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Thread: Global Warming

  1. #21
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    Quote Originally Posted by Live Oak View Post
    There is apparently and inexhaustible number of those who believe in the HOAX and UNSUBSTANTIATED BS of "Global Warming". Melanie Phillips I agree has a MUCH more accurate term for this faux crisis. "Extinction of Reasoning" you might indulge yourself in some extracurricular reading and then verify the references for yourself.......you might learn something and come to the realization that Global Warming is a BS HOAX.

    https://www.melaniephillips.com/extinction-of-reason/

    There is FAR more to anthropogenic changes in climate than the radical extremist line of carbon emissions. Not to mention what MANY believe is the main goal behind pushing "Global Warming" propaganda. Karl Marx and Vladimir Ilyich Ulyanov also known as Vladimir Lenin have written extensively on this topic.

    The Earth's climate has been in a continuous state of change from its beginning and I expect it will continue to do so with or without human intervention.
    It looks to me like your Melanie Phillips went down the rabbit hole.

    https://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2...netism-in-acti
    5 Production colonies, 1 side by side 5 frame nuc for support- 7 working queens is all I want.

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  3. #22
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    Quote Originally Posted by Grins View Post
    It looks to me like your Melanie Phillips went down the rabbit hole.

    https://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2...netism-in-acti
    Thanks Grins; this link explains some interesting connections!
    Frank

  4. #23
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    Quote Originally Posted by Hogback Honey View Post
    I remember my 5th grade teacher, that was 1968, giving a lecture on how, since the last ice age, the temperature of the planet has been slowly rising. That in time, maybe millions of years, there would be another ice age, as the earth has constantly gone from cooling to heating to cooling again.

    I believe it's the politicians, playing games to scare the public, and to capitalize on a normal, cyclic event, just like claiming 'cow farts' are part of the problem. I hate pollution as much as anyone, but it pisses me off that the 'Air Quality' nazis have banned wood burning in certain cities, counties, MAKING people dependent on public utilities, and then when electricity goes out in the middle of winter, literally leaving people in the cold.

    Okay, I'll get down off the soap box, and let someone else get on it.
    My wife and I lived in Salt Lake City a while back. SLC is in a valley and often gets inversions, the warmer air above pins the colder air in the valley and that stagnant air just keeps getting worse and worse. The old timers told horrific tales of what these inversions looked like back when everyone used coal to heat their homes. I typed this to say that just maybe air quality is the reason wood burning is restricted. Here in Montana wood burning is restricted in inversion prone areas when air quality diminishes.
    I burn wood when it makes sense. I'm too broken down to chase my own and in years past it has been a decent purchase. This year, because of scarcity and labor costs it no longer makes sense to burn wood from an economic viewpoint. We'll always keep it on hand for emergencies but, at least for this year, not as a primary fuel. Here is the price converter I use to get the most out of my wallet.

    https://coalpail.com/fuel-comparison...r-home-heating
    5 Production colonies, 1 side by side 5 frame nuc for support- 7 working queens is all I want.

  5. #24
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  6. #25
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    Quote Originally Posted by crofter View Post
    Here is a link to a very different approach to getting nature back in balance. Throws a far different light on the notion that being vegetarian is noble or that cow farts are killing us with greenhouse gasses.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpTH...RLtXtP-4XO-aic

    If this fellow is a BS'r he is a smooth one! Thoughts?
    Wow Frank, it's funny you posted this video. I watched it several years ago and it changed the way I manage my puny little pasture here in Montana. I now invite neighbor cows and horses in to graze it down once a year. The grasses and wildflowers have really responded and neighbors with identical ground comment on how good our pasture looks. This guy blows the lid off the notion of not grazing lands, I've shared it with folks convinced no grazing is a solution. I love TED talks and thanks for reminding me of this great video.

    edit: By the way, I think protein will be a huge challenge for the masses of humanity in the future. I've cut back on the amount of meat I eat trying for 3 nights a week meat free but I have no intentions of ever going meatless. Our farming practices need improvement as well as ranching.
    5 Production colonies, 1 side by side 5 frame nuc for support- 7 working queens is all I want.

  7. #26
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    I have 100 acres of CRP ground which was seeded into a tall grass prairie similar to the original prairies of days gone by. Part of the maintenance agreement was that it be hayed once at the 5 year mark (late summer after the primary nesting season). The reason I was told is because it replicates how the prairies had evolved for centuries with buffalo moving through and grazing it back every few years.
    "People will generally accept facts as truth only if the facts agree with what they already believe."- Andy Rooney

  8. #27
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    Quote Originally Posted by JWPalmer View Post
    I think the biggest problem with the " global warming" debate is not whether one can prove that the planet is getting warmer (or colder as was proven a short 40 years ago), but that it is man made and not part of an on going and never ending cycle of natural temperature fluctuatuons. Having a similar set of people who have been hit by fence posts tell us that by taking money out of our collective wallets they will fix the problem is beyond ridiculous.

    Personally, I am for clean energy. But I am also for a robust economy. Cutting off this nation's supply of inexpesive energy while alternative sources are still being developed is a sure fire way to assure that China, who is the the worlds largest polluter, takes over.

    Keep the discussion civil, and know that no matter how vehemently you argue your point, for or against, you are unlikely to change anyone's mind.
    You make too much sense
    NCSBA Certified Beekeeper - my Youtube Vlog
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  9. #28
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    Quote Originally Posted by crofter View Post
    Here is a link to a very different approach to getting nature back in balance. Throws a far different light on the notion that being vegetarian is noble or that cow farts are killing us with greenhouse gasses.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpTH...RLtXtP-4XO-aic

    If this fellow is a BS'r he is a smooth one! Thoughts?
    Thanks for this link Frank. Compelling and convincing I must say.
    "People will generally accept facts as truth only if the facts agree with what they already believe."- Andy Rooney

  10. #29
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    Wow grins, what hypocrisy. You claim that we are in a mass extinction and everyone needs to wake up to this fact. Then we find out you have been burning wood and then claim that you will use what ever energy source makes the most economic sense. According to your attachment, looks like that nasty dirty coal is the winner. How is it that someone so concerned about mass extinction doesn't have solar and wind turbines and a house buried underground for thermal effeciancy. At least the little girl at the UN crying about how I ruined her life seems to be trying to live her life like she would wish the rest of the lemmings should.

  11. #30
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    Quote Originally Posted by Vectorjet View Post
    Wow grins, what hypocrisy. You claim that we are in a mass extinction and everyone needs to wake up to this fact. Then we find out you have been burning wood and then claim that you will use what ever energy source makes the most economic sense. According to your attachment, looks like that nasty dirty coal is the winner. How is it that someone so concerned about mass extinction doesn't have solar and wind turbines and a house buried underground for thermal effeciancy. At least the little girl at the UN crying about how I ruined her life seems to be trying to live her life like she would wish the rest of the lemmings should.
    Vector, I realize your aim is just to attack me, not the facts. I get that. I'll include a picture of my workshop just for giggles, look at the roof. Also, there is a big difference between unearthed carbon like coal and carbon in the natural cycle like wood. I actually agree with your accusation to a point, there is always more I could do to be a part of the solution. We drive a hybrid, our heat system is a geothermal heat pump and I'll let the picture of my shop roof speak for itself but, yes, there is always more we could do.

    GNF Solar Array large.jpg

    Edit: Oh, and it's not me claiming there is a mass extinction going on any more than it's your newspaper delivery person trying to convince you of the headline.
    5 Production colonies, 1 side by side 5 frame nuc for support- 7 working queens is all I want.

  12. #31
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    That roof is way beyond cool. I assume you have a battery bank that it charges?

    For those that do not understand, the carbon in coal is locked in and can only be released by burning. The carbon in wood is released by burning, or by the wood simply decaying. Either way, it is short term. Whether we agree with Lee on this issue or not, he is certainly doing more than talking the talk, he walking the walk. We should all be so driven by our beliefs.
    Thankfully, the bees are smarter than I am. They are doing well, in spite of my efforts to help them.

  13. #32
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    One must consider the fact that on this site we are free to debate the subject of so called global warming which has become such a political issue that in many cities and universities any speakers who wish to provide evidence of this fraud are denied venues to discuss this with any who wish to listen. When one looks at all the organizations who have embraced global warming one finds that these organizations are liberal bent and fail to practice what they preach. Case in point would be Al Gore junior while preaching to the masses about diminishing their carbon footprints and must freeze in the winter and swelter in the summer himself lives an opulant lifestyle and another walking around in shirtsleeves whilst the thermostat is set at 78 degrees is overlooked as the fellow was born in Hawaii and is not used to the frigid temperatures of Washington in the winter. One needs to read Saul Alinskis book called Rules for radicals where he states that causes need to be embraced although it is not the cause that is important but the use of the cause to obtain power and if one cannot win in debates aginst objectors they should be ridiculed and destroyed. There is much evidence That the facts and figures put out by the global warming experts is cherry picked to suit their agenda and I have seen the evidence refuted but this stuff never makes it to the media also as it does not fit into their agenda. I am personally an individualist, I do not run with the herd of sheep. I believe in self sustainability and I have lived for many years on the oceans in a 30 ft sailboat with solar panels and a wind generator and with a little diesel to get by. I aM NOW RETIRED AND AM QUITE COMFORTABLE WITH MY THERMOSTAT ST AT 60 DEGREES IN THE WINTER AND 80 DEGREES IN THE SUMMER HOWEVER i DO NOT TRY TO RAM THIS DOWN EVERY ONE ELSES THROAT LIKE THE CLIMATE CHANGE PEOPLE WOULD LIKE TO DO.

  14. #33
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    Quote Originally Posted by Grins View Post
    Vector, I realize your aim is just to attack me, not the facts. I get that. I'll include a picture of my workshop just for giggles, look at the roof. Also, there is a big difference between unearthed carbon like coal and carbon in the natural cycle like wood. I actually agree with your accusation to a point, there is always more I could do to be a part of the solution. We drive a hybrid, our heat system is a geothermal heat pump and I'll let the picture of my shop roof speak for itself but, yes, there is always more we could do.

    GNF Solar Array large.jpg

    Edit: Oh, and it's not me claiming there is a mass extinction going on any more than it's your newspaper delivery person trying to convince you of the headline.
    IT is not my aim to attack anyone. Live your life however you want, buy whatever you want, I don't care. But here I log on to bee source and find someone calling people such as myself slow and in need of a whack in the head and to wake up because I don't believe as you do. What do you call that where you come from? I would just like to live my life like I want too. However at every turn there is someone telling me how bad my future will be if I don't do what they say. And you know what almost every single time the so-called experts and do gooders who were just looking out for my best interest had there way, the future came and they were proven spectacularly wrong. My brain works just fine and the world may come crashing down in twelve years, but it absolutely will not because of climate change. So I will continue to live my life how I see fit for as long as possible and maybe, just maybe the enlightened people of the world will one day agree with me on something. I have a dream!!!

  15. #34
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    Quote Originally Posted by JWPalmer View Post
    That roof is way beyond cool. I assume you have a battery bank that it charges?

    For those that do not understand, the carbon in coal is locked in and can only be released by burning. The carbon in wood is released by burning, or by the wood simply decaying. Either way, it is short term. Whether we agree with Lee on this issue or not, he is certainly doing more than talking the talk, he walking the walk. We should all be so driven by our beliefs.
    Spot on, JW. As a tree grows it removes carbon from the atmosphere and stores it as tissue giving off oxygen in the process. Once dead it returns the carbon to the atmosphere consuming oxygen as it burns or decays slowly.

    As to the solar panels, we have no battery. We are very fortunate in that our provider is a co-op. They bank our excess production and give it back to us when we have exhausted our bank in the winter. We balance the books every April and the array is sized to provide about 90% of our consumption. We are about 7 years into an 11 year payback so in less than 5 years the array will have paid for itself and our total energy costs, heat, lights, hot water, will drop to about $400 a year here in Montana. It was as much a decision born from economics as environmentalism.

    Edit: I forgot to mention our co-op banks our excess and returns it to us in a 1:1 ratio, some power companies 'buy' excess at wholesale and sell it back at retail, here that wholesale price is about half the retail. I have a friend in San Diego that came up against this and went for the Tesla Powerwall to give as little energy as possible to his power provider.
    5 Production colonies, 1 side by side 5 frame nuc for support- 7 working queens is all I want.

  16. #35
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    To all. The issue of global warming, or more accurately, man-made global warming, and what many believe, is closely tied to their political affiliation. However, the rules of this forum specifically prohibit political and religious discussion. Please do your best to leave politics out and instead argue about the science, and even discuss ways that we all can make a positive impact on our environment. Some ideas proposed by a certain group in congress are outlanishly stupid in my opinion, like banning jet airplanes, in favor of what, walking?

    Johno's contributions like lowering thermostats in the winter and raising them during the summer make both good environmental and economic sense. Any long term solutions to the issue must do so as well.

    Just read your response Lee. Wow. $400/ year. My electric bill here can reach that in one month during the winter.
    Thankfully, the bees are smarter than I am. They are doing well, in spite of my efforts to help them.

  17. #36
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    If you want some food for thought have a look at the work of George Mobus He doesn't march to the tune of any special interest group that I can see. I have not seen anyone who digs deeper for root cause of our predicament. Here is the link to his topics index.

    https://faculty.washington.edu/gmobu...riesIndex.html

    Main page of his blog. https://questioneverything.typepad.com/

    Somewhere in his work he touches on the many ways we cleverly and conveniently deceive ourselves about what we really are doing. Probably the majority of our misconceptions are self induced.
    Last edited by crofter; 10-13-2019 at 06:07 PM. Reason: add link
    Frank

  18. #37
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    JW the settings of my thermostat have nothing to do with climate change, It is purely for financial consideration and I am comfortable at those temperatures. Now the whole of climate change is politically driven some may deny that all they like but it is a fact so to discuss climate change will ultimtely lead to the politics thereof. Now if the climate change guys get their own way there will be no discussion as climate change is settled science!

  19. #38
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    Sorry John, did not mean to put words in your mouth. Likewise, my thermostat settings are based on my electric bill and any environmental benefit is simply bonus. I do hate waste in any form though , whether it is food not eaten and thrown away, or material goods discarded instead of repaired. My point on this was economics will drive conservation, not dire predictions of doom and gloom and mass extermination. Unfortunantly, there are those that would intend to force the economic issue by unfair taxation. It did not work well in colonial times and it won't work well today either.
    Thankfully, the bees are smarter than I am. They are doing well, in spite of my efforts to help them.

  20. #39
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    I can think of no better illustration to depict the difficulty of avoiding politics in a subject of this nature than this;

    "However, the rules of this forum specifically prohibit political and religious discussion. Please do your best to leave politics out and instead argue about the science, and even discuss ways that we all can make a positive impact on our environment."

    Followed by this:

    "Some ideas proposed by a certain group in congress are outlanishly stupid in my opinion, like banning jet airplanes, in favor of what, walking?"

    Sorry, JW, but it's just so darn funny!
    5 Production colonies, 1 side by side 5 frame nuc for support- 7 working queens is all I want.

  21. #40
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    Default Re: Global Warming

    Fell off the tightrope on that one huh? I tried to pick an example that I thought even the most hard core environmentalist would find difficult to accept.
    Thankfully, the bees are smarter than I am. They are doing well, in spite of my efforts to help them.

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