Shelter in place...unintended consequences - Page 6
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  1. #101
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Scott county, Arkansas, Usa
    Posts
    1,597

    Default Re: Shelter in place...unintended consequences

    Quote Originally Posted by HarryVanderpool View Post
    What is DISGUSTING is that this has happened before and apparently we didn't learn anything.
    Will we learn ANYTHING this time?

    https://www.statesmanjournal.com/sto...em/5083577002/
    An interesting question of which I am hoping was posed to elicit commentary. I think we have learned plenty. The thing we fail to do is act upon the things we learn.

    What do all industries complain about? One thing I hear about is overreach of the Federal Government, from Wall Street all the way to Beekeepers. Yet, when the system breaks down, we all ask, "How could the Government let this happen"?

    We have Varroa, SHB, African HBs, and Phunny Honey because Customs doesn't have the resources to check all international shipments, only a small percentage. The things I listed are but a very small part of daily activity at the ports. One could only guess how much that would slow the flow of goods into this country if they were to begin inspect each container.

    The quarantines put in place to slow the spread of Africanized Hbs were largely if not wholly ignored.

    Consider this, if the person in charge of purchasing for a large Health Care organization had one million masks on hand and threw them away because they were old and the elastic had become brittle, after ordering one million replacements. I think the CEO would want to know why you had so many on hand that they become too old to use, and if they became too old to use, why did you order the same amount of replacements? I would hate to be the one to tell the CEO, "Because I thought we might need them". Even the person at the unemployment office might scoff at that. These sorts of expenditures are easy for the bean counters to zero in on and act upon. What about ventilators?
    I think the love of money is at the root of the problem. The following article may offer some insight. It gets right to the numbers in the the first few paragraphs.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/dianahe.../#5f9d8b5776dd

    The Government faces the same sort of problems when it comes to waste and fraud. What would taxpayers say if the Fed purchased 10 million masks a year while disposing of 10 million a year for the last 30 years? Whomever was in charge of those expenditures would be suspected of taking bribes from the suppliers.

    The powers and respect of the office President have been being eroded for as long as I can remember. Maybe, standing up to the President resonates with the voters that elected the Governors or Representatives of states, but there is a price to be paid when seeking from the same.

    I don't think any one person or group is to blame for the situation we are in. Bureaucracies seem to take on a life of their own. In the words of John Kay, "We have created a monster that will not obey".

    Alex
    Ten years of Beekeeping before varroa. Started again spring of 2014.

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  3. #102
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Suffolk Co, NY, USA
    Posts
    3,699

    Default Re: Shelter in place...unintended consequences

    AHudd- Well said.

  4. #103
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Northern Il, USA
    Posts
    500

    Default Re: Shelter in place...unintended consequences

    Quote Originally Posted by Murdock View Post
    When did it get to be the federal government's job to prepare state/private hospitals for disease control. Individuals must take care of themselves and resort to federal support after they have done so. Hospitals PAY personnel to order/warehouse equipment/supplies so they need to ask themselves the question of WHERE IS THE PPE. It should have been ordered from their suppliers in December.
    Not sure if I mentioned it in this thread or not, but 4 years ago I attended a disaster prep seminar with the local police, fire, heath department and hospital personnel. We were informed by the guy in charge of directing county disaster prep that we had available a warehouse (in a secret location) full of PPE and vital medications etc, stored up just for this sort of event. To date in local media I have not heard a peep that this material has been made available to local hospitals.

    At my hospital we are reusing 'disposable' PPE until it dies on our faces. Nurses are ordering materials from Amazon and hand-crafting PPE for use on the units. We have even had requests from our doctors to make them a set.

    The Feds cannot respond fast enough to local problems, and should not be expected to.

  5. #104
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    West Bath, Maine, United States
    Posts
    2,560

    Default Re: Shelter in place...unintended consequences

    The Feds cannot respond fast enough to local problems, and should not be expected to.

    In what sense is Covid a local problem?

    Fifty stockpiles plus territories expiring each owned by the states? Which State is going to send over their stockpile to stop the next Ebola before it reaches our shores?

    If NH does not stockpile and Maine does are we going to not treat, close the border to NH? Like it or not the Feds are the practical stockpile. Doesn't make me all fussy warm either.
    It is hard to design a safety net that some will not use as a hammock.

  6. #105
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Northern Il, USA
    Posts
    500

    Default Re: Shelter in place...unintended consequences

    Quote Originally Posted by Saltybee View Post
    The Feds cannot respond fast enough to local problems, and should not be expected to.

    In what sense is Covid a local problem?

    Fifty stockpiles plus territories expiring each owned by the states? Which State is going to send over their stockpile to stop the next Ebola before it reaches our shores?

    If NH does not stockpile and Maine does are we going to not treat, close the border to NH? Like it or not the Feds are the practical stockpile. Doesn't make me all fussy warm either.
    Sure, Feds should have many stockpiles. But the feds are famously slow and tend to use sledgehammers when they need to drive nails. Any state or locality that doesn't plan for fast, local response is asking for trouble.

  7. #106
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Greenville, NC, USA
    Posts
    204

    Default Re: Shelter in place...unintended consequences

    Quote Originally Posted by Saltybee View Post
    "It should have been ordered from their suppliers in December."

    I don't think they were included in the Intelligence Agency's briefings.
    But they were aware that it was flu season and then Wuhan started up. To a good logistics professional these are red flags that say CHECK YOUR INVENTORY and what additional might be needed.

  8. #107
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    West Bath, Maine, United States
    Posts
    2,560

    Default Re: Shelter in place...unintended consequences

    I am not saying there is no shared fault. Local fault goes down to individuals as well. Been to the hardware store, Lowes, & Walmart myself.

    (I meant to say fuzzy warm, fussy warm may be as appropriate.)
    It is hard to design a safety net that some will not use as a hammock.

  9. #108
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    syracuse n.y.
    Posts
    5,350

    Default Re: Shelter in place...unintended consequences

    Connecticut's governor on Tuesday said the U.S. Strategic National Stockpile of medical supplies was now empty and the state was "on its own" trying to secure ventilators and masks to fight the coronavirus pandemic.
    well now all the governors can stop going on tv and complaining and have more time to address the problems.
    mike syracuse ny
    Whatever you subsidize you get more of. Ronald Reagan

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