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I am going to try to raise some queens. I am going to use a 5 frame nuc. I will have the starter loaded with bees and a frame of honey and one of pollen. I will run about 45 cups the first round. I was wondering if I can add another 45 as soon as I pull the first bunch out. As long as they still provisions?

thanx bill
 

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Aylett, VA 10-frame double deep Langstroth
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So, how do you get 45 cups on a frame? Most I get is 36 and that is using all three bars. I would start no more than 24 cups, with the hope that 70% are accepted. After the second round, let the starter colony raise one of the cells for themselves to have as a nuc. You may need to add more nurse bees also. But that is me, I just started grafting last year.
 

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You have been given some excellent advice thus far. I agree that 20 cells is a good number to start. I generally graft 15 or so at a time. If I wanted 45, I would just use three nucs and run them staggered. This requires fewer resources and makes better use of my time.
 

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You have been given some excellent advice thus far. I agree that 20 cells is a good number to start. I generally graft 15 or so at a time. If I wanted 45, I would just use three nucs and run them staggered. This requires fewer resources and makes better use of my time.
I'd second that - it's what I've been doing for the last couple of years - 3 JC double-nuc starter-finishers (5 over 5) with 16 cells per frame (8 on each bar) - aiming to get 10 good 'uns from each stack.

A variation I'm beginning to prefer though is to insert a suitable brood comb rather than queen cups on a frame, and let 'the professionals' choose which larvae to use, and how many natural queen cells they want to draw-out.
LJ
 

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LJ you might take a look at Tarpys work on the subject.
Grafted queens were 50% better then bees choice.
If you let the bees go all the way to the end and they tear down 50% or so of the cells leaveing better ones. cuting and distributing e cells can leave you with sub par queens...
 

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LJ you might take a look at Tarpys work on the subject.
Grafted queens were 50% better then bees choice.
If you let the bees go all the way to the end and they tear down 50% or so of the cells leaveing better ones. cuting and distributing e cells can leave you with sub par queens...
I agree about the cutting-out - that certainly is a pain in the bum, no argument there. If they tear down a cell, then there must be a jolly good reason for them doing that (after investing all that time and resources) - No ?

But this idea of grafted queens being 'better' - how can that possibly be ? - that really is counter-intuitive.

Have you got a link to David Tarpy's work ? I'm gonna need some convincing on this one. :)
Cheers,
LJ
 

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If they tear down a cell, then there must be a jolly good reason for them doing that
Yes, Tarpy 2015 found they tear down 57%, Hatch 1999 was 53%, Those cells would make sub par queens, thats a lot of "bad" cells and when you break them up in to nucs you can see problems as the bees have no choice but to play the hand you dealt them with a single cell

Sam Comfort talks about them being even to the point of intercast, and walk away pauper spits (frame of open brood, frame of food, shake of bees) producing much better queens as the bees have the chance to cull the poorer ones, he has been sending some queens in to the Tarpy lab to back his results

heres a start for you
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yxrawVF0Oc
@56min, but its worth it to watch the whole thing

https://www.researchgate.net/public...controlling_which_queens_survive_to_adulthood
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yxrawVF0Oc
 
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