What to use to get the natural wood look - Page 2
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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
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    SE Michigan USDA 6a (Macomb Co.)
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    102

    Default Re: What to use to get the natural wood look

    Quote Originally Posted by Tigger19687 View Post
    I would LOVE a pic please
    OK, here is a pic I have on my PC, but certainly not "magazine quality" lol. Most of these boxes have been sitting outside at least a year with little degradation. Some interesting "features"...
    - LH hive "attic/roof", and 2 boxes on the middle hive are only treated with raw pine then 2 coats of BLO (notice the yellow color)
    - All the other boxes were done various times with the described treatment of vinegar/iron oxide/lye, covered with clear UV inhibitor wood sealer
    - All 3 hives are topped by a vented "attic", which serves as a quilt board for winter
    - LH roof with cedar shakes looks pretty, but the weight is an extra PITA
    - Middle and RH are "migratory covers" with tar-paper folder covers stapled in place
    - Ratchet straps are not pretty, but with high winds they are cheap insurance
    - All bottoms are screened, but I keep working on new versions, each is different
    - I put upper entrances in the attics or inner covers, so the boxes don't need to be notched
    - I have since quit putting handles on fronts and backs, plus the "cleat" version handles are eliminated, they are not super secure, and prevent stackability for storage
    - Hive stand mostly works to keep most ants off, but not perfect. New stands will also be narrower front-back for better stability. They are too wide now
    - Tar paper under the hives prevent SHB larvae from being able to fall out of the hives and pupate
    - Plastic excluders under the supers, but I plan to start using metal ones. These are rather brittle when trying to clean off wax and propolis
    - I keep my hives in the middle of the raspberry patch in my garden, so all my raspberry plants are well pollinated all year

    Questions, comments? Enjoy!190905 Outside view 2 (tgh v1).jpg
    USDA 6a, 8 frame equipment

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  3. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2017
    Location
    Northern Il, USA
    Posts
    640

    Default Re: What to use to get the natural wood look

    Look real good for outdoors a year. Nice.
    I have used linseed oil and it looks pretty good, but needs to be applied every year or the wood fades. I got a random old board from the floor of my dad's barn. Only after I started cutting it and the old, dull blade wouldn't cut did I realize that it was super-hard old walnut! I swapped blades and finally got it cut, enough for one medium. Decided that old walnut deserved to be seen, not painted, thus the linseed oil.

    I fished another bunch of old walnut out of the haymow floor but have not yet made anything out of it. I believe that wood was sawn by my great uncle prior to 1950.

  4. #23
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Bedford, Massachusetts, USA
    Posts
    247

    Default Re: What to use to get the natural wood look

    I have to say that I seem to like the lighter color better.
    Now I am not sure which I want to try. If the sealer has to be done every year How long does Wax sealer work ? Wish I had not just tossed out a ton of paraffin wax
    -Linda

  5. #24
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Pepperell, MA.
    Posts
    6,176

    Default Re: What to use to get the natural wood look

    It's really hard to present a real, wood finish that can keep out in the weather. Just like paint, you need a deep coat...not a top coat. The more oil you can use, the better your end product will look and last.

    I did a bunch of double nucs a few years ago. All pine. I stained with an oil based coating followed by a number of coats of exterior spar. I hate the new spar. It's like they hired a bunch of people who don't know how to paint. They probably developed the disastrous one coat paint / primer crap that's everywhere now.

    I added oil to natural stain. Gave it enough coats so the the wood stopped soaking it in. Let it dry very thoroughly. Sparred the finished product. Paid careful attention to any edge or knot or hole where the finish might be thin.

    They look great and I can keep them out all year long with only normal dust and grime to clean up. It's been 4 years now. A LOT of work compared to how easy it was years ago for the same results but sadly, we all have to live with "progress".

    I also add oil to my factory, oil based primer when I prime and paint. I do it on my 210+ year old house too. It makes all the difference.

    Finally, sun affects your finished product. So does moisture in the hive, especially with the topcoat.

    I LOVE real wood look and it's worth doing it right.
    "My wife always wanted girls. Just not thousands and thousands of them......"

  6. #25
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Location
    SE Michigan USDA 6a (Macomb Co.)
    Posts
    102

    Default Re: What to use to get the natural wood look

    Quote Originally Posted by AR1 View Post
    Look real good for outdoors a year. Nice.
    I have used linseed oil and it looks pretty good, but needs to be applied every year or the wood fades. I got a random old board from the floor of my dad's barn. Only after I started cutting it and the old, dull blade wouldn't cut did I realize that it was super-hard old walnut! I swapped blades and finally got it cut, enough for one medium. Decided that old walnut deserved to be seen, not painted, thus the linseed oil.

    I fished another bunch of old walnut out of the haymow floor but have not yet made anything out of it. I believe that wood was sawn by my great uncle prior to 1950.
    Excellent story, it would certainly be a shame to cover up old walnut and lose the character. Interestingly if it had been inside an old stall, it may have been "fumed" by ammonia that develops from animal urine, which is another "old timey" method of wood finishing to bring out character. It's another thing that works great for white oak and other grainy high-tannin woods, have a look at any "Gustav Stickley Craftsman" furniture and you will see how the ammonia fuming was used to bring out "ray fleck" in quarter sawn white oak, it is a signature look.

    IMHO using antique walnut for super boxes seems like a waste though, since it'll certainly degrade some over time, and you don't get to see it very often. Might be better to use on a piece of indoor something, where you can put a wood stamp or a photo of your grandfather on the back. And try to find something instead of linseed oil, as that tends to impart a yellow color. Beautiful old walnut that gets colored by yellowish linseed oil is a crime, but tung or danish don't change the color so much. Be sure to prep the surface carefully, staining a rough surface is another way to turn a good product bad.

    Finally, I definitely recommend some kind of sealer that soaks in, not just lays on the top, for outdoor products like our woodenware. This is one reason I don't care for shellac or spar, since they form a sort of hard coating that breaks down and cracks eventually due to UV rays and water migration. The water-sealer I use mostly soaks in (keep applying until it doesn't soak in any more) and then doesn't really make a hard top, so it doesn't crack. We shall see regarding durability and UV resistance eventually, but so far with 1 gallon I've covered dozens of supers, and I still probably have 1/2 gallon left. Using tung or danish oil or linseed oil works, but each of those impart some off-colors, and it takes a lot of "hand rubbing" to get a really nice look. This stuff you can just slather it on and it doesn't run, since it soaks in or runs off, doesn't leave drips.

    Regardless good luck, try some experiments before you risk your hard work to a new staining method!
    USDA 6a, 8 frame equipment

  7. #26
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Bedford, Massachusetts, USA
    Posts
    247

    Default

    I ended up buying Olympic transparent acorn color stain from Home Depot. Did 2 light coats this afternoon since the 1st coat was sucked in so fast.
    It's drying in my shed as it's raining out now.
    Tomorrow I'll put on another coat in the morning and see how it is in the afternoon.

    ?----Do you all coat the bottom board too ? My hives will be on plastic board so I guess I need to do the bottom board on the outside and under side.
    -Linda

  8. #27
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Bedford, Massachusetts, USA
    Posts
    247

    Default Re: What to use to get the natural wood look

    OK Thought I would post a pic if I can of the hives with the stain/waterproofer on them. I think it is the Acorn color as listed above. They got 2 coats on them. The bottom boards I did a 2 coat with in 20-30 min of each other.
    Not sure if I should put another coat on. It seemed to NOT have any 'dry' spots after 20 min when I looked them over.
    Here they are just sun/air drying today
    IMG_20200412_121627884[1].jpg
    p.s these were stained yesterday, the Med boxes, deeps the day before that. Not sure why the Med look redder
    -Linda

  9. #28
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Northeast PA
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    488

    Default Re: What to use to get the natural wood look

    I've used polyurethane+stain last year, and on flat surfaces, it does look like it'll chip away after a couple of years. But has held up well over the winter.

    How effective is the stain/waterproof material they use for decks, as opposed to polyurethane for beehives?

  10. #29
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Location
    SE Michigan USDA 6a (Macomb Co.)
    Posts
    102

    Default Re: What to use to get the natural wood look

    Those look great, please update us on how they hold up! Did the finish leave any kind of a "glossy shell" on the outside afterward?

    I have found that when I am building boxes, different depths (like mediums or deeps) are typically taken out of different width stock boards in order to not have so much side-scrap. So, they normally seem to take stains a bit different from each other just due to differences between individual boards. If it bothers you too much it is always possible to use some "soft wood conditioner" for things like pine first, since it helps seal up the grain a bit, you don't have to use as much of your more-expensive stain, and the color will be more uniform.
    USDA 6a, 8 frame equipment

  11. #30
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Location
    SE Michigan USDA 6a (Macomb Co.)
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    Default Re: What to use to get the natural wood look

    Quote Originally Posted by username00101 View Post
    I've used polyurethane+stain last year, and on flat surfaces, it does look like it'll chip away after a couple of years. But has held up well over the winter.

    How effective is the stain/waterproof material they use for decks, as opposed to polyurethane for beehives?
    When using the stain+poly like you mentioned, I did indeed have chipping, cracking, and peeling, and I think it may be due to UV exposure as much as anything, or water/humidity migrating out to the outer surface from the high temp high humidity inside all year . Similar experience with spar varnish too. So this is why I use the product I mentioned far below in the thread. I'll put a link here you you can see what I'm talking about. It is water based, soaks right in so there is no glassy layer on the top to chip or peel, is UV resistant, doesn't impart any kind of off-colors, and relatively inexpensive, so it checks most of the boxes for me. Should be readily available in your area:

    http://acehardwaremaldives.com/produ.../#.XpW_5c0pC70
    USDA 6a, 8 frame equipment

  12. #31
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Northeast PA
    Posts
    488

    Default Re: What to use to get the natural wood look

    Quote Originally Posted by hockeyfan_019 View Post
    When using the stain+poly like you mentioned, I did indeed have chipping, cracking, and peeling, and I think it may be due to UV exposure as much as anything, or water/humidity migrating out to the outer surface from the high temp high humidity inside all year . Similar experience with spar varnish too. So this is why I use the product I mentioned far below in the thread. I'll put a link here you you can see what I'm talking about. It is water based, soaks right in so there is no glassy layer on the top to chip or peel, is UV resistant, doesn't impart any kind of off-colors, and relatively inexpensive, so it checks most of the boxes for me. Should be readily available in your area:

    http://acehardwaremaldives.com/produ.../#.XpW_5c0pC70
    Thanks, I will try that product.

    Did you apply a stain as well, or is this just a clear coating?

  13. #32
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Bedford, Massachusetts, USA
    Posts
    247

    Default Re: What to use to get the natural wood look

    There is no glossy outer layer to peel off like a Poly. This was just a waterproof stain like Thompson's.
    It says 1 coat but mine did absorb a bunch so I did another layer before it was dry, 20-30 min after.

    Hope it works out
    I still need to make an outer cover.
    -Linda

  14. #33
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Location
    SE Michigan USDA 6a (Macomb Co.)
    Posts
    102

    Default Re: What to use to get the natural wood look

    Quote Originally Posted by username00101 View Post
    Thanks, I will try that product.

    Did you apply a stain as well, or is this just a clear coating?
    This is just a clear coating, so you need to color it however you want first. If you look for a needlessly-long message from me below, I have detailed how I use a combination of iron-oxide and lye-water to get a cedar-like look first, then coat with the sealer.
    USDA 6a, 8 frame equipment

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