GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees. - Page 19
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  1. #361
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by Litsinger View Post
    So I saw this on another forum today and immediately thought of your experimentations- have you ever researched this one?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwjTXJp-OVc

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_SKxzuqfDs

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMb7707-qUM

    While I have heard of running two-queen colonies, I have never heard of having three hives connected together with only excluders separating them. I am sure it has been done before, but it would be really interesting to test this theory and see if the colonies do in-fact work together to normalize surplus honey storage in all three super stacks.
    Looked.
    Well, this is not for me even IF I had time/resources.

    The main argument against, as of me - this is working against the distributed way I prefer.
    This is worse than a row of the hives.
    In this case, the bees in the row of the hives are deliberately connected and the bees are mixed up.
    Well, looks like a case of Titanic to me.
    It will sink in a spectacular fashion due to the parasite/infection explosion (IF meant to be as a through-away/harvest-oriented setup - then OK - it may produce tons of honey).

    Over-engineered to, IMO.

    PS:
    I suppose GG proposed "bee-wall" can be compared to a row of hives too;
    well - I personally would "manage" the bee-wall at near-zero investment - let them die and let them do as wish - harvest/clean-out the wall sections a couple-times per year - now that sounds like a worthwhile investment to me; GG needs to build a wall anyway, might as make the wall a bit "thicker" and drill few holes into ot - that is the essential difference - need that wall anyway - Man! I really like that kind of a "bee-wall" idea - go up North deer-hunting; while at it, harvest your honey too - a double-whammer.
    Former "smoker boy". Classic, square 12 frame Dadants >> Long hive/Short frame/chemical-free experimentations.

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  3. #362
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by Litsinger View Post
    So I saw this on another forum today and immediately thought of your experimentations- have you ever researched this one?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwjTXJp-OVc

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_SKxzuqfDs

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMb7707-qUM

    While I have heard of running two-queen colonies, I have never heard of having three hives connected together with only excluders separating them. I am sure it has been done before, but it would be really interesting to test this theory and see if the colonies do in-fact work together to normalize surplus honey storage in all three super stacks.
    Russ, it would need to be way better than normalize, as you are adding risk, and complexity. if any 1 hive gets bugs they all do. And "Normalize " is that an old world word for "put supers on the wrong hive"? multi queen can be fun, several caveats, they do not superceed properly, have a queen so what if 1 fails. bees can migrate to the "most best phermones", A swarm, now there is a sigh to see, 1/2 to 2/3 of the complex is going to leave, may be cells all over and 10 - 15 after swarms, multi queen does not need to wait till capping the Q cell to leave. Interesting unless you were counting on a crop. Re queening is also fickle as "they" have a queen or 2 so why accept. If lots of bees glam onto the best queen that stack may run out of winter stores and the poor queens make if fine. Seems to me a fun way to while away some time if you what to spend it and learn some corner case things.
    GG

  4. #363
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gray Goose View Post
    Russ, it would need to be way better than normalize, as you are adding risk, and complexity. if any 1 hive gets bugs they all do. .....
    GG
    This is a case of OVER-centralization with all the associated benefits and risks.
    Maybe a good prayer actually helps.
    Don't know.
    Lots and lots work/maintenance too as for me.

    I like GG's "bee-wall" proposal a lot, however.
    Kind of centralized too - but initial construction/long-term management overhead is very low potentially (if you want it to be very low).
    Former "smoker boy". Classic, square 12 frame Dadants >> Long hive/Short frame/chemical-free experimentations.

  5. #364
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by GregV View Post
    In this case, the bees in the row of the hives are deliberately connected and the bees are mixed up.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gray Goose View Post
    Russ, it would need to be way better than normalize, as you are adding risk, and complexity. i
    Gents:

    Thank you for your replies- I am afraid that my post emphasized the wrong aspect of why I shared it here insofar that what I thought most interesting were the modular, self-supporting frames that could be installed warm-way or cold-way, don't require a frame rest and are stackable that I thought might be of interest/inspiration to GregV in his desire to retrofit some boxes he has into compact vertical configurations.

    I parenthetically noted that the three queen thing was really interesting and I wondered how it could work practically, and you both bring out a lot of good reasons to avoid such an approach.

    I apologize for the confusion, and I do like the 'bee wall' idea.

  6. #365
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by Litsinger View Post
    Gents:

    ........
    I apologize for the confusion, and I do like the 'bee wall' idea.
    No need to apologize.

    This case brings many interesting contexts - all mixed in-one.

    One of them is this - a priest with all of his worries and time concentrated on, really, just saving himself - has lots and lots of time to tinker with his hives (while rehearsing the prayers).
    Many unwashed folks with a bunch of kids to raise, on the other hand, would prefer simple straw hives to scoop some honey in the fall (and forgotten otherwise).
    Former "smoker boy". Classic, square 12 frame Dadants >> Long hive/Short frame/chemical-free experimentations.

  7. #366
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by Litsinger View Post
    Gents:

    ..... I thought most interesting were the modular, self-supporting frames that could be installed warm-way or cold-way, don't require a frame rest and are stackable that I thought might be of interest/inspiration to GregV in his desire to retrofit some boxes he has into compact vertical configurations.

    .
    Now, this got me thinking again...
    Last week I was off and managed to slap together another hybrid hive and a batch of frames.
    20190815_182059.jpg
    20190815_191257.jpg
    20190815_191315.jpg
    20190818_163505.jpg
    20190818_163454.jpg

    I still hate how long it takes me to build my custom frames (even with repurposed Lang frames).
    Former "smoker boy". Classic, square 12 frame Dadants >> Long hive/Short frame/chemical-free experimentations.

  8. #367
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    What I will do IF really hurting for time - I will do ONE single manipulation - will zip together two Lang meduim frames and will simply stand them up straight, using the ears as the stands.
    Because I can.
    They will be just free standing in my hives in between the hanging frames.
    One way - use them as honey-frames at the honey-end of the long hives - add them last in the season and remove them first and extract in standard equipment.
    Like so:
    20190817_163756.jpg
    Former "smoker boy". Classic, square 12 frame Dadants >> Long hive/Short frame/chemical-free experimentations.

  9. #368
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by Litsinger View Post
    Gents:

    Thank you for your replies- I am afraid that my post emphasized the wrong aspect of why I shared it here insofar that what I thought most interesting were the modular, self-supporting frames that could be installed warm-way or cold-way, don't require a frame rest and are stackable that I thought might be of interest/inspiration to GregV in his desire to retrofit some boxes he has into compact vertical configurations.

    I parenthetically noted that the three queen thing was really interesting and I wondered how it could work practically, and you both bring out a lot of good reasons to avoid such an approach.

    I apologize for the confusion, and I do like the 'bee wall' idea.
    No Apology needed Russ, I whole heartily recommend you try it. the learning is worth it, I gained a lot of understanding from Multi Queen approaches.
    It is a different animal some of the things you will pick up I listed.
    There will be some non Glamour things with multi Queen and Now with Varroa, it could be for the sake of the "experiment" you would need to OAV or something , else it would wobble a bit. You are right it is really interesting. give it a go sometime.
    GG

  10. #369
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by GregV View Post
    ... will zip together two Lang meduim frames and will simply stand them up straight, using the ears as the stands.
    This sounds like a good idea, Greg. I am impressed by your ingenuity.

  11. #370
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gray Goose View Post
    I whole heartily recommend you try it. the learning is worth it, I gained a lot of understanding from Multi Queen approaches.
    Thanks, Gray Goose. I figure I'd better see if I can figure standard single-queen approaches before I even think about experimenting with stuff like this- but I am sure there is a lot of interesting things that can be observed by giving a multi-queen approach a try.

  12. #371
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by GregV View Post
    Day 5.
    The brood is starting to smell not-so-fresh.
    Mites are still running around the comb.
    Day 7.
    Looked.
    Found a mite sitting on the comb (as if asleep).
    Prodded with a needle - it grabbed onto it.
    So - free-roaming mites are still alive.
    Former "smoker boy". Classic, square 12 frame Dadants >> Long hive/Short frame/chemical-free experimentations.

  13. #372
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by GregV View Post
    So - free-roaming mites are still alive.
    They are unstoppable!

  14. #373
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by Litsinger View Post
    They are unstoppable!
    Somewhere along the way, I lost a day or two.
    So - I took the drone comb out on the night of August 19th.
    This makes tonight the 6th day.

    No one caught my crooked math.
    Anyway, the day 6 is today.
    My buddy Vic is still around, grabs onto the needle for his acrobatics, and otherwise lives comfortably in my kitchen.
    20190825_212831.jpg
    20190825_212725.jpg
    Former "smoker boy". Classic, square 12 frame Dadants >> Long hive/Short frame/chemical-free experimentations.

  15. #374
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Donno what I am going to do with all these queens.
    I just combined two nucs and thought - whew, one down.

    Well, darn thing - today found TWO fresh queens on neighboring frames in another nuc (they decided to replace a new queen by two newer queens).
    Well, darn thing - had to make up another mating nuc on the spot again - one up.

    Still hovering around 20 units (the Zombees included).
    Looks like this is going to be a repeat of last year - all way from 20-framers to 2-framers.
    Former "smoker boy". Classic, square 12 frame Dadants >> Long hive/Short frame/chemical-free experimentations.

  16. #375
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by GregV View Post
    Somewhere along the way, I lost a day or two.
    So - I took the drone comb out on the night of August 19th.
    This makes tonight the 6th day.

    No one caught my crooked math.
    Anyway, the day 6 is today.
    My buddy Vic is still around, grabs onto the needle for his acrobatics, and otherwise lives comfortably in my kitchen.
    20190825_212831.jpg
    20190825_212725.jpg
    Donno how Vic is doing.
    Forgot to look; too busy now.
    Former "smoker boy". Classic, square 12 frame Dadants >> Long hive/Short frame/chemical-free experimentations.

  17. #376
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by GregV View Post
    ...one down.

    ...one up.
    Isn't this normal beekeeping math? . Sounds like you have quite a knack for propagating queens.

    Please do keep us posted when Vic finally bites the dust.

  18. #377
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by Litsinger View Post
    Isn't this normal beekeeping math? . Sounds like you have quite a knack for propagating queens.

    Please do keep us posted when Vic finally bites the dust.
    I don't know, I need to figure out how to winter every mated queen somehow (those of value).
    Just putting one of these with the Zombees will not help much - mites will overrun them all at this point.
    Maybe I will experiment wintering small nucs again for the experience.

    Vic is done and I have not a clue on which day (for sure after the day 6).
    Looks like committed suicide by jumping into honey (bunch of them mites are floating in honey around island - the chunk of comb).
    Pretty much all larva is rotting by now and I wonder if they could not longer tolerate the stench.
    Will just jump the larva corpses back to the Zombees and let them have at it - suck on the rotting blood and flesh, what not.
    The hive of the dead and lazy Zombees.
    Former "smoker boy". Classic, square 12 frame Dadants >> Long hive/Short frame/chemical-free experimentations.

  19. #378
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by GregV View Post
    Vic is done and I have not a clue on which day (for sure after the day 6).
    Certainly lends anecdotal credence to the idea of varroa hopping-off one bee at a foraging site and then hitch-hiking a ride on a subsequent forager days later.

  20. #379
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    Quote Originally Posted by Litsinger View Post
    Certainly lends anecdotal credence to the idea of varroa hopping-off one bee at a foraging site and then hitch-hiking a ride on a subsequent forager days later.
    For sure, the agility and robustness of the mite is superior.
    The mite easily running up and down the shiny needle was cool to watch.
    Everyone can repeat this and make a nice video (my phone could not focus well for the video).

    I kinda observed it and thought of the futility to us (the humans) somehow try to rid of the mites.
    It is waste of time.
    And why...
    Darn bees will do it just as well and better.
    Doing it already.
    Former "smoker boy". Classic, square 12 frame Dadants >> Long hive/Short frame/chemical-free experimentations.

  21. #380
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    Default Re: GregV's Alternative way to keep (have?) bees.

    On my way to the office I thought - I am not really a "weekend beekeeper" (ok beehaver, whatever.... details).
    I am once-a-month bee-owner.
    That would be a more accurate concept.

    After the Zombee butchering event, I never made it back yet.
    No clue what is there.
    The queen-less Zombees should have raised a new queen by now and my drone-laying scheme probably fell through.
    Too bad, but I was busy building an extractor and spinning honey.
    Can not be everywhere at once.
    Former "smoker boy". Classic, square 12 frame Dadants >> Long hive/Short frame/chemical-free experimentations.

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