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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'd like to know what the warmest temperature you would still consider a pail of honey to be raw.

I came across this:

"Most experts would say that the honey will not lose any of its benefits and can still be considered raw if it is maintained through production and storage at 118 degrees F or lower."
 

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My personal opinion is that it can be no warmer than hive temperature, which is around 95 degrees. Even better is if nothing is done to it.

Lance
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
How hot does it get in honey houses in Texas and the Southwest?

Or in a storage shed in the South?
 

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Well anything above 115 degrees would destroy the antioxidants & vitamins. Also they say that over heated honey looses much of its natural aroma and flavor in the honey!
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
Some states, like Florida, are defining honey and how it can be processed to eliminate crap like that. Keep your cooked sugar syrup, because it is not honey after that, up North please!
Stifle yourself Edith!

There was no mention of cooking or heating.

How hot do honey supers get sitting on a truck in the State of Florida?
 

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honey supers certainly get to 120F in the desert southwest areas and still produce raw honey. Heck... even here we get to 113-115 every now and then and there ain't any bees left in the hive. They are all hanging off the front porch.

And everyone loves my raw honey !!
 

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Born and raised in southern Arizona and as a country/farm boy I have seen and worked in 115-120 deg. and would think that once the bees are removed from a supper it will heat up real quick.However temps like that are most common mid June thru late Aug. after spring harvest and before fall harvest, but I did not have bees down there so I could be wrong. Jim
 

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In my opinion, the only raw honey is that in the comb. If it is sold any other way, it has been "processed" some way or another. When a customer asks us if our honey is raw, we describe how we process it and let them decide.

Candlaman
 

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If the "pail of honey" was first extracted in a timely manner, and then allowed to reach 118 F, or heated to 118 F, then most definitely "NO". If the honey was removed from the bees at 95 F, but through lack of diligence, or intentional heating before or during extracting, I still vote "NO". If for some reason the bees could not hold the temperature to 95 F due to limited resources, I would have to vote "Yes", it is as the bees left it. My point here is that you have to look at intent. Did the beekeeper provide reasonable care in handling the honey once it had left the possession of the bees?

Roland
 

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Right on Candalman. On the other hand, the term "raw" as pertaining to honey is a convention not a truley altered or maintained state like raw meat orraw vegetables. For the most part unless the honey is heated to a temperature that burns the sugars in honey, very little is changed.
 

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Amen to Roland and Candlaman. Honey has enzymes and proteins that break down at higher temps leaving just sugar. As for the what ifs, supers were in a black steel building in direct sun, propane tank blew up next door, left on the truck in the sun, etc. WAG and SWAG temperature guesses truly identify the A generating them. I would never sell honey in comb over 120. That is what it tastes like out of the capping melter. Even the bees do not like that junk.
 

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I think the problem is with the word 'raw'. Does raw mean 'not cooked'? If we are discussing 'not cooked' then what does cooking mean? With meat, 120F is not cooking. The goal of cooking is usually to kill unwanted organisms. Until someone can tell me specifically what is destroyed by limited exposure to 120F v.s. two months of summer heat in the hive, I would just say the honey is raw because it has not been cooked. I agree that comb honey is the least processed but that really doesn't address the concerns of the customer. I, for one, would be really surprised if limited exposure to 120F had any significant nutritional impact. Which is worse, two months of 95F daytime temperatures, or a few hours at 120F?
In Nevada, the honey has a very low moisture content and 100F is about the minimum for pumping. I try and stay around 100F but barrels of crystalized honey may take a little more persuasion. So, which is better, to let a barrel crystalize and heat it later or to keep it around 80F-90F for months?
 

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It is my understanding that enzymes start to break down at 125 degrees. I started a similar thread some time back asking how warm honey could be heated and still be considered raw. I want to be able to call my honey raw, but it's a lot easier to bottle it at 100 than it is to bottle at 70.

At the time, 125 degrees seemed to be the consensus cutoff temperature between raw and processed.
 

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Honey has enzymes and proteins that break down at higher temps leaving just sugar.
Huh? When have you evr seen that? Just sugar? What do you think honey is? Technically not "Sugar", but it is made up of sugars.

I have a RAW Honey Label. It means that it was never artificially heated, not even in a hot room. I make no other claims about it, other than being RAW.

I also have had a Label for my Comb Honey that reads "Truely Raw Honey". I don't know how anyone can argue w/ that.

As to the OP, if you want to call it Raw, go ahead. What customer is going to challenge you on it? I guess if some customer asks you how warm you warmed it you may have to tell them. Otherwise, what's the difference.

Off Topic, sorta. I offered a taste of Comb Honey to a woman yesterday and she said that she couldn't eat it because she is pregnant and her doctor told her not to eat honey. What's that all about? She didn't know why.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
I have a RAW Honey Label. It means that it was never artificially heated, not even in a hot room. I make no other claims about it, other than being RAW.
What size strainer are you able to use for that honey?
 

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Off Topic, sorta. I offered a taste of Comb Honey to a woman yesterday and she said that she couldn't eat it because she is pregnant and her doctor told her not to eat honey. What's that all about? She didn't know why.

Children under the age of 1 are not supposed to eat honey due to a potential for botulism. That's why we are supposed to put labels to that effect on the honey.

Lance
 
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