Will Politics Drive the Science?
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  1. #1
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    Default Will Politics Drive the Science?

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/jonentin...o-rethink-ban/

    "they were introduced in the late 1990s without incident as a less toxic replacement for the mass spraying of organophosphate and pyrethroid pesticides, which are both known to kill bees and wildlife. Organophosphates in particular have been linked to health problems in workers."

    "When they tested soybean flowers and cotton nectar, they found no traces of neonics at all. They did find microscopic traces of neonics in corn at what the EPA and toxicologists say are insignificant impact levels, with the highest having a mean of 2.3 parts per billion."

    "If bee health problems were critical in Canada, they would certainly have surfaced in the country’s 19 million acres of canola farms, which are mostly in the west. Beekeepers who forage their bees in the canola fields, where neonics are used far more heavily than on Ontario and Quebec farms, say their hives are generally thriving. "

    "The question for Canada and ultimately for US regulators: Will they examine the evidence? Or will politics drive the science?"
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

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  3. #2
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Money makes the World go round is not just a metaphor. Money drives almost everything. Politics and science/research.

    If you want to know what sorts of Bee Research will come out of our Land Grant Colleges, the answer is whatever they are allowed to do.
    Mark Berninghausen

  4. #3
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Bee research, ha! There is no money to be made in bee research. As compared to my other farming enterprises, grain and cattle have every corner and answer covered in regards to production practices. Bee... bit of a 'wild' card on our farm.

    Yet with that in mind, there sure is a lot of 'science based ' work done on honeybees and pesticides lately
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  5. #4
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Will Politics Drive the Science?

    It doesn't drive it... it mutes it.

  6. #5
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian View Post

    "The question for Canada and ultimately for US regulators: Will they examine the evidence? Or will politics drive the science?"
    Money is power Ian. The only reason for pesticides in general is for money. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know you think you are feeding the world but you are not. Money feeds the world and if you don't have it you don't eat. Nothing will change that.
    Brian Cardinal
    Zone 5a, Practicing non-intervention beekeeping

  7. #6
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Quote Originally Posted by Acebird View Post
    Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know you think you are feeding the world but you are not.
    No I am not feeding the world, I am making a living.
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  8. #7
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    hard to compare to here in the midwest where we dont have 19 million acres of managed nectar plants. Makes a big difference that canola is a good food source for bees. If corn and beans produced nectar and pollen like canola does it would be a different story.

  9. #8
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Even harder to compare here when even the livestock operators spray herbicides for broad leaf plants in the name of better forage. Cause you know, cows have a much higher weight gain off of fescue than say clovers or alfalfa mixes.
    A man is worth just as much as the things about which he busies himself- Marcus Aurelius

  10. #9
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Quote Originally Posted by MNbees View Post
    Makes a big difference that canola is a good food source for bees. If corn and beans produced nectar and pollen like canola does it would be a different story.
    Exactly, those signs point to mal nutrition
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  11. #10
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian View Post
    Exactly, those signs point to mal nutrition
    and to top it off more poison !

  12. #11
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Guys you got it all wrong, Its love that makes the world go round. But money greases the wheels.
    Johno

  13. #12
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Politics has driven science for centuries, both internally and externally...
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 42y 40h 39yTF

  14. #13

    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    We can't avoid politics, either in education or in science. I worked on Development Progress projects a couple of years ago and I remember how we faught the reform changes caused by political bias.
    Just an interesteding read: How does political context shape education reforms and their success by Joseph Wales, Arran Magee and Susan Nicolai writers group:

    http://www.odi.org/sites/odi.org.uk/...ents/10808.pdf

    And I remember a scandal over the announcement that Israeli students were paid for sharing the pro-Israeli information on social media. That's horrible, but there's nothing we can do about it.
    Last edited by Lumuss; 12-26-2019 at 03:20 AM. Reason: reference

  15. #14
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    "It ain't ignorance causes so much trouble; it's folks knowing so much that ain't so."

    Good on you Ian, for having the fortitude to even ask.

  16. #15
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Quote Originally Posted by Outdoor N8 View Post
    Good on you Ian, for having the fortitude to even ask.
    Another thread resurrected from the dead almost 5 years later. I haven't seen Ian posting here for a couple of years either.

  17. #16
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Quote Originally Posted by grozzie2 View Post
    Another thread resurrected from the dead ...

    Some good memories from a different time.
    To everything there is a season....

  18. #17
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Gillmore View Post
    Some good memories from a different time.
    And a sad reminder that some folks with a vast repository of beekeeping knowlege no longer post here.
    Thankfully, the bees are smarter than I am. They are doing well, in spite of my efforts to help them.

  19. #18
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Quote Originally Posted by JWPalmer View Post
    And a sad reminder that some folks with a vast repository of beekeeping knowlege no longer post here.
    Why do you think that is so?

  20. #19
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    I would like to think that it is because they are busy taking care of their bees, but I doubt this is so. It would be inappropriate for me to speculate on the real reasons. Instead, I want to thank the guys and gals that continue to offer their expertise and contribute to this forum on a regular basis. Were it not for them, much of the discussion here would be centered around "what I read or saw on the internet today". They help keep us grounded on what it takes to be a successful beekeeper by offering sound, time proven, advice.
    Thankfully, the bees are smarter than I am. They are doing well, in spite of my efforts to help them.

  21. #20
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    Default Re: Will Politics Drive the Science?

    Some of those missing posters got tired of having to defend their practical experience against some very zealous ideological opinions. That is usually not very productive.
    Frank

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