jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source? - Page 8
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  1. #141
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    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    Fusion, we need pictures sir! I am interested, need the visuals, please.

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  3. #142
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    Jan 2005
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    Hamilton, Alabama
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    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    Today marks a milestone, I got the last colony out of Langstroth equipment and into a square Dadant. I took off just over 50 pounds of honey in a Langstroth deep honey super from this colony. It is extracted and settling. I still have 6 shallow square supers to extract which should add another 200 pounds to the total. From this point forward, I will be focusing on getting them ready for winter. There is a LOT to be done over the next 2 months.
    NW Alabama, 50 years, 20 colonies and growing, sideliner, treatment free since 2005, 14 frame square Dadant broodnest

  4. #143
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    Aug 2016
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    Marshall, TX USA
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    43

    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    For custom making just one hive body, can't I just get a deep frame kit and cut sides down where two sides pieces can be joined into a single long piece with glue (Tightbond III) and maybe staples? And then use two mediums, maybe cutting one down a little for the box?

    ~Laurie - Any updates on your custom hive? How did the bees do drawing the foundationless frames? I was thinking of going foundationless for the brood chamber.

  5. #144
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    Hamilton, Alabama
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    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    I'm still making frames with 280 top bars completed and 340 end bars finished. I have maybe 100 bottom bars cut so tomorrow will be about 2 hours cutting enough to finish 280 frames, then assemble maybe 100 frames. I have boxes to put them in so there is no issue with storage.

    Other items to work on include wrapping up painting. I probably won't get this done tomorrow.
    NW Alabama, 50 years, 20 colonies and growing, sideliner, treatment free since 2005, 14 frame square Dadant broodnest

  6. #145
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    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    Welcome to the "deep" side!

    I went to see Albert Zook today and arranged for him to make 10 more square deep hives with top, bottom, brood box, shallow super, and slatted rack. I am offering them here at my cost for anyone who wants a few to trial. Here are the conditions:

    1. Whatever Zook winds up charging me will be the cost of the hives plus $5 each for my time driving up to get them.
    2. I will include 14 of the 1.25 end bar frames with each box if you want them at a price of $1.50 unassembled or $2.50 fully assembled and wired.
    3. You will have to purchase foundation from Dadant if you want full sheets of foundation. Dadant is doing a custom run of 10 5/8 wired with long hooks 5.1 foundation which you can call and order. If you call, ask for Arlen and tell him the size.
    4. Here are the equipment items I requested: 10 solid cypress bottom boards, 10 cypress migratory tops, 10 square hive bodies cut 11 5/8 inches deep with finger joints and hand holds, 10 slatted racks with cypress rim and pine slats, and ten 5 3/4 shallow supers.
    5. I can assemble the boxes and fill them with assembled frames if you want them that way. They will be glued with titebond 3 and nailed with galvanized spiral nails and frame nails.
    6. Actual cost of shipping either via USPS or UPS will be added to the total.
    7. I will make up some 2 queen kits with a divider and wood strips to make the required modifications. Let me know if you are interested in running them as 2 queen hives and I'll include the kit.
    8. I can include a shallow 5 3/4 super or can get other sizes if anyone wants them. I can get square 9 5/8 or 6 5/8 supers if you would prefer that size. Please consider carefully how many supers so I can get them at the same time as the boxes. Each super will require 12 frames for honey storage.
    9. I don't have excluders for these yet, but will order some from Europe in a few weeks. Let me know if you want an excluder at a cost somewhere around $15 including shipping to the U.S.
    10. The equipment won't be ready until sometime in January. He has to purchase 12 inch wide lumber and kiln dry it which will take about 6 to 8 weeks.
    11. I will limit each request to 3 hives max and would prefer to sell them in pairs.
    12. In order to respect beesource requirements, these will be sold as close as possible to my cost. Expect each hive to run about $70 unassembled and roughly $30 each for shipping. If you want everything fully assembled, add about $20. Two queen kits, supers, and excluders will be extra.
    The intent is to get some Dadant hives out for trial.

    Please post here in the thread if you are interested, then send me a PM stating what you would like to get. Keep in mind that you have to provide paint and bees. You can set a hive of 9 1/8 frames into these boxes and gradually remove the old frames as the bees build on the deeps.
    NW Alabama, 50 years, 20 colonies and growing, sideliner, treatment free since 2005, 14 frame square Dadant broodnest

  7. #146
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    Mar 2016
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    Morgan County, Alabama,USA
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    21

    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    Fp, I would like to buy a pair of your 14 frame square Dadant hives. I'm 2 or 3 counties NE of you. I would like to have an experience to compare to my 8/10 frame Lang boxes. Thank you for your contribution to this very interesting thread. A PM will follow.

  8. #147
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    Hamilton, Alabama
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    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    Yesterday marked a milestone for me with the square Dadant equipment. I completed assembly of all the cypress boxes I purchased from Albert Zook. I need to paint several of the boxes assembled over the last few days and I still need about 200 more frames assembled to go with the @275 already done. At this point, I have:

    38 square deep boxes
    32 square shallow supers
    28 migratory covers
    28 solid bottom boards

    I visited Zook 2 weeks ago and asked him to make some more equipment.

    12 migratory tops
    12 solid bottom boards
    10 square deep hive bodies
    30 more shallow supers
    40 Killion deep bottom boards (just the outside rails, I am making the slats to fit)

    I will sell 10 of the square deeps as above leaving me with everything I need to run 30 colonies of bees. With the 2 queen kits, I can keep 60 queens in operation for at least 9 months giving me up to 30 queens to replace losses and/or have queens to sell.
    Last edited by Fusion_power; 12-01-2016 at 03:42 PM. Reason: correcting counts, had a deep and a super in the extracting room
    NW Alabama, 50 years, 20 colonies and growing, sideliner, treatment free since 2005, 14 frame square Dadant broodnest

  9. #148
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    Jul 2010
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    jackson county, alabama, usa
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    10,226

    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    nice! i suspect there may be some demand for your queen's next season.
    'no wise man has the power to reason away what a fool believes' - the doobies

  10. #149
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    Jan 2005
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    Hamilton, Alabama
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    3,051

    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    I made a frame jig yesterday. It turned out to be exactly the right dimensions to hold 14 frames. I had a piece of leftover ash wood from a project 2 years ago. It was about 4 inches wide and looked long enough to make a decent jig. I cut two pieces off of it the right length for a frame to fit inside, then cut the remainder in half. When I assembled it, 14 end bars fit into it like a glove. I sanded it smooth but have not yet varnished it.



    Here are the finished frames being dumped out of the jig.



    and here is a super as I am filling it with frames.



    I purchased 500 wedge top bar divided bottom bar frames from Kelley with 10% off for cyber Monday. Here is what 500 frames stacked and ready to assemble looks like.



    I don't like having to use a knife to cut the wedge free from the top bar so I ran them through my tablesaw using my micro kerf blade to cut the wedge loose. It took nearly 2.5 hours or about 15 seconds per frame! Now think of the time spent cutting wedges free and realize just how much time can be consumed. I want my 2.5 hours back! I would much rather purchase frames with wedges cut off and bundled separate from the top bars.

    Here are interior dimensions of a square deep hive body:
    Length 18 5/16 (465 mm)
    Width 18 5/16 (465 mm)
    Height 11 5/8 (295 mm)

    Langstroth interior dimensions are:
    Length 18 5/16 (465 mm)
    Width 14 11/16 (373 mm)
    Height 9 5/8 (243 mm)

    I am putting 12 frames in each shallow super for honey. They fit with 1.75 inches to spare.

    I put in some time figuring out queen excluders for the square deep hives. An old slightly rusty wood bound excluder served as a guinea pig. I cut it into strips and then figured out what I would need to make wood and wire excluders for a square hive. A langstroth excluder is 18 13/16 long by 15 7/16 wide. The wood rim adds 3/4 of an inch each way to fit on a hive. For a single excluder, I need a square 18 13/16 by 18 13/16 or for two separate half excluders, 18 13/16 by 9 inches. Why two half excluders? So I can put a divider in a hive and have an excluder over each side. This will keep the queen in one side while I am working the other. I'm going to make a few calls Monday and see if I can purchase excluders in the U.S. I can build the wooden frame and would prefer to do so with cypress wood.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Fusion_power; 12-03-2016 at 09:30 PM.
    NW Alabama, 50 years, 20 colonies and growing, sideliner, treatment free since 2005, 14 frame square Dadant broodnest

  11. #150
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    Oct 2016
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    York County, VA, USA
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    503

    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    Likely a different audience here than in the other thread where I asked this question

    post 157 of https://www.beesource.com/forums/show...10#post1495510

    The question is whether a workable substitute for a Jumbo could be had by doubling a medium box and replacing the sides of the frames with sides 6-5/8" longer than those of medium frames. The doubled medium frames could be stuffed with a double course of medium foundation suitably reinforced at the center taking up at the same time the extra ~1/2" of depth beyond the two medium foundation sheets. Other patch-it-up measures exist, like using a bit of wax foundation or smooth solid filler. Probably one would add a mid-frame horizontal 1/2" separator locating the two other pieces cleanly.

    This just seemed to me to be a straightforward means of supplying the O.P.'s question here about a source for "extra-large hive bodies." Been thinking about doing it, as I ordered some extra medium boxes lately.

    Michael

  12. #151
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    Jan 2005
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    Hamilton, Alabama
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    3,051

    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    This has been proposed by a couple of other beesource members. Read this thread for some thoughts on frames that are too deep to extract.

    https://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?316006


    Since I'm in here anyway, here is an update. I have been assembling shallow frames for honey supers at a steady rate. I now have 15 square shallow supers full with 12 frames each plus some extra frames not yet in supers. My goal is to assemble 500 shallow frames over the next month. I am also working on deep brood boxes getting more of them painted and ready for next spring. Steady progress over a period of months is my objective.
    NW Alabama, 50 years, 20 colonies and growing, sideliner, treatment free since 2005, 14 frame square Dadant broodnest

  13. #152
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    Sep 2008
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    Mtn. View, Arkansas, USA
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    2,754

    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    For queen excluders used with the square boxes just build a 3/8 inch thick frame to fit the box. Center a standard queen excluder on the frame and add pieces of plywood the thickness of the excluder to fill the empty space at the sides. The bees will use the excluder to move between boxes and will build little or no burr comb on the sides with the wooden area. I used this setup for about 5 years with my square boxes and had no excluder problems.

  14. #153
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    Apr 2012
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    Perth Western Australia
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    291

    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    That's no help because he (or she) wold be a lot stronger than you). Suggest you keep the same frame size throughout.

  15. #154
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    Jan 2005
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    Hamilton, Alabama
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    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    I purchased more lumber today to continue building frames and other hive parts. 16 - 2 X 6 X 8' spruce @ $3.56 each, 4 - 1 X 12 X 16' pine shelving @ $15.99 each, and 4 - 2 X 6 X 8' treated to build a worktable @ $6.36.

    I had cut about 900 end bars and have now assembled all of them into frames that are wired and stored in painted ready to go square deep boxes. Add foundation and they are ready for the bees. I need about 200 more frames for things like queen nucs and I plan to make about 200 frames to sell. I have plenty of bottom bars cut and ready to use and about 130 top bars fully cut and ready to go. I have about 300 top bars that are still blanks needing to be cut. My goal is to cut end bars over the next few weeks until I have enough to assemble at least 400 more frames.

    I also plan to convert my old Langstroth deeps into jumbos by adding a 2 inch deep eke on the bottom. With a bit of work, I can turn them into double queen nucs. I plan to raise queens on frames ready to set over into square deeps for honey production.

    At this point, I have 14 of the square deep hives in use with bees in them, about half are set up as 2 queen colonies. I have 20 square deeps full of frames ready for foundation. I have 30 square shallow supers of which 7 need frames. I plan to assemble frames for them over the next few weeks. I still need to paint some tops and bottoms and do a bit of touch up work on some of the other equipment. There are 3 square deeps that are painted and ready, but do not have frames for them yet.

    My goal is 30 working hives of bees with 2 queens in each for winter next year.
    NW Alabama, 50 years, 20 colonies and growing, sideliner, treatment free since 2005, 14 frame square Dadant broodnest

  16. #155
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    Jan 2012
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    Roy, Wa
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    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    Quote Originally Posted by shinbone View Post
    (I was just perusing this older thread)

    Lauri - I love how you try new things, and I am also impressed with your construction skills. Any updates on how this hive is doing?
    Sorry about the slow reply, I have not been paying attention to this thread recently.
    I got so busy last year this hive sat in my shop all summer! Never even attempted to fill it. Hopefully this spring I will have occupied photos to show you.
    Lauri Miller.
    Carniolan Hybrids. Glenn, Latshaw & Wild lines.

  17. #156
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    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    Dadant just called to tell me my order for 200 pounds of 10 5/8 by 16 3/4 foundation with 5.1 cell size is ready. At my request, they will hold it to ship after the weather moderates. I also picked up 30 more shallow supers and 12 more tops and bottoms from Albert Zook yesterday.

    Here is what I have:
    38 square deeps with 10 more on order
    40 migratory tops, 12 are new and need paint
    40 bottom boards, 12 are new and need paint
    64 square shallow supers, 30 need to be assembled and painted
    about 400 assembled and wired 11 1/4 deep frames with 1 1/4 inch end bars
    Frame parts to build another 400 deep frames with some parts needing further machining
    250 assembled shallow frames plus another 200 older shallow frames many of which have drawn comb
    250 unassembled shallow frames which I will be working on in the next few days
    15 internal dividers and parts to build another 25 or so

    I am working on queen excluders but would prefer stainless steel if available. One of my problems over the years is that steel excluders eventually rust even if they are galvanized. I want an excluder that is good for 50 years of service.


    For those of you who want to get a couple of these boxes with frames and foundation, I should have everything ready to go in about 6 more weeks.
    NW Alabama, 50 years, 20 colonies and growing, sideliner, treatment free since 2005, 14 frame square Dadant broodnest

  18. #157
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    Nov 2009
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    Manning, SC
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    5,219

    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fusion_power View Post
    I want an excluder that is good for 50 years of service.
    50 years? You going to be around then?
    http://OxaVap.com Your source for the ProVap 110
    OA Vaporizer. The fastest vaporizer on the market!

  19. #158
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    Oct 2016
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    York County, VA, USA
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    503

    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    You'll find an optimist here and there. Apparently here. Think of it this way: If one already knows how to survive for 60 or 70 years, demonstrated and documented, shouldn't he/she stand a respectable chance of doing it again?

    I'm still looking into making some double-medium frames to go into stacked medium boxes. Looks like fun even if it turns out not to be useful for me. Maybe in my second 60 yrs....

  20. #159
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    San Mateo, CA
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    6,834

    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    I got square excluders from Swienty decades ago. I will check if they are stainless. They are a weird size, something like 19 1/2" square fitting inside the boxes, so I made them into woodbound excluders.


    Here you go...German 500mm:

    https://www.bienen-voigt.de/en/beeke...etal-500x500mm

    About 19 5/8".

    I think you will have a hard time finding stainless.

  21. #160
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    Jan 2012
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    Roy, Wa
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    Default Re: jumbo or extra-large hive bodies - source?

    Anyone ever cheat & just combine 2 frames to get their jumbo deep frames? Seems simple enough. Sure you'll get a lump at the joint, I don't see where that matters much. If they're used for brood nest only, should be plenty strong.

    Just secure together & hack off the bottom ear.

    2 mediums would net you a 19" x 12" jumbo
    deep and medium as shown here 19 x 15 1/2"
    2 deeps and you'll get 19 x 18 1/2

    P1060710.jpg

    P1060714.jpg

    P1060709.jpg

    I'm going to just add a third board to my double queenunits to deepen them up if I want a square frame.

    P1290149.jpg

    Below is how a standard deep frame fits right now. As long as I give them room to move up when they are on the build, I don't get the mess below like you would think. Very little comb building under frames in the void area.

    P1290131.jpg

    Those long deep brood combs still intrigue me. But would like to have them more accessible than this to manage.

    Lauri Miller.
    Carniolan Hybrids. Glenn, Latshaw & Wild lines.

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