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Iam starting hives late and iam wondering? I really wanted foundationless frames but iam getting started really late and iam a tourist . Does having foundation help the bees be more efficient or help the comb process at all? iam only trying to establish the hive s for winter i want them to have an honest go at it, would trying this late with foundationless jeopardize there chances? Thanks and let me say thanks for this site it is so nice to have !
 

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Bees can pull out foundationless just as quickly as foundation; the main difference that I have seen is that using foundation ensures straighter building and less mess. I prefer foundationless but I like to alternate foundation with foundationless to help ;suggest; to the bees where and how to build. I've had too many instances where I ended up removing built comb that the bees connected across frames. Once they build out the foundationless then I remove the foundation and replace with foundationless so that over time I get online foundationless.

This is how I start hives and I've found it to work quite well.

Your choice really but if you go all foundationless you may need to manipulate the comb if they girls build out of the lines.
 

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I would go with alternating a frame with foundation and a frame without (starter strip or waxed bar) like kenargo says. They will probably build on the foundationless in preference. It would be worth knocking/cutting a few holes in the foundation sheets near the top to give the bees better access across frames.
 

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Alternating is the way to go; foundation, starter strip, foundation, starter...... It's amazing how quickly the girls will build out a foundationless frame, especially with a wax starter strip. Also, as I've recently learned, use wire bracing in any foundationless frame.
 

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Quite the opposite. I believe foundation gets in their way. :lookout: Let's look at how they build comb naturally: A festooning clump of bees hang from the top of the frame (or whatever surface they are starting on) and wax makers make wax and they chew and pull and pass the wax flakes to where it's needed and build BOTH sides of the comb at the same time. With foundation you have one clump of bees on one side and one clump on the other side and they can't work together. I believe this slows things down more than the little bit of midrib actually helped them by them not having to build that part.
 
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