No more grafting!!
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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
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    ElDorado,Arkansas,USA
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    1,604

    Default No more grafting!!

    I went to graft some and man I found out the old eyes and shaky hands just dont get it anymore.I am back to congesting hives and getting them to produce swarm cells and cutting them out.I think I get much better queens that way also.Oh and magnifiers you can see them good but those shaky hands just wont let you graft!!! You young guys will get there one day also.

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Suffolk Co, NY, USA
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    3,664

    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    Time to cell punch snapper1d.

    Here is my cell punch tool. cellpunch.jpg

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
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    ElDorado,Arkansas,USA
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    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    I have tried cell punch.I have a couple tools made up but I just do much better with swarm cells.But I do like cell punching and will do it some more.It does work pretty good with hair roller cages and stuff that goes with the nicot system.

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    Red Bud, IL, USA
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    1,809

    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    You young guys will get there one day also.
    and it ain't for wimps!
    “The single biggest problem with communication is the illusion that it has taken place.” -George Bernard Shaw

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Lottsburg, Virginia USA
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    1,770

    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    Come on Snapper hold the grafting tool with both hands LOL I am heading for 75 now so how much longer do I have. I don't have trouble grafting but the enthusiasm seems to be waning and I procrastinate and keep making excuses why I should not go ahead and graft,
    Johno

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Location
    Menlo Park CA
    Posts
    21

    Default

    You can steady your hand using a fulcrum finger. This link shows how we do it in dentistry. https://pocketdentistry.com/instrume...periodontitis/

    Only bad news is that in dentistry, if you get real shakey, you need to press harder on your fulcrum. With wax that doesn't work, but you could lay a thin board across the frame to steady on. Hope this helps!

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    Aroostook, ME, USA
    Posts
    219

    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    Once watched a sign painter that hand did lettering on doors/windows/etc. He had this dowel with a rubber ball on the end. He would lay the dowel across the work surface and rest his hand on that so it would stabilize it. Maybe that would help ya?

    On the other hand, why not use one of the nicot systems?

  9. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Yuba County, California, USA
    Posts
    6,566

    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    I don't need enough queens at one time or on an ongoing basis to warrant grafting, and my eyes and patience are not what they used to be either. And waiting for a hive to go into swarm mode does not give me the timing needed to be more precise with when cells will be emerging and when mating nucs need to be made up. Properly set up and executed fly-back and cut-down splits give me plenty of cells, and timing is just like grafting, so these are the methods I've mostly been using for the last 4 or more years.

    Those of us who raise queens now and then, or ongoing in time, we all come up with a system that works well for us in our situation. As the old saying is "There's more than one way to skin a cat" so also there is more than one way to raise a good queen.

  10. #9
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Algoma District Northern Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    5,049

    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    The Snelgrove double screen board begets all the queens I need. I made up cell cutters too but have only done dry runs with it. Some types of shake are hard to compensate for. So called "intentional tremor" is difficult. The name sounds like you are doing it on purpose! The more self imposed pressure to still it, the worse it gets.

    Yep, getting old sucks, but what is the alternative? With a bit of imagination there is usually a work around.
    Frank

  11. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    ElDorado,Arkansas,USA
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    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthMaine View Post
    Once watched a sign painter that hand did lettering on doors/windows/etc. He had this dowel with a rubber ball on the end. He would lay the dowel across the work surface and rest his hand on that so it would stabilize it. Maybe that would help ya?

    On the other hand, why not use one of the nicot systems?
    Never had much luck with the nicot system but I do have a brand new one and going to try it again.

  12. #11
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    Apr 2011
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    ElDorado,Arkansas,USA
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    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    Quote Originally Posted by RayMarler View Post
    I don't need enough queens at one time or on an ongoing basis to warrant grafting, and my eyes and patience are not what they used to be either. And waiting for a hive to go into swarm mode does not give me the timing needed to be more precise with when cells will be emerging and when mating nucs need to be made up. Properly set up and executed fly-back and cut-down splits give me plenty of cells, and timing is just like grafting, so these are the methods I've mostly been using for the last 4 or more years.

    Those of us who raise queens now and then, or ongoing in time, we all come up with a system that works well for us in our situation. As the old saying is "There's more than one way to skin a cat" so also there is more than one way to raise a good queen.
    I have plenty of time to do swarm cells now.Its either watching the fish jumping around the dock,Playing with the dogs or playing with the bees now days.

  13. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Yuba County, California, USA
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    6,566

    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    Snapper...
    Three great wholesome ways to enjoy the days in a wonderful life.

  14. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    West Bath, Maine, United States
    Posts
    2,475

    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    Quote Originally Posted by crofter View Post
    The more self imposed pressure to still it, the worse it gets.
    All you young fellows and fellowettes heed those words.

    Having tense muscles while doing fine motor skills will get you in the end. It is blood flow. Like running an engine with low oil pressure. If you have to concentrate on relaxing you muscles, do it. Better now than later when it will not help much.

    Disease of the scribes; like that name better. There are little tricks that sometimes work to stop the shake. Touching the other hand is one for me.

    Typing, grafting , video games (Makes me cringe to watch them, hxll makes me hurt to watch) Relax, It will not make you slower, just healthier.
    Last edited by Saltybee; 03-29-2018 at 09:33 AM. Reason: duh
    It is not true that you cannot teach an old dog new tricks.
    They can learn them, they just can't do them.

  15. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Monkton, MD
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    122

    Default

    Thanks for the heads-up SaltyBee. My back is already telling me to switch to 8 frame boxes.

    Side note: The tremor that older sign painters develop is usually a result of long-term lead exposure from all the paints. Many used to get the shakes by age 35, and then found that alcohol would calm the shakes. Vicious cycle can ensue. Thankfully, technology has found healthier ways to make signs. (I used to work in the industry.)

  16. #15

    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthMaine View Post
    On the other hand, why not use one of the nicot systems?
    Conventional grafting is impossible for me. My issue isn’t magnification but needing more contrast. I need lots of light in that cell to see an egg. I tried.
    I played with the Nicot system and had the same problem.
    The Jenter works for me. It has more pieces but when you remove the outer case, the egg is just laying there, fully exposed in the open. Sadly, I’ve set it aside as I stay so far behind on everything else in springtime that I had to make decisions about what had priority. I hope to slow down a bit in the next year or two….and I may break it back out.
    Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted. - Emerson

  17. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
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    West Bath, Maine, United States
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    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Ruthz View Post
    and then found that alcohol would calm the shakes. Vicious cycle can ensue.
    Still the best vascular dilator. But yeah.
    It is not true that you cannot teach an old dog new tricks.
    They can learn them, they just can't do them.

  18. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    helenwood,tn.usa
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    348

    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    Quote Originally Posted by NorthMaine View Post
    Once watched a sign painter that hand did lettering on doors/windows/etc. He had this dowel with a rubber ball on the end. He would lay the dowel across the work surface and rest his hand on that so it would stabilize it. Maybe that would help ya?

    On the other hand, why not use one of the nicot systems?
    it's called a mahl stick made signs for about 30 yrs
    first colony out of a log 1983 beekeeping about 15 years. Warning i could be an idiot. I'm from South Jersey.

  19. #18
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    helenwood,tn.usa
    Posts
    348

    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    my eyes a bad too so when I need queens I stick a top bar with a starter strip or a strip of old comb in the hive that I want to breed from. after the queen lays it up I put it into a starter colony. there are about 30 cells on that comb SAM_2205.jpg
    first colony out of a log 1983 beekeeping about 15 years. Warning i could be an idiot. I'm from South Jersey.

  20. #19
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Nassau County, New York, USA
    Posts
    458

    Default Re: No more grafting!!

    USDA Zone 7a - elevation 148 feet

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