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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
For the purpose of expansion, with no worry about honey production, is it ok at this time of year to make self queen rearing splits into nucs, and what are the chances thay will grow enough to uverwinter successfully? I was planning on splitting and just am not sure wether I should do a large split or a couple, 3 nucs. I would give

a frame of new eggs and larvae, w/nurses
a frame of capped brood w/nurses
2 frames of honey, pollen

Or I could just do a big split and introduce mated queen which is coming this week, or both?:scratch:
Thanks
 

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It'll work and build up.I do 2 frame splits this time of year.Actually I did my splits a week ago.Everyone does it different.1 frame of brood 1 frame of food and a queencell, that's how I roll and this time of the season hasn't disappointed me yet!Be confident with what you're doing and keep an eye on them you'll do well:applause:
 

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I live a little north of you in WV. I'd like to also create a nuc or three from future swarm cells. Any idea on when it's too late to begin?
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks slow drone. I made a bunch of 5 frame nuc boxes. might put a divider in a couple and try the 2 frame method. Thanks again.:thumbsup:
 

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Dwat191 for you probably middle of July.I have family up in Henna.My Uncle Jack was a big beekeeper up that way.Still have hives out back family want me to move out.Just haven't enough time to get up that way yet.How far are ya'll from Henna?
 

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I'm in MO. so adjust accordingly. My personal cut off for starting a nuc to raise their own queen and overwinter in a single deep is aug 1.
I've had queens born as late as mid sept but I had to give them some capped brood and honey to overwinter.

I've built lots of two frame nucs and let them raise their own queen. They all failed before fall.
My personal minimum is 4 frames of eggs/brood with lots of nurse bees. Using a five frame nuc I fill it full. These will usually build you a good queen.

When adding a queen cell two frames will work since the critical part is already done.
They will build up pretty slow with two frames because the queen can only lay as many eggs as she has bees to cover.

If you do the math, five frames of eggs, larva with some capped brood will make ten frames of bees by the time the queen is laying.
These hives have to be fed of course since they missed the spring flow but I have no problem overwintering them.
When spring hits these fall born, overwintered queens will explode. Their also not prone to swarm as long as she has room to lay.
This works for me. Your milage may vary.
Woody Roberts
 

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I find you get better fed queens if you take the hive you want to split and make it queenless. Ten days later you'll have a lot of well fed capped queen cells and you can make as many splits as you like. Then you can either reintroduce the queen or leave her in the nuc you put her in to make them queenless...
 

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If we are going to be introducing laying queens into nucs, we purposely make our splits a little weaker initially for better queen acceptance. Then once she is laying, we go back and boost them significantly with more bees and brood.
 

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I find you get better fed queens if you take the hive you want to split and make it queenless. Ten days later you'll have a lot of well fed capped queen cells and you can make as many splits as you like. Then you can either reintroduce the queen or leave her in the nuc you put her in to make them queenless...
I second what Michael said. I used to make up super nucs and have them make their own queen, but as Mr. Bush says you'll get better fed queens by taking the monster hive you were going to take the nucs off of and just splitting off the current queen and leaving most of the strength with the parent colony and letting them make queen cells. You could then Notch (OTS) to improve your chances of multiple queens in different locations. I think too many people try to have their cake and eat it too. I want more bees and lots of honey. Well ok, but you better have 2 hives one to make splits and one to make honey :D .
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I second what Michael said. I used to make up super nucs and have them make their own queen, but as Mr. Bush says you'll get better fed queens by taking the monster hive you were going to take the nucs off of and just splitting off the current queen and leaving most of the strength with the parent colony and letting them make queen cells. You could then Notch (OTS) to improve your chances of multiple queens in different locations. I think too many people try to have their cake and eat it too. I want more bees and lots of honey. Well ok, but you better have 2 hives one to make splits and one to make honey :D .
Interesting, I am now in a quandry, lol, new beeks never find themselves there do they?:lpf:
My plan when I did the splits was actually to emply the OTS method on the nucs. I think I can recognize 36hr or younger, Then just let them rear their own. But the Idea of letting them rear multiple strong cells in the Parent hive as Michael suggested seems a good bet, as long as I can successfully harvest the cells for placement, assuming they are not on multiple frames and in that case i can just incorporate accordingly. Well, sometimes great advice makes you toss and turn. Thanks Fellas. G:scratch:
 

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Interesting, I am now in a quandry, lol, new beeks never find themselves there do they?:lpf:
My plan when I did the splits was actually to emply the OTS method on the nucs. I think I can recognize 36hr or younger, Then just let them rear their own. But the Idea of letting them rear multiple strong cells in the Parent hive as Michael suggested seems a good bet, as long as I can successfully harvest the cells for placement, assuming they are not on multiple frames and in that case i can just incorporate accordingly. Well, sometimes great advice makes you toss and turn. Thanks Fellas. G:scratch:
What kind of foundation do you use? If it's foundationless, regular wax foundation, no problem just wait till day 14 and cut out the cells you want and place them in your splits. If it's wired wax, hope they're not on a wire(of course they always are the little devils do it in purpose), and cut out. Or if it's on a wire or you use plastic foundation then you do splits by frame. But wait when is day 14? It's not 14 days after you remove mom. It's 9 or 10 days after because they use a 4 day old larva(3 days as egg). How do I keep track of all this? I'm partial to www.thebeeyard.org there is a queen calender generator. Your grafting day is the day your removed mom.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
What kind of foundation do you use? If it's foundationless, regular wax foundation, no problem just wait till day 14 and cut out the cells you want and place them in your splits. If it's wired wax, hope they're not on a wire(of course they always are the little devils do it in purpose), and cut out. Or if it's on a wire or you use plastic foundation then you do splits by frame. But wait when is day 14? It's not 14 days after you remove mom. It's 9 or 10 days after because they use a 4 day old larva(3 days as egg). How do I keep track of all this? I'm partial to www.thebeeyard.org there is a queen calender generator. Your grafting day is the day your removed mom.
Thanks alot, things are becoming clearer all the time. Anyway, Tommorrow the weather is supposed to be perfect, I will be doing my splits tommorrow. I will keep you all posted. Thanks to all for the great advice. G:thumbsup:
 
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