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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Check it out:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v202/Shallotman/DSC00550.jpg

Well actually, I most certainly DO treat, of course, but here is a view from the entrance of a swarm that I hived and did not treat all year. It was all off by its self and I just passed it over in late July early August when fall treatments began.

Thursday at about 3:00pm I trickled 5ml of heavy syrup that I had lowered the PH somewhat between each frame and the picture is of the mext morning.

Wouldn't you just be proud to have a colony in this condition?
Then you could boast, "I Don't Treat! I Don't Treat!!!"

Here is the situation this morning after cleaning the landing board the night before:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v202/Shallotman/DSC00553.jpg

I've seen all I need to see.

I Treat! I Treat!!! :p
 

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Not sure if the thumbs down is about the swarm, or those who do not treat, or are you giving yourself the thumbs down? :s

Your asking who would be proud to have a hive like this, so apparently they could claim they do not treat. :s

I do not treat. Of course, I do not expect the same results and expectations from swarms I caught. I evaluate them, and if they are not up to par, they get requeened. Perhaps you should consider requeening with better stock, instead of just applying treatments to slap a band-aid on the problem. Obviously, those bees are good at breeding mites. Some of the best I've seen in a awhile. ;) So what will change after the treatment if you keep the same queen and genetics? And how will that equate into production or health come spring?

And for those who would like to stop on by this coming year for the picnic, a class, or anything else, my operation is open for all to see. Last unannounced state inspection in mid-September found a high mite count of TWO! No treatments here.
 

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harry vanderpool writes:
Thursday at about 3:00pm I trickled 5ml of heavy syrup that I had lowered the PH somewhat

tecumseh ask:
well harry as you likely know I ain't a purist when it come to the treatment/non treatment question. I would also say... one need to recognize within themselves where the line is drawn in regards to treatment (for example a pest strip inside a hive is a real no go for myself) and to kind of know why you are treating. which is to directly suggest that many random treatments likely are counter productive (and any and all treatments cost something... typically more than most folks might think via casual observation).

so what is the lowered ph all about? that is a new one on me.
 

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Seems since I was the only one that has commented, and your post follows mine, I'll feel somewhat obligated to respond.

So whats so unique about someone catching a swarm or unknown origins and having an issue with mites. I actually see this sort of stuff all the time. Seems swarms and cutouts in particular are seen to have problems with SHB.

I guess controlling my genetics, requeening swarms with bad queens with better one's, using equipment options and management techniques, could be seen by some as "treatments". But that to me is splitting hairs. Oh well.

Anyone reading [edit by mod] about those not treating should consider spending more time with others who do not "treat". ( "treat" - A sometimes self defined term by some, which is manipulated, to then be used to attack others) Here is a group and a meeting coming up... and may I say, I think they know which end of a hivetool is used for what.

http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?t=221705
 

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...i do wonder if those who like to shout that they treat when posting here on beesource are as willing to make these claims to their customers....or is it a case of giving different messages to different audiences?

do you think that your own customers would rather buy honey from treated bees or untreated? do your customers assume that nothing is in the hive but wood and bees? (i expect most of them do). would you be happy to share msds information of the substances you use with your customers?

...and by customers, i mean the consumers (not wholesalers/resellers)...people that feed your honey to their children.

deknow (who doesn't treat....and who can open a beer bottle with either end of a hive tool)
 

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!!! won't work for me!!! is a copout. if you can't explain it, you're not qualified to attack it!
:)
i think you're part way there. just keep setting a few colonies aside and leave them to make or break on their own. in time some will make it off the welfare system. that will be the stock to expand from.
 

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Thia is not unlike discussions over who to vote for, "pointless"

Fortunalty the decision to treat or not to treat isn't going to affect anyone but the end user. If treating is allowed to affect the public by it's misuse, shame on you! But otherwise who cares?!
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Look out for your fellow beekeepers!

Fortunalty the decision to treat or not to treat isn't going to affect anyone but the end user. But otherwise who cares?!
I have to respectfully disagree with you there, Bizzybee.
We POUND it into our beeschool students:
"If you don't care enough to maintain your colony health, please do it for the rest of us.
Especially if you are within a two mile radius of our hives.
Sick and abandoned hives can be the basis for localized spread of all kinds of pests and diseases.
When your hives crash as they will without effective pest and disease management, our hives will not only rob them of their SPORES, but also their SPORES, mites, bacteria etc...."

The fine beekeepers that I pollinate with trust setting their hives alongside mine. I have the same fine regard for their colony health maintenance program (s).
If anyone of us were to jump on the "I don't treat" bandwagon, they would find themselves in another line of work.
 

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deknow writes:
...i do wonder if those who like to shout that they treat when posting here on beesource are as willing to make these claims to their customers....or is it a case of giving different messages to different audiences?
tecumeh:
good question.

then deknow writes:
do you think that your own customers would rather buy honey from treated bees or untreated? do your customers assume that nothing is in the hive but wood and bees? (i expect most of them do). would you be happy to share msds information of the substances you use with your customers?
teumseh:
untreated for sure... but what does that really mean? which was really my initial concern. some of my customers are well aware of the problems. for those that have the time and are concerned, I have the time to explain exactly how I treat my bees.

and then deknow writes:
...and by customers, i mean the consumers (not wholesalers/resellers)...people that feed your honey to their children.
tecumseh:
I would assume the further the producer is from the consumer the easier it is to be insulated from questions of contamination.

and finally deknow writes:
deknow (who doesn't treat....and who can open a beer bottle with either end of a hive tool)
tecumseh:
your also an excellent person deknow and by the above description quite talented.

mr jarrett writes:
Well Harry, this is are your fault ! lol

tecumseh:
yea harry it all your fault!

then iddee writes:
Cabin fever is incurable and it is just beginning to flare up again.

tecumseh:
as usual iddee is quite correct.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Hey Keith!

Well Harry, this is are your fault ! lol :)
Hey! How did your year shape up?
We did VERY well this year but the long, cold spring was tough.
Nice to have a couple of months to work on trucks, build equipment, do some welding.
SPEAKING OF WELDING, I .... oops! am I off topic?

Sorry!

I wouldn't want to interrupt the "I don't Treat Choir"

Everybody ready? a ONE,and a TWO, and a........
 
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