly for the learning) and I made up 4 nucs to take the ripe queen cells. Three mated out nicely and one didn't. Four days after I saw eggs and small larvae in the 3 nucs with mated queens, but nothing in the problem nuc, I put in a frame with eggs and brood (no bees) from another hive into the queenless one. Seven days later, no queen cells, no queen cups, no eggs, and only large or capped brood on the frame from the donor hive that had clearly been eggs or larvae when pulled from the donor hive.

So, the nuc still doesn't have a laying queen but maybe didn't recognize it when the eggs from the other hive were introduced? Maybe the virgin was still around when I put in the eggs and by the time they gave up on her the donated brood was too old? Other thoughts?

It is getting late to try to raise another queen from an egg so I should probably just combine this with another hive, but I'm curious as to what is going on. I may put in another frame with eggs and check back in a few days just to give them one more chance.

More detailed timeline:
7/14 Graft
7/22 Set up nucs
7/23 Put queen cells in nucs
8/10 3 nucs have eggs and small larvae, 1 nuc doesn't and is more aggressive
8/14 Still no eggs or larvae in the problem nuc, still aggressive, put in one frame with eggs and young brood
8/21 No eggs, but pretty calm

Thanks in advance for any advice.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,333 Posts
Could you have had an unmuted virgin in there when graft was out in? That could explain what happened.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,868 Posts
How are the stores? Feeding sugar water and pollen sub ? Enough bees to cover eggs?
Very little experience raising queens, but their perception that it is ok to lay often differs from ours. Usually coverage and nutrition are reasons. So, agree with Cloverdale that you may have a Virgin or newly mated queen that isn't laying.
It wouldn't take long to shake and smoke them through a queen excluder to get to the bottom of it. J
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
Thanks for the suggestions. You are probably right, it likely was/is likely a virgin. Stores are great; packed with bees, feed on, and a frame with lots of bee bread.

This morning I found that one of my other hives had a bunch of capped emergency cells (two weeks after putting on Formic Pro; never previously had any problems with formic acid so might be unrelated) so I dropped a frame with some nice looking ones into the nuc just to see what will happen.

In a few weeks they will either have sorted it out one way or another or will get combined after I do the queen excluder shake test.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4 Posts
They've had the frame of eggs for about a week now. I was expecting to find a bunch of queen cells on it, but instead they've capped all the worker brood. WTF is going on here? I don't think I've got laying workers - as there are no eggs whatsoever in the colony. I'm lost... Should I just give up on them and combine this nuc with another hive? It's kind of interesting to experiment with as I've never seen this before. I've made lots of splits over the years and they always build out queen cells on the egg frames that I give them.





Kodi nox
 

·
Super Moderator
Aylett, VA 10-frame double deep Langstroth
Joined
·
5,785 Posts
Where are you located? who has had a frame of eggs, a new split, a "queenless" hive? Could an existing queen have already shut down for the season?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,759 Posts
I have a nuc that is queenless but didn't chose to make emergency queen cells when given the chance and I'm wondering why.

This year I tried grafting for the first time (mostly for the learning) and I made up 4 nucs to take the ripe queen cells. Three mated out nicely and one didn't. Four days after I saw eggs and small larvae in the 3 nucs with mated queens, but nothing in the problem nuc, I put in a frame with eggs and brood (no bees) from another hive into the queenless one. Seven days later, no queen cells, no queen cups, no eggs, and only large or capped brood on the frame from the donor hive that had clearly been eggs or larvae when pulled from the donor hive.

So, the nuc still doesn't have a laying queen but maybe didn't recognize it when the eggs from the other hive were introduced? Maybe the virgin was still around when I put in the eggs and by the time they gave up on her the donated brood was too old? Other thoughts?

It is getting late to try to raise another queen from an egg so I should probably just combine this with another hive, but I'm curious as to what is going on. I may put in another frame with eggs and check back in a few days just to give them one more chance.

More detailed timeline:
7/14 Graft
7/22 Set up nucs
7/23 Put queen cells in nucs
8/10 3 nucs have eggs and small larvae, 1 nuc doesn't and is more aggressive
8/14 Still no eggs or larvae in the problem nuc, still aggressive, put in one frame with eggs and young brood
8/21 No eggs, but pretty calm

Thanks in advance for any advice.
Shake the queen less split out on the lawn, add the frames to the Queen rite splits and call it 3 for 4, every split does not work out. Likely you have a small queen so the bees perceive they do not need one.

Or do a search find her and remove/destroy. then add frames with bees to the other splits or to the weakest one.

it happens , I go for 7 of 10 or 8 of 10 then just break down the failures and add to existing.
Try not to over think it. this one did not work ,,, next.

GG
 
1 - 7 of 7 Posts
Top