Spun (Creamed) Honey issues
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  1. #1
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    Apr 2013
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    Default Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    My wife has been making Spun Honey that we sell at a local Farmers Market. Lately the batches she has been making seem to separate into layers. If you stir it again, it is fine, then settles into layers after a day or so. She has removed all, re-mixed, then re-filled jars again and it separates. She thinks it was a temperature issue in the process. Has anyone had this sort of experience before? There is also "streaking" of the contents in addition to the layering. This photo is of Cinnamon flavor.

    CinnamonSpun.jpg

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  3. #2
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    Default Re: Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    It has air in it.

    This can be caused by fermentation in honey with too much moisture.

    But also your description "spun", what do you mean by spun? Are you whipping it? If so, could be introducing air.
    "Every viewpoint, is a view from a point." - Solomon Parker

  4. #3
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    Default Re: Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    Thanks Oldtimer. Spun Honey is just another name for "Creamed" or "Whipped" honey. We just decided to use "Spun".
    Well if I remember this honey we used tested at 17% moisture. It's also what we bottle. Using a Kitchen Aid bowl mixer, thinking of switching over to a 1/2" drill with drywall mixer paddle on it. Mixing in a 5 gal. bucket.
    The mixer may be introducing some air. So you don't think it's a temperature issue?

  5. #4
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    Default Re: Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    No it isn't a temperature issue. However if you heat that honey enough to make it more runny, the bubbles in it will come to the top, you will have froth on top but the honey under it will be clear.

    Creamed honey is honey that has had a "starter" of correctly grained honey added to it, and then been allowed to follow that grain pattern by holding at a cool temperature (normally 54 degrees or so) for a few days, so the honey ends up copying the small grain size of the starter and ends up fine grained and smooth to the the taste. Is that what you also mean by whipped?

    Just trying to clarify terms, because if by whipped you mean whipping as in the normal way the term is used in baking, ie whipping with a beater or similar, this could be introducing air.
    "Every viewpoint, is a view from a point." - Solomon Parker

  6. #5
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    Default Re: Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    I had the same problem with some of my creamed honey with the streaking. I read that when crystals form they force the moisture into what remains of the base. I have a jar with streaks in it that is three years old that has yet to ferment, although it is unattractive, making it unsuitable to sell. When there is enough moisture to cause your product to layer I think you will have a problem with fermentation.
    I use a drill with a paint mixer attachment that has the spiral type blades. I run it sloooowly so as to not form that air sucking vortex.

    Alex
    Ten years of Beekeeping before varroa. Started again spring of 2014.

  7. #6
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    Default Re: Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    Might want to check your hydrometer. I had some honey ferment that was low moisture so I re-calibrated again and it was way off. I have a cheap hydrometer and learned I have to check it frequently. J

  8. #7
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    Default Re: Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    Alright, good info all. Thanks for that. If the "seed" is high moisture content, can that ruin a batch? And will those characteristics be taken on by the honey that the seed is put into?

    @OldTimer - the term "whipped" is just an adjective more or less, not an action in this case. I've heard it called Creamed, Spun, Whipped, but know it is NOT the same as Honey Butter. I think Creamed and Spun are the most popular terms. Whipped is used in baking, culinary tasks, etc. Or to describe a man who is madly in love with his better half.

  9. #8
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    Default Re: Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    "Every viewpoint, is a view from a point." - Solomon Parker

  10. #9
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    Default Re: Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    Optimum temp for creamed honey is 57F.
    We all liquify crystalized honey with heat so it entirely possible that creamed honey subject to warm temperatures will separate into layers.Maybe store in the refrigerator.
    There is also the glucose/fructose ratio in different nectar sources.Sometimes my spring honey crystalizes(on it's own) into nice even crystals,other times it barely crystallizes at all.I have heard that locust honey is very slow to crystallize.My fall honey always seems to separate and crystalizes in layers.
    Gentle heat(105) does not liquify all and I get a layer of honey"sugar" in the bottom of the pail.

  11. #10
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    Default Re: Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    Maybe too high a percentage of glucose which will not crystallize. I can't for the life of me create creamed honey with what my bees produce. I guess the local nectar has a high glucose content. My bottled honey that has been sitting on the shelf for years does not crystallize.

  12. #11
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    Default Re: Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    Jonsi - "Maybe too high a percentage of glucose which will not crystallize" - I thought I read somewhere that the higher glucose to fructose ratio drives the crystallization story. Source of info?

  13. #12
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    Default Re: Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Holcombe View Post
    Jonsi - "Maybe too high a percentage of glucose which will not crystallize" - I thought I read somewhere that the higher glucose to fructose ratio drives the crystallization story. Source of info?
    Robert - don't remember the source but if I run into i"ll send it along. I think it may have been a talk from an Apimondia conference.

    Jon

  14. #13
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    Default Re: Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    Quote Originally Posted by BeePappy View Post
    Alright, good info all. Thanks for that. If the "seed" is high moisture content, can that ruin a batch? And will those characteristics be taken on by the honey that the seed is put into?

    @OldTimer - the term "whipped" is just an adjective more or less, not an action in this case. I've heard it called Creamed, Spun, Whipped, but know it is NOT the same as Honey Butter. I think Creamed and Spun are the most popular terms. Whipped is used in baking, culinary tasks, etc. Or to describe a man who is madly in love with his better half.
    The terminology is important; creamed is a creaming process as mentioned above. In no way should it ever be interchangeable with “spun” or “whipped”. It is not the same process at all.
    Proverbs 16:24

  15. #14
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    Default Re: Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Cloverdale View Post
    The terminology is important; creamed is a creaming process as mentioned above. In no way should it ever be interchangeable with “spun” or “whipped”. It is not the same process at all.
    Are you saying that the process to make "Spun Honey" is different than how "Creamed Honey" is made? How so? As I mentioned above, to us it is merely part of the marketing. We chose to call our creamed honey, "Spun Honey".

  16. #15
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    Default Re: Spun (Creamed) Honey issues

    Well, spun honey sounds like it was spun somehow; I associate spun honey and whipped honey the same, with similar results, but will eventually separate because of the air whipped in. Creamed honey is creamed, adding in the fine seed crystals and stirring for days then cool temp. to cream/set it. When people ask me if I have whipped honey I say No! I have creamed honey. How do you make yours?
    That’s what I think. Deb
    Proverbs 16:24

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