[trottet1]

One of my hives that was installed from a package on april 11th has superceded their queen. I gave it frames of brood and eggs. A new queen was raised and I saw her, but no eggs and no brood. She should have been laying by may 22. I kept adding frames of brood and eggs as insurance. I stopped adding frames a while ago as I thought I saw new brood. I go in today and all the donar frames had hatched and now there are no eggs or brood. I see the queen but her wings are all mangled. I will assume she never got mated. Should I buy a queen and re queen or add a donor frame of eggs. I know the donor frame is the cheaper method, but I am concerned about time. Opinions please?

Todd

 

[jbeshearse]

If you have been continually adding frames of brood then they should have enough young bees from those frames to have the colony survive another attempt at raising their own queen. To do this though, you will have to pinch the non-layer and let them be queenless for two days, then add a frame of brood. they obviously think there is a viable queen or they would have tried to rase another one or turned laying workers.

Your only time concern is how long you have until they start shutting down for fall, but i think you still have time.

 

[clyderoad]

I think I would dispatch the bad winged queen, add a frame of mostly capped brood, and introduce a new queen.

 

[Tenbears]

I would not add brood and dispatch the queen if you plan on adding a mated queen. If you dispatch the queen the bees will realize they are queenless and start a queen cell. This could complicate the introduction of the new queen. Okay to dispatch the queen a day before the new one arrives. But wait to introduce a frame of brood until you introduce the new queen.

At your latitude you will experience a dearth in a few weeks, if all goes as usual, But who knows this crazy year of weather we are having. In any event. I would not go the route of raising a new queen at this time. May as well give them every advantage possible. IMHO

 

[clyderoad]

I would not add brood and dispatch the queen if you plan on adding a mated queen. If you dispatch the queen the bees will realize they are queenless and start a queen cell. This could complicate the introduction of the new queen.

At your latitude you will experience a dearth in a few weeks, if all goes as usual, But who knows this crazy year of weather we are having. In any event. I would not go the route of raising a new queen at this time. May as well give them every advantage possible. IMHO

Not if it's all done on the same day.

 

[trottet1]

Okay, I know what I need to do. Why do I add the frame of brood along with the newly mated queen? And just to clarify.... pinch, add frame of capped brood, re-queen (slow release with push in cage) all at same time? Thanks for the help folks.

Todd

 

[beepro]

I'm not sure why add a frame of brood also. Is it to give the new queen more
time to lay by delaying the LWs?

 

[clyderoad]

"I stopped adding frames a while ago as I thought I saw new brood. I go in today and all the donor frames had hatched and now there are no eggs or brood."

Every bee in that hive is at least 3 weeks old now. Get a new queen next week, time to introduce her, time for her to lay and then 3 weeks more for her brood to emerge. Not many of the bees there now will be around by then.

Introducing a queen on brood helps with acceptance.

Do it all in the same day. By the time you're ready to inset new queen those bees will know
they are queenless. Introduce by letting them eat out the candy plug.

 

[trottet1]

awsome! thanks clyde, I am having a hard time finding an italian queen but I just found a carni that I can get today. I will be following your advice. thanks again for the advice and education.
todd

 

[Gypsi]

order your new queen, when she arrives, squish old queen on front of new queen's cage, then put in hive. The hive I did this with is my one smashing success for the year. No conflict on new queen introduction, no queen cells, nothing

 

[trottet1]

ok, update. I got the mated queen in the cage. The candy plug didn't look very secure so I stuck a marshmallow in the hole as well. Of course, upon inspecting the donor hive for a good frame with a ton of capped brood, I could not for the life of me find the queen. I am ashamed to say, that she is also marked. I never have a problem finding her when I am not looking for her. sure enough, I NEED to see her and on all 20 frames, I could not find her. So, I really inspected above mentioned frame, and then since I knew It would eat away at me, I shook it off back into the donor hive anyway. Bees do not like this practice much, and If you have a hole in your carhardts... They will in fact find that hole and let you know that they do not like the "shake me off the frame" technique. Now, upon inspecting the hive to be re-queened, I did find a queen cell at the bottom of the frame. I assume I was to destroy that? That is what I did and indeed there was a fat larva in royal jelly in there. I am really glad I put the marshmallow in the queen cage, because as new as I am, I can tell the colony did not like this new queen. they were clinging to the cage. I sealed everything up and I guess I will check back on new queen in 3 days.

thanks again
todd

 

[clyderoad]

did you also destroy the bad winged queen?

 

[trottet1]

oh yes lol. I forgot that little detail. when I destroyed her, a few bees were clinging to her and that's when things seemed to get a lil anxious around the hive (me and the bees). I tossed her about 30 feet from the hive. Hope that was far enough.

 

[clyderoad]

go find her if you can and put her in a few oz. of the highest proof vodka you have on hand, a small glass jar with tight fitting lid works.
she may come in handy, actually the seasoned vodka will, for use as a swarm lure etc. down the road.
I keep them that way and have a jar full for when I need queen scent.

how much time elapsed between destroying the bad winged queen and intro the new queen in the cage?

 

[trottet1]

I am sorry to say that not a whole lot of time passed between old queen and new queen. Maybe 10 minutes or so. I should have waited a few hours I take it? Oops. I hope that mistake isnt disasterous.

I will try to find that pinched queen and "marinate" her

 

[clyderoad]

longer time interval would be better. you could pull her back out for a couple of hours and re introduce, you'd be good then.

marinate- the the word I was looking for. I call it queen juice most of the time

 

[trottet1]

Im gonna suit up and pull her out for a bit. Thanks clyde.

 

[trottet1]

Ok done! I pulled her outta there. Only a few bees were clinging on the cage, but the marshmallow was already nibbled at. I will wait a couple hours and put her back. Thanks again kind sir !

 

[clyderoad]

you work fast!
you must be young.

I was younger once and got a lot more done in a day than I do now.:scratch:

 

[trottet1]

well, I was only pulling the queen cage out and my bee yard is right in my own back yard. Believe me, the original task earlier of just dealing with the two hives took well over a half hour. I over stayed my welcome at those hives and that is probably why they got a ornery. And as far as young, my 41 yr old back feels like I was leaning over a couple of hives today lol.