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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Been awhile since we talked about these. Is there currently a source for Dadant depth frames 11.25"? Wanting 1.5" spacing. I hate making frames with a passion. If not a will prepare to make frames. But am looking for a US source for "distance retainers" as i'll pass on Hoffman type frames. Lemme know what you know.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Good luck on freight fees.
Only if I was very desperate. Waiting on Humble Abodes to respond no sense heading to Europe if it can be gotten here. Queen excluders for 12 fr. Dadant is a bigger issue....
 

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>Queen excluders for 12 fr. Dadant is a bigger issue....

I got those from Swienty in Denmark but had to make a wood frame. Very good quality.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I think I'd make a wood excluder frame with a divider, then cut down two excluders to fit the frame.
Ya its what I was thinking. But will see what I can figure out. Going to test out 5, 12frame Dadant hives so going to keep investment low for now. My next thing is can I mount plastic lang foundation vertically (2 cut off pieces) into a 11.25 frame or will the vertical orientation be bad for bees. Thinking it won't matter but have never tried it. Have some old plastic frame/foundation that are broke on one side. Figured I could cut the foundation out and re- purpose it vertically into dadant frames instead of tossing it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I got those from Swienty in Denmark but had to make a wood frame. Very good quality.
Think FP got some from Canada and had to do the same. Hope he chimes in at some point as to the source for those. Once I get frames and excluder nailed down I can make a go for it. Can make everything else. I believe Dadant still sells foundation. I will probably get another hand mill at some point as I have the knowledge and skill to make foundation. That way if dadant dries up as a source I can offer it to people who need it.
 

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The hex orientation will change. Bee comb normally is made with the hex vertex on the bottom, ⬢. If you turn the foundation you put the hex flat on the bottom, ⬣. I don't know if that will mess with the bees. The Lusby's claimed that bees used the Y and ⅄ vertices made by back to back hexagons for in hive navigation. I don't know the scientific basis for their claim or if there even is one, just that they made it and I remain a bit skeptical because bees seem to have no problems with plastic. If they weren't full of it then it would be inadvisable.


Why not just use a standard 8-1/2 inch deep foundation sheet and let them build the rest with natural comb, its only an extra 1-5/8 inches? It will help keep the girls from making drone comb in other places and you could easily cull excess drone comb that way.
 

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I think I'd make a wood excluder frame with a divider, then cut down two excluders to fit the frame.
I cut a pair of metal framed excluders so each piece is half the box width. One side will not have frame but it sets on the edge of the hive. It will be no big problem to handle the excluder as two pieces rather than one.

I used the resulting waste to make a queen timing cage.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Personally never bought into housel positioning of combs. But your right I will put the foundation in the normal manner. If it bothers me I'll just cut in a piece of foundation strip to fill the gap and glue it. Its only 12 frames in a brood chamber so not that big a deal. Heck I could cut combs from lang hives and mount in these frames too. Got plenty of options.
 

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The hex orientation will change. Bee comb normally is made with the hex vertex on the bottom, ⬢. If you turn the foundation you put the hex flat on the bottom, ⬣. I don't know if that will mess with the bees. The Lusby's claimed that bees used the Y and ⅄ vertices made by back to back hexagons for in hive navigation. I don't know the scientific basis for their claim or if there even is one, just that they made it and I remain a bit skeptical because bees seem to have no problems with plastic. If they weren't full of it then it would be inadvisable.


Why not just use a standard 8-1/2 inch deep foundation sheet and let them build the rest with natural comb, its only an extra 1-5/8 inches? It will help keep the girls from making drone comb in other places and you could easily cull excess drone comb that way.
Some of the fellows doing deep layens or such are apparently running the plastic foundation the other orientation with apparently no problems. Gosh we haven't thrashed (or is that trashed) Housel positioning for a long time! I have set up some of my dadant and extra dadant depth frames with a crosswise splice. Will be doing some with the pattern the other way and allow for drone construction in the gaps at either side. Something to play with.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I cut a pair of metal framed excluders so each piece is half the box width. One side will not have frame but it sets on the edge of the hive. It will be no big problem to handle the excluder as two pieces rather than one.
I was thinking of digging out a few of my wood bound excluders. Centering it of the hives and adding boards on each side of the excluder to take up the gaps. Quick and easy and still have the excluder as it was in the chance 12 frame dadant hives aren't for me.
 

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I used 2 med boxes (1st version) and glued together for hive body.

Got frames at 12.75" from Weller Bee Supply in Ohio, they have website but not free shipping. Something like $1.40 per.

I take 2 deep foundation pieces, cut to 12.75", then put in 90 degrees to intended orientation.

I love love love that I have 10 frames to check to manage brood chamber.
 

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I got the excluders from Propolis-etc in Canada. They were WAY too expensive due to shipping costs. IMO, use Lang excluders and make wood frames.

Propolis sells frames ready made and maybe cheap enough to be worth your time. I built my own frames with 31.5 mm spacing putting 14 frames in a hive. I could give you a long list of reasons why 1.5 inch spacing is not optimal, but it is what Dadant and Brother Adam used. In the end, it all gets down to how you manage the hive.

Check with Dadant to see if they have some foundation in stock. I'm not a fan of plastic foundation. There are too many issues getting it drawn.

https://www.propolis-etc.ca/
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Thanks FP. Talked to Dadant and they have the foundation in stock. I guess I'll just use my lang excluders with frames as you suggest. I couldn't get an answer from Humble Abodes on dadant depth frames so I'll just make some up. I found a French version of the frames that is simple to make and will meet my requirements. Probably will make up 5 hives to test them out. The idea of a single brood box that I don't have to lift but rarely is very appealing to me. If I need to move bees I'll just slip in my hand truck and roll it up on my trailer. Little to no lifting involved. Think there would be any problems using langstroth supers on these hives with a board to take up the extra area? After I test the hives out I could make proper dedicated supers.
 

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> Talked to Dadant and they have the foundation in stock.

Do they sell in small quantities, or 25lb box only? I use smaller supers on them frequently but prefer the full sized ones.

 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Frank, they said 25# box. Of course the lady gave me no price so I emailed her back waiting for response. Which reminds me do you use 1 3/8 spacing of frames or 1 1/2 like Dadant did?
 
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