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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
After finding out that non temperate region propolis is useless, especially medicinally, I need some raw TF propolis from north of Georgia. A big glob. It can have legs, parts, etc in it. Doesn't matter. Please let me know if you can help me out and what it will cost me. :)
 

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What have you found out?
is it possible to point me to the sources of this information?
thanks, clyderoad
 

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After finding out that non temperate region propolis is useless, especially medicinally, I need some raw TF propolis from north of Georgia. A big glob. It can have legs, parts, etc in it. Doesn't matter. Please let me know if you can help me out and what it will cost me. :)
I'm not in your area but I have some. If interested PM me.
 

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I tend to be rather skeptical of claims that one natural product or species is medicinal, while another nearly identical product or species (of the same genus!) is not.

Yes, propolis will come from different plant origins, depending on the climates you live in. Poplar is the dominant source in temperate climates, I believe. It's therefore reasonable to assume that the properties of propolis gathered elsewhere, from different "ingredients" (sources), may differ from those of temperate-climate propolis. However, I do not deem it reasonable to assume that it is "useless". Bees collect propolis for a reason, and that isn't to mend our ills. If that propolis was useless, then they simply wouldn't collect it. Why bother? A bee collecting propolis is a bee not collecting nectar or pollen. Natural and artificial selection would both have driven bees from non-temperate climates to stop collecting propolis if it had no value.
 

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Dominic:
I tend to be rather skeptical of claims by those who are rather skeptical of other peoples comments without letting them explain or cite their sources of information.

for the heck of it, do you care to back up your claims?
 

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Dominic:
I tend to be rather skeptical of claims by those who are rather skeptical of other peoples comments without letting them explain or cite their sources of information.

for the heck of it, do you care to back up your claims?
Care to name which "claim" of mine you want me to "back up"?
 

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these:

Poplar is the dominant source in temperate climates, I believe. It's therefore reasonable to assume that the properties of propolis gathered elsewhere, from different "ingredients" (sources), may differ from those of temperate-climate propolis. However, I do not deem it reasonable to assume that it is "useless". Bees collect propolis for a reason, and that isn't to mend our ills. If that propolis was useless, then they simply wouldn't collect it. Why bother? A bee collecting propolis is a bee not collecting nectar or pollen. Natural and artificial selection would both have driven bees from non-temperate climates to stop collecting propolis if it had no value.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I firstI heard it at our beek meeting from a couple of members. I really didn't believe it. Then I heard there was a scientific group that had come through the area (don't know names) taking propolis samples from any and every hive they could find all over the US (and possibly the world). They analyzed them and found temperate propolis medicinally most effective. All this info was hearsay without real names until we had a lecture by Dr. Vetaley Stashenko that confirmed this info. I cannot remember the names of the actual researchers. They said specifically Florida propolis had all kinds of strange, useless things in it, like road tar. I have not read the study. This is all I know about it other than I did ask Dr. Stashenko where to get propolis and he said he gets it "north of Georgia."
 

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these:

Poplar is the dominant source in temperate climates, I believe. It's therefore reasonable to assume that the properties of propolis gathered elsewhere, from different "ingredients" (sources), may differ from those of temperate-climate propolis. However, I do not deem it reasonable to assume that it is "useless". Bees collect propolis for a reason, and that isn't to mend our ills. If that propolis was useless, then they simply wouldn't collect it. Why bother? A bee collecting propolis is a bee not collecting nectar or pollen. Natural and artificial selection would both have driven bees from non-temperate climates to stop collecting propolis if it had no value.
That's basically my whole message. Propolis is transported on the bee's pollen baskets: do you need me to cite a study stating that the pollen basket cannot be used simultaneously to transport propolis and pollen? Much of that passage also includes a series of deductions. Should I cite Darwin in order to be able to suggest that natural evolution will tend to favor behaviors that increase fitness over behaviors that reduce it?

If it's that propolis gathered from different climates have different compositions, then that's from an article titled "Chemical characteristics of poplar type propolis of different geographic origin" (http://www.apidologie.org/articles/apido/abs/2007/03/m6089/m6089.html):
The use of propolis in folk medicine contin-
ues to increase (Castaldo and Capasso, 2002)
as a constituent of “bio-cosmetics”, “health
foods” and for numerous other purposes
(Wollenweber and Buchmann, 1997; Banskota
et al., 2001). However, chemical studies have
revealed chemical variability among propolis
samples and the existence of different chemi-
cal types of propolis according to plant source
(Bankova, 2005b). In temperate zones all over
the world, poplarbud exudates(mainly of
Pop-ulus ***** L.) have been shown to be the
main source of bee collected resin. Undoubt-
edly, poplar type propolis is the most stud-
ied and the best known type of propolis, both
from chemical and pharmacological point of
view. The chemical constituents responsible
for its beneficial biological activities, and es-
pecially for its antimicrobial and antioxidant
properties, are well documented: flavonoids
(including flavones, flavonols, flavanones and
dihydroflavonols) and other phenolics (mainly
substituted cinnamic acids and their esters)
(Banskota et al., 2001).
And in the conclusion:

The results obtained in this study show that the
chosen parameters are meaningful for the evalua-
tion of poplar propolis quality. It is important to re-
member however, that other types of propolis have
different chemical compositions (Bankova, 2005a).
For this reason, all the above discussed conclusions
and criteria are valid for poplar propolis only, and
should by no means be applied to other propolis
types, such as Brazilian green propolis or Cuban
and Brazilian red propolis.
This article refers to other articles where you can read more about the brazilian green propolis and the red propolis. I do not have access to those right now, however.

As for the uses of propolis for the bees, it's described in a number of articles, notable "Increased brood viability and longer lifespan of honeybees selected for propolis production", where the title explains pretty clearly what the results of their experiment was.

Also, I'd point out that the article I cited also stated differences between different samples of the same climates. Indeed, it seems to say that mountain/non-mountain played a bigger role in poplar propolis divergences than climate of origin did. All the literature I come across also describes the propolis types in the way this article did. They don't say "temperate climate propolis". Indeed, "some significant differences (P < 0.05) were found but they did not follow any distinct geographic pattern", they go on to say as they compared samples from different countries.

Therefore, to go on and claim that "temperate-climate" propolis is the only good propolis sounds dubious to me, much as "north of Georgia" as a criteria of selection for what is suddenly not "useless" anymore. What articles did Dr. Vetaley Stashenko cite to support his claims? Did he also suggest that people in temperate climates don't use tar for their roads, too? What's he a doctor of, anyways? Almost all of the pages I find about him are invalid urls. No publication in credible reviews as far as I can tell. However, his name also kicks up the article "Brazilian Propolis: A Promising Adjunct to Dental Care, Cancer Treatment, Vaccines", which's text I can't find, but which also goes to disprove that only "temperate propolis" is medicinally useful.

Maybe some companies will only buy a very specific kind of poplar propolis from temperate regions. Maybe, for their own ends, it will be superior (or so they think). That doesn't make other kinds of propolis "useless".
 

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We are TF and i have half a 44 oz cup with unprocessed propolis in it, it smells like heaven. It's maybe 1-2 lbs... The sticks and rocks in would be free of charge of course :D
 

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What is say a lb worth. I have some but never looked into selling it.
 

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I wholesale mine, grade 'A' gets about $9 a pound, grade (lowest) gets $4 I think was the quote to me. If you add up the price that they sell it for on the net it comes to about $100/lb but those people are selling it to the general public and that's some liability I don't necessarily want.
 

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I wholesale mine, grade 'A' gets about $9 a pound, grade (lowest) gets $4 I think was the quote to me. If you add up the price that they sell it for on the net it comes to about $100/lb but those people are selling it to the general public and that's some liability I don't necessarily want.
Wow!!!! A markup from $9 to $100 is a great profit for someone.
 

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http://www.beeculture.com/storycms/index.cfm?cat=Story&recordID=501

http://www.valuefood.info/food/anim...oney/health-benefits-of-propolis-or-bee-glue/

"Earliest scientific studies on antibacterial property of Propolis are dated 1940. Propolis was found to have strong acitivity against Streptococcus, typhoid causing bacteria and other microbes. A study published in American Bee Journal reveals that Propolis was effective over 25 bacteria out of 39 tested in vitro.

Honey bee Propolis is also anti fungal and anti viral in nature. It finds use in treatment of various infections like urinary tract, bronchitis, gastritis, intestinal infections, skin disease, lung diseases, liver infections, conjunctivitis and others."
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Here is Dr. Vetaley Stashenko video of his talk he gave our bee club - they just posted it. He is also a speaker at the Florida State Beekeeper's meeting in October 2014 in West Palm Beach. BTW, I asked him about the Brazilian propolis being good, thinking it was not temperate. He said it was temperate as it came from altitude, not from the rain forrest.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qvk9av6ocvY#t=12
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Top frames? Ah, what? TF is treatment free. Somebody needs to take a dose of TF honey...... :)
 

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I see, treatment free, well then, insist that the propolis comes only from certified organic trees and is collected only by free range bees.
 
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