Disappointed with UPS shipping
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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Sacramento, CA, USA
    Posts
    7,861

    Default Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Hi, All!


    My queen bees are supposed to arrive here today. I went to the UPS hub to pick up the queen package. The store clerk
    said that my package is still at the New York UPS hub that nobody has pick it up for delivery yet. So the seller checked in to ship
    out my package, but nobody at the UPS store there take up the task of shipping my package out.

    Me and the seller agreed on a 2nd day UPS shipping as opposed to the normal one week shipping going the normal USPS route.
    So why do I have to paid more for the 2nd day shipping when I cannot get my package on time? And why did my package got stuck
    at the New York UPS hub without anybody paying attention to the queen bees? I'm not happy today!

    And what can I do to help expedite this process since I already emailed the seller to let him know about this situation? Am I entitle to
    any type of a compensation also? Help!
    Don't mix foreign bees into a virgin hive. She might get balled 100% of the time! When will you ever learn, huh?

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2017
    Location
    DuPage County Illinois
    Posts
    179

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Use USPS.

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Rader, Greene County, Tennessee, USA
    Posts
    10,856

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    All UPS packages have a tracking number. Looking up that number on the UPS website will tell you everything about that package, including when the package was accepted (received) by UPS. And all UPS packages have a guaranteed delivery date, so you can easily see whether the package is on-time for the service level that the shipper chose (and is paying for).

    If the package is not delivered within the guaranteed date, UPS will normally pay a claim*. If the shipper simply was late delivering the package to UPS, that is the shipper's problem, and UPS won't do anything about it.




    Note on terms: The queen seller is the "shipper". UPS is the "carrier". UPS, Fedex, and USPS are not shippers!

    *UPS considers bees "live animals". https://www.ups.com/us/en/help-cente...s/animals.page

    Any package containing a live animal shall be considered a perishable commodity and will be accepted for transportation solely at the shipper´s risk for any damage or loss arising from the perishable nature of the item. UPS shall not be liable for any special, incidental, or consequential damages.

    https://www.ups.com/us/en/help-cente...s/animals.page
    Second-Day shipping is a poor choice for shipping bees, as it violates this UPS term of service:
    Live animals will only be accepted for transportation when shipped by any UPS service that guarantees delivery the next day. Shipments must not be offered to UPS on Fridays or before a holiday in the origin or destination country.

    https://www.ups.com/us/en/help-cente...s/animals.page
    Graham
    USDA Zone 7A Elevation 1400 ft

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Aylett, Virginia
    Posts
    4,123

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    If ups did not deliver on time I belive you are entitled to a refund of the second day air fees. Likewise if the queen is not alive after the delay. UPS does not like to ship bees. Use USPS. My post office calls me when the bees arrive so I can make pick up arrangements.

    Graham posted while I was still typing.

    Additional edit. I typically pay about $10.00 for second day shipping through usps. Ups next day is outside of my budget.
    Thankfully, the bees are smarter than I am. They are doing well, in spite of my efforts to help them.

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Jackson, Ohio (SE Ohio) USA
    Posts
    817

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Totally agree with Rader, UPS is a class act, you go online and select overnight, two day, etc. print out label, drop off at their office or they pick up (more $$) assign a tracking number so you or shipper can see where it's at every step of the way. If they don't deliver on time and/or shipment is damaged they will pay claim. You might want to check with the shipper/seller to see what was paid for.

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Sacramento, CA, USA
    Posts
    7,861

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Thanks all for the information. Seller said he ship 2nd day air. So UPS has the delay for whatever reason I
    don't know. Going to the UPS place again and will track the package on their site also. Currently the package is
    at the Louisville, KY hub. I will reconsider using the UPS and the 2nd day shipping thanks to the post above about
    their live animal policy. Will let this issue go if the queens are still alive on arrive. Seller cannot do anything he said. Always learning something!
    Don't mix foreign bees into a virgin hive. She might get balled 100% of the time! When will you ever learn, huh?

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Washington County, Maine
    Posts
    3,796

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Shipments go awry at times. I had an experience with USPS this summer that required me to drive to their processing center to pickup my bees on a Saturday. They didn't have anything scheduled to make the delivery as the shipment required. With all big outfits, the person who accepts the shipment ought to know that the firm they are representing has the capability and the intent of meeting the delivery terms.

    I'm not trying to shift the blame to the OP - whenever I have bees shipped to me I, I'm checking tracking at a minimum every day, if not every few hours. More often than not, I will notice a problem before the carrier does. Sometimes, all it takes is a phone call to solve things, and you may find a CSR somewhere that really goes to bat for you.

    It is not just the bee deliveries that I track, but other merchandise too. Often I'll use it in a way the carrier never intended - can I have the dog loose this afternoon or am I expecting a delivery? (knowing the dog is super friendly and likes to get in the delivery truck.)

    Alas, all the carriers are imperfect, and our little shipments don't have great consequence to them.

  9. #8
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Edgefield County, South Carolina
    Posts
    1,019

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Yep you are entitled to a REFUND.... a refund of the shipping cost only. Ask about the 17 queens I had that died in shipment. Yes sir..."We will refund your shipment cost." Luckily the supplier made the queens good as was what he said would be the practice if they arrived dead.
    sc-bee

  10. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Seattle WA
    Posts
    1,202

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    UPS delivers over 5 billion packages a year. Sometimes there are issues. Work with the seller to get new queens. A reputable seller will send you a new shipment without charging you again if your queens died. The seller should get the refund from UPS and forward it on to you.

  11. #10
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Edgefield County, South Carolina
    Posts
    1,019

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    In some areas USPS no longer allows shipping of queens in flat rate boxes....
    sc-bee

  12. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2016
    Location
    Scottsville, VA
    Posts
    15

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Agreed. If the SHIPPER did not drop the package off prior to the driver's pickup time, then it is on your shipper, not UPS. Find that key piece of information out first.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rader Sidetrack View Post
    All UPS packages have a tracking number. Looking up that number on the UPS website will tell you everything about that package, including when the package was accepted (received) by UPS. And all UPS packages have a guaranteed delivery date, so you can easily see whether the package is on-time for the service level that the shipper chose (and is paying for).

    If the package is not delivered within the guaranteed date, UPS will normally pay a claim*. If the shipper simply was late delivering the package to UPS, that is the shipper's problem, and UPS won't do anything about it.




    Note on terms: The queen seller is the "shipper". UPS is the "carrier". UPS, Fedex, and USPS are not shippers!

    *UPS considers bees "live animals". https://www.ups.com/us/en/help-cente...s/animals.page



    Second-Day shipping is a poor choice for shipping bees, as it violates this UPS term of service:

  13. #12
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Location
    Wise county,Texas
    Posts
    291

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Earlier this spring, I had a couple queens shipped through UPS to me, on arrival, I asked the driver (whom I've known for several years on our route) to wait while I opened the package to check the bees, he basically quoted what Radar posted above as policy.

    Fast forward to yesterday, I had again ordered a queen from Hawaii, 2nd day air, UPS. The driver I knew had retired, so this delivery was my 1st time meeting our new route guy, as luck would have it, he is also a beekeeper and took care of the bees all day as I was on the end of his route, what luck is this?

    BTW, one USPS fella I spoke to here, said they have almost ditto policy on "live" bees, so not sure if changing would make a difference, I can see where you have a claim on non delivery fee for 2nd day air. BTW it amazes me that with all the 1000's of packages they move, I have been fortunate to get my small boxes of bees in good shape each time.

  14. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Sacramento, CA, USA
    Posts
    7,861

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Thanks, all. I got my queens shipment yesterday. There was a delay in the east coast. Must be the
    bottle neck from the 2 hurricanes before. I did not ask the clerk for the reimbursement of the shipping because
    it is only one day late and both queens are alive other than the one dead attendant. Since nothing is guaranteed to
    be perfect in this world that there is a gap (error) in between, I chose to let this one go. Main thing is I got my queens alive!
    Don't mix foreign bees into a virgin hive. She might get balled 100% of the time! When will you ever learn, huh?

  15. #14
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Rader, Greene County, Tennessee, USA
    Posts
    10,856

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Any refund that UPS might pay would go to the shipper, as that is who is paying the UPS charges*. Claims for late delivery or lost/damaged packages always have to be initiated by the shipper. Whether you might be able to get some of any possible refund depends on the shipper's policies.


    *(unless you provided your own UPS account number to bill the shipping charges to)
    Graham
    USDA Zone 7A Elevation 1400 ft

  16. #15
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Edgefield County, South Carolina
    Posts
    1,019

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Quote Originally Posted by Rader Sidetrack View Post
    Any refund that UPS might pay would go to the shipper, as that is who is paying the UPS charges*. Claims for late delivery or lost/damaged packages always have to be initiated by the shipper. Whether you might be able to get some of any possible refund depends on the shipper's policies.


    *(unless you provided your own UPS account number to bill the shipping charges to)
    I am sure this has happened to most of us with bees for a while more than once. My last issue the supplier said I could file but since he would have to supply me the paperwork anyway, he would handle it since he was familiar with the process. He replaced all 17 queens free of charge, which was the verbal stated agreement between he and I, so I do not know if shipping was refunded.
    sc-bee

  17. #16
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Washington County, Maine
    Posts
    3,796

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Quote Originally Posted by Western View Post
    BTW, one USPS fella I spoke to here, said they have almost ditto policy on "live" bees.
    Not all together true. Queens can and usually do go by air. Packages and nucs, which UPS does not accept, have to go by ground. And be in special packaging and in some cases (I'm not as up on this as I might be) with a food source that can't spill. Gotta love that syrup in the sorting equipment!

    Last I checked, Fedex does not accept live animals, except for zoo animals. I haven't figured that one out.

  18. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Weston, ME
    Posts
    1,016

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Andrew: I was told not too long ago by a local USPS office that USPS will not carry bees in Maine anymore - to your knowledge correct?

  19. #18
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Rader, Greene County, Tennessee, USA
    Posts
    10,856

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    What is a permissible item to ship via USPS, and the specific requirements for packaging that item is not something that a state/regional USPS manager or postmaster can determine. All requirements* are published in the DMM (Domestic Mail Manual) and can be reviewed online using USPS Postal Explorer.

    Bees (queens and/or package bees) are a permissible item to ship via USPS, including in the state of Maine. Imagine what chaos it would be if each state could make up their own rules about what was OK.

    You can read the rules for USPS shipping of bees here: https://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub52c5_008.htm


    *Hawaii is a special case as shipping bees to Hawaii is restricted by the USDA.

    .
    Last edited by Rader Sidetrack; 10-06-2017 at 10:07 PM. Reason: typo
    Graham
    USDA Zone 7A Elevation 1400 ft

  20. #19
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
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    Rader, Greene County, Tennessee, USA
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    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Dewey View Post
    Packages and nucs, which UPS does not accept, have to go by ground.
    UPS will accept package bees. Here is the UPS page detailing the requirements for UPS shipping of package bees: https://www.ups.com/us/en/help-cente...ontentBlock-15

    Such package bees may not have liquid syrup (in a can) in the package. Candy/fondant must be used instead of syrup.

    And ALL shipping of bees by UPS must go via a shipping "service level" that guarantees "next day" delivery, and also may not be shipped on a Friday, because all bees must be delivered the next "calendar day" (not "business day"). Note that in addition to the various "Next Day Delivery" service levels, "Ground" service is also guaranteed next day delivery if the distance is appropriate. For instance, shipping UPS Ground from points in Eastern TN to points in Western NC meets the "next day" delivery requirement for bees. Obviously one needs to look up the specific zipcodes involved to determine the acceptability of UPS Ground for shipping bees.
    Graham
    USDA Zone 7A Elevation 1400 ft

  21. #20
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Weston, ME
    Posts
    1,016

    Default Re: Disappointed with UPS shipping

    Quote Originally Posted by Rader Sidetrack View Post
    What is a permissible item to ship via USPS, and the specific requirements for packaging that item is not something that a state/regional USPS manager or postmaster can determine.
    ...
    Bees (queens and/or package bees) are a permissible item to ship via USPS, including the in state of Maine. Imagine what chaos it would be if each state could make up their own rules about what was OK.
    ...
    And so I would expect - except that I find living in northern Maine to be completely different from any of the states I have lived in (having lived in almost every east coast state). I have found the unusual to be much more normal here.
    From my memory (I would have to check old emails), a seller informed me that they could not ship bees into Maine because the post office would not carry them. I believe I checked with my local office which confirmed this.
    I found this highly strange - yet have come to (at times) have to accept odd local things as unchangeable by a mere person from "aways".

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