Best way to kill a sick hive?
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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Spring, Texas
    Posts
    234

    Default Best way to kill a sick hive?

    I have been bitching on the board about my nucs. I did everything wrong and did not inspect the nucs with the beekeeper among other dumb things. The bee keeper seller has hundreds of hives said his nucs are all sold and can not swap for a new one or he did not offer to help me or even to give me a queen or q cell or a frame of young larva and eggs.

    Another gentleman from Houston with just 11 hives offered me a queen and frame for free for the strong box since there is not evidence of eggs and larva in a normal set up even after I offered to pay him for his help.

    Now it was all my fault that neither nuc had a queen visable, eggs, or young larva. Had lots brood and few older larva about ready to cap. One nuc had no flying bees when I got them and had sick bees falling out the door on the ground unable to fly. I got the nucs two weeks ago today and yet to see a normal flying bee work the hive. I was also told both nucs were strong nucs in the original boxes and queens but how do you explain the lack of eggs and young larva in both boxes. Even if the strong box had eggs and larva I could have tried to fix the weak box. Funny for an original nuc not to have eggs and multiple stages of larva.

    The other nuc had a ton of bees, and the same funny problem of No visible queen and No eggs or young larva. Just older larva and lots of capped brood. In two weeks this bunch of bees are closing in on pulling a lot of the second deep. Throw out the 4 out side frames and the out side of the next closest and I am damasked at what they are doing. The are drinking sugar water so that it looks like beer drinking on St Pattys.

    I have more detailed grips with the beekeeper but I decided to destroy the weak sick hive.

    What is the best and easiest to kill this hive off and isolate it because I do not know why the bees are not working and I have dead and sick bees on the ground each day. Pesticide? deformed wing virus? There are still no bees visible or working at the opening.

    Sorry I am ranting again but I hate to get screwed. Bottom Line:

    What is the best way to quickly kill this ML nuc and dispose of it in case it is some thing seriously wrong with this box and not too many mites or pesticide.
    Jim

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Spring, Texas
    Posts
    234

    Default Best way to kill a sick hive?

    I got two nucs two weeks ago today and bitched multiple times to me getting screwed by a big time beekeeper that has not offered any help at all, Not even a replacement queen or frame of eggs and brood.

    Anyway one nuc is sick with bees that fall out and die and cannot fly. I have yet to see a normal bee working and flying from this hive and no guard bees even after I put them back in their nuc box and cleaned up the hive.

    Pesticide? deformed wing or ????.

    What it the best and easiest way to kill this off and package the infected box so other bees can not get into it?

    Jim

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Aylett, Virginia
    Posts
    3,421

    Default Re: Best way to kill a sick hive?

    Jim, I wasn't kidding when I suggested soapy water. It is safe and effective. Well, not so safe for the bees that get soaped. Take pictures of everything first. You will need to figure out what happened to this nuc to make them sick. You should not use any of the hive components until you know for sure.
    Thankfully, the bees are smarter than I am. They are doing well, in spite of my efforts to help them.

  5. #4
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Sheboygan County, WI
    Posts
    211

    Default Re: Best way to kill a sick hive?

    Jim,
    What is your mite count on the sick hive ? Do a test and report back.

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Lumpkin County, GA
    Posts
    810

    Default Re: Best way to kill a sick hive?

    Do they have stores in the box? They may be starving. I wouldn't be in a huge hurry to kill them. I've been screwed by a company selling nucs but don't take it out on the bees. They can recover from a myriad of issues, you will just have to give them time.

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Bunker Hill, IL
    Posts
    891

    Default Re: Best way to kill a sick hive?

    killing the hive doesnt solve the pesticide issue, the bees are picking that up in the environment and bringing it back. Even if you burnt the hive and put a new new one 5 feet away, its entirely possible that the brand new healthy hive will develop the same issues if its pesticide related.

    dead bees on the ground is not a mite problem. Hives with varroa mite problems that are sever enough to collapse a hive, you can easly find mites rideing on the backs of bees and certainly on the bottom of drones. It also wont be limited to one hive.

    Judging from your post your an inexperienced bee keeper. The person who sold you bees is under no obligation to be your mentor. Find a local club or local beekeeper and ask an experienced beek to give you a hand. Your only going to solve your issue once someone with experience looks at your hives.

  8. #7
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Sheboygan County, WI
    Posts
    211

    Default Re: Best way to kill a sick hive?

    Quote Originally Posted by schmism View Post

    dead bees on the ground is not a mite problem.
    Hives with mites can give the bees DWF, which the original poster stated in other threads, that bees out of this hive can not fly, fall off the frame on inspection, fall and don't fly, and walk out and don't fly..... so, in my opinion, mites could be the problem and could have given the bees DW virus.

    So, before I would kill them, I would do a mite count on some of the live bees, and check # / 300 bees. The bees are very new to him, so find out what you got....... they could be packed with mites from the supplier, maybe not. Need to find out one way or another though, but only if you want to try to narrow down what is going on.

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    Spring, Texas
    Posts
    234

    Default Re: Best way to kill a sick hive?

    I would be more prone to try some of the ideas but THERE IS NO QUEEN IN THE BOX. I also put the frames back in the the ML nuc box that they came in and cleaned the hive and gear like Nancy said to. All the hive, feeder, and my gear has all be cleaned and germicided except for the frames that had not pulling and were just washed and left in the sun till I found out how to germicide them.

    I am inexperienced and did everything wrong buying bees from this guy including believing and trusting him. He left them out as his shop for an early pick up.

    I am not looking for a mentor but I expect a fair deal "nuc with queen, eggs, and assorted larva and brood. Neither box had any eggs or young larva which is strange for an original nuc box esp if you had eggs you could regroup and try to grow a new queen if you had eggs and young larva which I did not.

    I called couple days later and the beekeeper said that I must have let the pesticide get them. They were like that when I got them because he stated both were original nucs witha strong bee population and not a flip and drop. No offer for a new queen or larva to try to grow a new one when he has 700+ hives. The other stmt was I Must have injured the queen in the strong box. Still does not explain why NEITHER had viable evidence of an active queen at the time or after I picked up the two boxes.


    They are sick. When I picked the up there were NO flying bees, no guard bees, just some bees on the 5 frames.
    Beekeeper said maybe pesticide but offered no replacement or queen since there is No queen in the box.

    In 14 days no normal bee activity where the other hive is going strong and working hard to pull out a second deep box.

    No queen and when I moved them from the hive there were some flying bees but others on the ground in front of the hive and dead bees on the block in front just like it has been since I installed them into the hive. I have watched multiple bees run out of the hive and flip on their back or run off the landing board and not able to fly. There have been 40-50 bees a day doing this or on the ground.
    Yes there is honey and pollen in the extra frames.

    Most of the brood has hatched . There also was NO work on the added frames. Both hives were similar with lots brood and some honey and older larva. Nancy rec scrape wax off, Clorox scrub, and let sit in the sun for a day or so. I just washed the frames because of no work but is there a better way to germicide them?

    There is something wrong. These bees had 2 weeks to stop strange behavior and I cannot explain why ALL the flying foraging bees were gone when I got them.

    Just looking for something to spray into the nuc and seal it up and dispose of it. It may just be too many mites but why no foraging bees or guard bees? It is time to move on and quit bitching about the guy who sold the nucs. Either you have ethics or not and if not it you are not going to change them.

    I just do not want my strong hive to get what ever this have has.

    Texas Apiaries at A&M felt pesticide or deformed could be the problem over the phone.

    I have been on this topic since the Sunday week I got back after putting the bees out that Friday before. Without a queen they are dead in 45 days or so.

    I just need to do it cleanly so that all the bees stay in the ML nuc box.
    WHAT TO USE?
    Last edited by JimD; 06-01-2018 at 05:16 PM.

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Rosebud Missouri
    Posts
    3,946

    Default Re: Best way to kill a sick hive?

    Jim
    I have never tried either of these recommendations but just read a subject where experienced beekeepers discussed this. Close up the hive and put some paint stripper, gasoline or rubbing alcohol and slam the lid shut and the fumes will kill them.
    Good luck
    gww
    zone 5b

  11. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Issaquah,WA,USA
    Posts
    2,758

    Default Re: Best way to kill a sick hive?

    Can you call a local club and have them come over and help you before you do anything drastic. A second opinion with second eyes would be helpful for you, Dont kill them yet. You should always find a local club.

    http://www.harriscountybeekeepers.org/
    http://www.bees-on-the-net.com/texas-bee-clubs/
    https://www.facebook.com/HOTBeekeepersAssociation/
    http://texasbeekeepers.org/

    Call someone before you kill.
    Last edited by EastSideBuzz; 06-01-2018 at 07:17 PM.

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