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Discussion Starter #1
I harvested 85 pounds from my two hives five weeks ago. When I took the honey I installed Apivar strips. I went in to remover them yesterday and between the two hives I have about 14 additional frames full of honey in the honey supers. I am running two deeps with a honey super on top. Both hives already have one completely full deep above the brood chamber. Goldenrod is about to pop any day now.

What's the rule about harvesting honey with Apivar in place? What if I wanted to try to get some goldenrod honey? Should I just use it feed back to a weaker hive?

Alan
 

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I thought you are to remove the supers before using Apivar. At least thatwhat I do after following instructions. I would not use it for human consumption.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Yep, my bad, I should have removed the honey supers, but I didn't what's the best plan now?
 

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Since Apivar does not seem to significantly affect the mortality of the bees, as they will eat the preserved honey that is in your deeps, you might consider feeding it back or leaving the supers on for the winter.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I have one very weak hive. They have hardly any stores. I was going to start feeding them heavily. What about the idea of putting all 14 frames of this new honey on that hive for winter and putting new supers on my strong two hives for any potential Fall flow?
 

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I have one very weak hive. They have hardly any stores. I was going to start feeding them heavily. What about the idea of putting all 14 frames of this new honey on that hive for winter and putting new supers on my strong two hives for any potential Fall flow?
Check. I think the strips have to be out of the hives for two weeks before putting the supers on the other colonies.
 

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First, you should determine why you have a week hive. Assuming it will survive you could use the honey for it. I do it somewhat differently by removing supers, treating for approximately 42 days or so, and then not replacing any supers as I will use them next year. If there is a good goldenrod flow the bees return it to their deeps for the winter and not in supers. I do not want Goldenrod honey but others do. The contamination even though slight may remain in your deeps for a long time and I would hesitate to replace the supers this soon, But I do not know how long it has been since you removed the Apivar strips.
I have one very weak hive. They have hardly any stores. I was going to start feeding them heavily. What about the idea of putting all 14 frames of this new honey on that hive for winter and putting new supers on my strong two hives for any potential Fall flow?
 

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I have one very weak hive. They have hardly any stores. I was going to start feeding them heavily. What about the idea of putting all 14 frames of this new honey on that hive for winter and putting new supers on my strong two hives for any potential Fall flow?
I think that is an excellent plan. I would not harvest the honey. I rob them blind in early July. I leave them nothing. They generally have enough left in the tail end of the nectar flow to pack out another super. Then goldenrod hits here about September. If it is a bad nectar year, I have to feed them.

I checked about half of them yesterday and I am positive I could harvest another 800 pounds. But I put Apivar strips in in mid-July, so I will not.

Instead, I am going to have to buy another 500 pounds from a local beekeeper to fill my customers' needs. I will not make any money on that, but I will keep my customers happy with local honey from a beekeeper I know and trust (and mentored). I am willing to pay $1,500 before I would be willing to harvest honey exposed to Apivar.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thank you folks. Obviously safety is my primary concern for everyone, bees included. I won't harvest. I will pull the supers this afternoon and put them on my weak hive next week. I will put some new honey supers on my two strong colonies for any Fall flow.

My one week hive was a swarm I caught two months ago that went queenless. I requeened, they rejected her. I added frames of eggs, larva and brood twice. I didn't see any queen cells, and activity at the entrance had fallen to almost nil. I honestly had given up on them. Yesterday I was expecting to find a complete dead out. Instead, wonder of wonders I found bees, and eggs, larva and worker brood. There was not a lot, but its queenright. The bee population is not strong, and there's very limited stores since they missed most of the main flow, but it's very cool, and I will do my best to help them survive. So they will get the 14 frames as a good head start.
 

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Alan;
Larry over in Princeton-I'm installing Formic Pro today and would recommend it for uses here at this time as a stop gap between the current goldenrod bloom/flow and the end of the season OAV treatment. Formic Pro is an organic, approved for use with supers on and should be 90% affective. There was an article in NJ Beek Newsletter this month pretty much recommending that plan for our area. The Goldenrod and Aster should last until Mid October here and the 14 day double strip method should get you through until an OAV. My current plan is to do that exactly but pull the supers at the end of September then a 4 x 5 day OAV treatment and feed heavily with a full top feeder until cold. I'll follow up with a broodless OAV shot after Thanksgiving which I'm hoping will get me through the winter and then an Apivar and feed again as soon as it' safe to open the hives (hopefully we made it through the winter) until flow
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Thanks Larry for the local info! I definitely appreciate it. It's been a good year, lots of rain, clover blooming nearly all Summer!

When I first started, my bee supplier who has his yard literally a few miles from my farm suggested Apivar mid summer after harvest and then Formic Pro after Fall harvest. I didn't question him. This was the first year I actually had a harvest, so I was thrown off a bit in all the excitement. I still have so much to learn, but darned if it isn't fun.
 

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I would not put all that honey into a weak hive as there are probably not enough bees to defend it. Consider marking the frames and then moving only 2 or 3 to the weak hive and distribute the rest as needed to your other hives. Make sure that the marked frames are completely empty before using them again in supers next year. Or once empty, render the wax for candles and let the bees draw fresh comb in the frames.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Thanks JW. I have two strong hives that do not need any stores. So based on your (very helpful) info I will add just a few frames of the tainted honey to the weak hive for now and store the others in the freezer for now to feed back later in the season. Gotcha on the wax. I will mark the frames and replace with new foundation in the Spring. I didn't even think of robbing or about the wax. Always learning.
 

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I am perhaps more cautious as I would not use those frames again for honey.The insecticide is also in the wax that you render and it may impact the its use for certain wax products.
 

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6. Is there any risk of accumulation of residues due to the duration of the treatment?
Apivar is the result of a unique technology allowing the continuous liberation of a little dose of the amitraz for a long duration. To cover many varroa mite life cycles, it is important to leave the strips unmoved for several weeks. This long-acting treatment does not lead to an accumulation of residues. Amitraz is very sensitive to hydrolysis which means that it is very quickly destroyed after liberation. Many studies have shown that there is no more residue after 24h in wax and honey.
Amitraz is destroyed as the treatment goes along.

Nevertheless, it is important to remove the strips at the end of the treatment to avoid the continuous liberation of amitraz at very low dosage, too weak to be effective but probably high enough to select resistances. Forgetting the strips in the beehive for all of the wintering period could probably be responsible for the hypothetic emergence of resistance.
 

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Thanks Larry for the local info! I definitely appreciate it. It's been a good year, lots of rain, clover blooming nearly all Summer!

When I first started, my bee supplier who has his yard literally a few miles from my farm suggested Apivar mid summer after harvest and then Formic Pro after Fall harvest. I didn't question him. .
Just the opposite, formic pro first and apivar after fall harvest would, IMO be a better way to do it.
 

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8 - PETTIS J (2013). Amitraz residue transfer into honey from Apis mellifera hives treated with Apivar®, USDA-ARS, Beltsville, MD USA – 2013. This is a footnote from the APVAR instructions.

QUOTE=ifixoldhouses;1833793]6. Is there any risk of accumulation of residues due to the duration of the treatment?
Apivar is the result of a unique technology allowing the continuous liberation of a little dose of the amitraz for a long duration. To cover many varroa mite life cycles, it is important to leave the strips unmoved for several weeks. This long-acting treatment does not lead to an accumulation of residues. Amitraz is very sensitive to hydrolysis which means that it is very quickly destroyed after liberation. Many studies have shown that there is no more residue after 24h in wax and honey.
Amitraz is destroyed as the treatment goes along.

Nevertheless, it is important to remove the strips at the end of the treatment to avoid the continuous liberation of amitraz at very low dosage, too weak to be effective but probably high enough to select resistances. Forgetting the strips in the beehive for all of the wintering period could probably be responsible for the hypothetic emergence of resistance.[/QUOTE]
 

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As I had discussed with Alan, who's about 10 miles from me, my plan after the FA treatment I'm doing now (10 day double pad), I plan on doing a 4 treatment every 5 days starting in late September/early October with OAV and then a final one shot OAV after Thanksgiving. In this area, we normally don't see our first frost until Mid November (verified that on NOAA Weather website). I figure I'll pull any honey supers just prior to the OAV, possibly harvest some, save the others for emergencies as my supplies as a new Beek are limited. I'd like to recover as much honey comb as possible for next years spring flows. As far as the Apivar, I'll reserve that until late winter and run out that 60 days in March and April as the hives build up and prior to placing honey supers
 

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I meant it in the regard that it won't build up in the comb as someone earlier suggested.
 
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