Beesource Beekeeping Forums banner

Very wide spacing of hives (100m) reduces mite build up

23K views 71 replies 26 participants last post by  1102009 
#1 ·
Free download (use link): http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s13592-016-0443-9

Distance between honey bee Apis mellifera colonies regulates populations of Varroa destructor at a landscape scale
Maxcy P. NOLAN IV, Keith S. DELAPLANE
Apidologie (2017) 48:8–16
DOI: 10.1007/s13592-016-0443-9

Inter-colony distance of Apis mellifera significantly affects colony numbers of the parasitic mite Varroa destructor. We set up 15 apiaries, each consisting of two colonies. Each apiary pair was assigned an inter-colony distance of 0, 10, or 100 m. Colonies were rendered nearly mite-free, then one colony in each pair was seeded with 300 female mites (mite-donor colony), while the other remained uninoculated (mite-recipient colony). After 4 months of monitoring, a whole-model analysis showed that apiaries in which colonies were spaced 100 m apart contained lower average mite numbers than 0 or 10 m apiaries. There were interactions among colony type, distance, and sampling date; however, when there were significant differences, mite numbers were always lower in 100 m apiaries than 10 m apiaries. These findings pose the possibility that Varroa populations are resource regulated at a landscape scale: near-neighbor colonies constitute reproductive resource for mites in the form of additional bee brood.​
 
See less See more
#39 ·
Did he ever said he used treated bees? There are a number of tf bee packages available in the US.
And if he does, why not?
Maybe it makes his bee stock even more resistant. Kefuss imports mites too to trigger the stock to more defense.
As I see it he only has problems with overwintering when it´s getting too warm, probably they use too much stores. No problem with mites.
 
#36 ·
Randy Oliver has published an updated version on his website called Getting Serious About Breeding and this is quoted” I recently published the article “Bee Breeding for Dummies” [2], and have now posted a pictorial version to my website [3], hoping to encourage our queen producers to shift the genetics of our bees towards mite resistance. I’m not a proponent of the “Bond Method”–which involves unnecessarily allowing colonies to die–but rather of a “smarter” process based simply upon repeatedly selecting those colonies with the lowest rates of mite buildup [4].

The question, of course, is how realistic would it be for a queen producer to actually engage in such a breeding program? To answer that question, we should look at four factors that determine whether a program has a chance of being successful at breeding for a certain trait (in this case, varroa resistance) over a reasonable amount of time:
1: There must exist a goodly degree of variability in the desired trait in the breeding population (i.e., a wide hive-to-hive variability in the rates of mite buildup),
2: That the desired trait is heritable (that mite resistance be passed to the next generation),
3: That the breeder can identify individuals exhibiting that trait (what this article is about), and
4: That the breeder can apply a strong amount of selective pressure to the breeding population (how strongly you can shift the genetics of your breeding population by eliminating susceptible bees and promoting resistant lines).
He discusses these points and I highly recommend reading this.
 
#37 ·
"Just looking at what was writen, I think you might be missing the point"..

No I don't think I'm missing the point. What was said was "I do have to buy a few packages early in the spring to populate early mating nucs, so I can start queen rearing early enough to do it at my bee camp". Maybe your the one not understanding..?
 
#38 ·
Riskybizz
And then you ask wouldn't it be better to wait. It wouldn't be better to wait if you wanted to have bee classes before that time. Maby you understood perfectly but would just run your classes later if you were having a bee camp of your own. I could see every one that went to be camp wanting to go back to thier own bees in time to impliment what they had learned during prime time but it doesn't hurt if you would run your camp differrent if people still came. You probly weren't missing the point of what I thought (again not speaking for michael but just reading what he wrote) he ment but think he should wait.
Cheers
gww
 
#41 ·
>So you are willing to purchase package bees in the spring and introduce them into your apiary in order to save two weeks in order to expedite queen rearing?

I'd be willing to wait, but I want to do some queen rearing at camp. I used to do the camp later so I wouldn't need to have the bees, but then one year everything ran early and they all swarmed before camp. I can't do much queen rearing with a bunch of hives with virgin queens and no brood or eggs. I need a sure thing in order to cover queen rearing at bee camp. Also, it's nice to cover installing some packages so they can see that done.

>Wouldn't it be more advisable to just wait the two weeks until your bees are built up accordingly instead of bringing in bulk bees (and more mites).

You think mites are a problem. I don't find them to be a problem.

> If your bees aren't sufficiently populated I would think that you wouldn't want to raise queens at that time anyways, and better off to wait for strong colony populations with mature drones with viable sperm. Just a thought.

I have really two issues, but the big one is camp. The other one is that no one wants to buy queens in August, they want to buy them in April. April, of course, won't happen, but I try to at least have some by the end of June.

>He didn't specifically in this case but he has in the past saying that he hasn't been able to find the tf suppliers he needed.

These were treatment free bees. Unfortunately not northern bees as they wouldn't be far enough along that early.
 
#43 ·
MB : "You think mites are a problem. I don't find them to be a problem"

Its always interesting to get feedback from different beekeepers about how they manage their apiaries. Personally I do find mites to be a problem; and if my average colony losses were 35% each year I would find it to be a much bigger problem. That's part of the reason I initially asked about your colony numbers and overwintering success. I know plenty of TF beekeepers (especially in my area) and its again always interesting to hear them talk about their TF success. Les Crowder kept bees here for a long time and I remember being at a meeting at my house one evening where he said he lost almost all his hives that winter; around 200 TB hives.

Kefus spoke here a couple of years ago and apparently he has managed to breed in genetics allowing him to maintain his colony numbers (and not treat) because he now sees no mites in his bees. I suspect that Mike Bush doesn't share that same success because his genetic line is not as capable dealing with mites. I don't think that Kefus loses 35% of his colonies does he Wolfe?
 
#45 ·
Personally I do find mites to be a problem; and if my average colony losses were 35% each year I would find it to be a much bigger problem. That's part of the reason I initially asked about your colony numbers and overwintering success.
Mites are a big problem here because there is no feral survivor stock around and the bees are weak from treating for many years. No selections done.

So treated beekeepers average losses are 15-60%, depending on the climate and if treatments work.

I would be very happy if my losses tf would be on a 30-35% level some time in future. In a natural setting insects often have very high losses this changes from year to year.
 
#44 ·
you have to look at it as a whole...
france's losses are like 9.63%
In the last 9 years the advrage loss for treating keepers in the US has been 33.7%, same time frame the NE advrage for a treating keeper is 45.4, last year it was 58.3%
Michael Bush is doing very well
as for TF in your area in NM last 9 years treatrers lost an avargre of 37.3% and the TF keepers lost 32.9%.... It would seem TF is quite successful in NM
 
#47 ·
MSL > "as for TF in your area in NM last 9 years treatrers lost an avargre of 37.3% and the TF keepers lost 32.9%.... It would seem TF is quite successful in NM"

would you mind sharing with me your source for statistical data as I would be interested in reviewing that.
 
#48 · (Edited)
#65 ·
Interesting map - losses fairly obviously related to geographical location - suggesting that temperature and/or starvation are responsible (rather than mites/TF etc). Use VOA, deal with temperature and feed, and winter losses drop dramatically. My losses have been zero for the last 6 or 7 years - although I may have lost one or two this winter, due to the 'weather bomb' we're just about to emerge from - will know in a day or two.
LJ
 
#49 ·
A couple of thoughts, First We actually know for a fact, than mites reproduce better when infected with DWV so for that reason alone they could be worse in close proximity.
We also know that closer hives would tend to get robbed out more with Dying hives having better luck at transferring mites at closer ranges.

I see common's on TF success mentioned. IMO here is the real problem, the idea of success is completely different. Some of us Want to make a living, and 40/50% losses mean we cant quit the day job. (some have complained they dont have enough to sell queens time because of the job) Others just do not accept that.

Charles
 
#50 ·
GM.....
Some of us Want to make a living, and 40/50% losses mean we cant quit the day job.
But some treatment free do not lose 40/50% and some treaters do. I do agree that if a person lost 40/50% that it could be harder. A lot of poeple throw out things like this to make a point that this is what you get if you go a certain route but all it is is a statement when it could be a fact for one (treater or nontreater) but not another.
Cheers
gww
 
#51 ·
point is simple, there are TF people who accept high losses, don't prevent swarming, and could care less about honey. The number of really TF pros is so tiny as to be non existent. My point was simple, you have to decide if those standards can fit your operation, nothing more. What you do with your hives is your business.
 
#56 ·
The latest one I read is a German study, Danke comes to mind but not positive. the reproductive rate rises about 6% if i recall, as well as rising again when multiple fondress mites inhabit a cell.(up to 7 per cell) Google Scholar.... lots of research on this topic.
 
#57 ·
Gm
as well as rising again when multiple fondress mites inhabit a cell.(up to 7 per cell) Google Scholar.
I may not know what you mean.
This quote seems to say differrent then what you are indicating.
When more than one mite invade a single brood cell, the per capita fecundity decreases, as the number of mother mites per cell increases. Mites invading brood cells in older combs also have fewer offspring. This led scientists to speculate that mites themselves might have a chemical to inhibit each other’s reproduction (a pheromone). A chemical, (Z)-8-heptadecene, was identified. In the laboratory, it caused a 30% reduction in mite fecundity. When tested in the colony, the average number of offspring was 3.48 in cells treated with (Z)-8-heptadecene, but 3.96 in control cells. This difference was small, but statistically, highly significant (P < 0.01). The effective fecundity (number of potentially mated daughters) was 0.94 in treated cells, and 1.31 in control cells; and this level of difference should have a rather large impact on population growth.
I got this quote from here.
http://articles.extension.org/pages/65450/varroa-mite-reproductive-biology

I did see that the mite can start up to 7 (baby mites) but that they are not viable because of the time of uncapping and so the real rate in worker brood is about 1.6 and in drone brood due to longer being capped it is like 2.4 or so that actually live.
Cheers
gww
 
#64 ·
Gm



I got this quote from here.
http://articles.extension.org/pages/65450/varroa-mite-reproductive-biology

I did see that the mite can start up to 7 (baby mites) but that they are not viable because of the time of uncapping and so the real rate in worker brood is about 1.6 and in drone brood due to longer being capped it is like 2.4 or so that actually live.
Cheers
gww
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1365-2311.1996.tb00261.x/full


Seems there is a bit conflicting data (surprise surprise) but both papers agree the
number of FERTILE mites increases. the actual ratio of fertile mites in worker is closer to 1.1

Charles
 
#61 ·
What planting zone are you in in Nehawka, Michael?

I'm 5B/5A border here, similar colony count, and have no problem populating a cell builder, mating nucs, and getting queen rearing rolling grafting the Thursday nearest April 15th.
When's bee camp? Early April? Maybe you're doing a lot more nucs than I am though. First round is usually 15ish nucs (2x deep frames each usually in 4-way boxes). Then it balloons up after that obviously.
 
#62 ·
USDA says we are 5b. I think they are mistaken based on the bitter cold we usually get. I try to buy fruit trees that are zone 4 if I can. I settle for zone 5 if I can't. I might experiment with a few zone 6 ones now that some of the USDA maps say we are officially zone 6... but the one I just looked up still says 5b, or they changed it back due to this winter... I was feeling pretty pessimistic about the bees this year due to colder and longer than normal colder temperatures, but it was 65 F day before yesterday and there were bees everywhere. Some of the hives they are going in and out of are probably dead outs getting robbed out, but there were bees coming and going from all the boxes.
 
#63 ·
I am supposedly 5b and we have some pollen now. I could never tell what was activity and what was robbing. I know I can not see them going directly fly from one to the other. The activity peaks from each hive do not come at exactly at the same time of day. I only have eight hives and at least saw a bee at each hive bringing in pollen. That may not prove that the hive is not being robbed but was my best gauge of robbing but hoped it showed that some of the old hive is still alive inside.
Cheers
gww
 
#66 ·
I read in our bee magazine that losses were 30% in germany last winter. Treated hives.

The spring is getting more and more to be later in year which is very dangerous to the colonies in respect to starving or freezing if they are weakened by mites. A sign of climate change and a more virulent virus perhaps.

This leads to more importing of bee packages early in year and therefore to introduce more disease like the SHB which is not present for now.

It´s not a spacing of 100 m only which prevents mite infestation, it´s the preventing of drift via robber screens or other managements IMHO.
 
#69 ·
It´s not a spacing of 100 m only which prevents mite infestation, it´s the preventing of drift via robber screens or other managements IMHO.
I'd agree with that. Right now 90% of my hives have anti-robbing screens - soon to be 100%, even the big ones.

FWIW - winter losses still at zero %, although I do have had one colony on 'life-support' (dummied-down, extra stores and temperature maintained at 20-25C) since January. Should be ok after I donate some capped brood ...
LJ
 
#70 ·
I read in our bee magazine that losses were 30% in germany last winter. Treated hives.

The spring is getting more and more to be later in year which is very dangerous to the colonies in respect to starving or freezing if they are weakened by mites. A sign of climate change...
So, you are saying that it is getting colder and Winters are getting longer?
 
#72 ·
No, warmer, which is even more dangerous. Burning stores, no brood brakes, wet hives....winter is in jan-feb, not around solstice anymore. And maybe longer, october to march. And more rain, less sunny days.
I believe this works against the bees instincts and they have to adapt.

Now suddenly it´s 18°C and "shock flow" this could mean it´s blooming much earlier and the flowers will freeze. Our last nightly frost is mid may often.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top