Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees - Page 4
Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst ... 2345 LastLast
Results 61 to 80 of 90
  1. #61
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Roy, Wa
    Posts
    2,943

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo Gomes View Post
    .Several experts refer to a queen by year lays about 250,000 eggs.
    I wonder just how many calories the queen has to consume over a season's worth of production. And there are many that think nutrition doesn't matter. Then there are accumulative toxin exposures to consider.
    If you want to good longevity, need to keep them clean and on a superstar's diet.

    Along with good genetics and mated well of course.
    Lauri Miller.
    Carniolan Hybrids. Glenn, Latshaw & Wild lines.

  2. Remove Advertisements
    BeeSource.com
    Advertisements
     

  3. #62
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Portugal
    Posts
    1,288

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    My mutt bees have a five star diet: nectar, honey, pollen and water. I rarely food with artificial feeding. In Portugal and with my bees things have not gone so bad so far.

  4. #63
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Roy, Wa
    Posts
    2,943

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo Gomes View Post
    My mutt bees have a five star diet
    I have mutts too, LOL I've let my customers name some of them. One of the more complicated lines is called:

    'Miller Ultimutt hybrid' (II Pol-Line based/Russian/VSH/ mated with Carniolans (2014 cross)
    This is from Velberts Pol-Line II breeder (originating from VP Queens I am told) Daughters mated at his place with his Russian and pure VSH stck. One of those daughters was grafted at my place. THOSE daughters were late summer mated with my own line of VSH Carniolan hybrids. Overwintering right now. New crop 2015 test daughters from the best overwintered stock will also be mated here. That is a mouthfull. And a touch of diversity, I'd say.
    I like the looks of them so far, this is a virgin queen here:



    They've already been impressive in the mating nucs, some of the nucs with serious issues to ovecome (Laying workers, no stores, low populations, very late summer. I had such a good crop of these I placed them all as virgins and was able to be very selective.

    Pic below is a mid September photo. Virgin shown above was placed 30 days prior.


    I enjoy the natural wide variation of nectar and pollen producing plants in my area, with no commercial crops around. But I still feed them a brew or two of my own.
    I give my feeding plan a lot of credit for accomplishing so much is such a short amout of time. I also give the feed credit for producing very good sized virgins.
    Last edited by Lauri; 12-11-2014 at 10:12 AM.
    Lauri Miller.
    Carniolan Hybrids. Glenn, Latshaw & Wild lines.

  5. #64
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Portugal
    Posts
    1,288

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by Lauri View Post
    'Miller Ultimutt hybrids'II Pol-Line based/Russian/VSH/ mated with Carniolans (2014 cross)

    Only then lack the iberiensis . Lauri If you want i send you a queen of the nicest I have.

    In these diet thing and feeding bees as in many other things in beekeeping there are no doctrines to follow a strict form.
    The beekeeping Bible is yet to be written. If ever written I do not know it but I do not feel a need to know. I'm fine and my bees too.

  6. #65
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    SPAIN
    Posts
    77

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by Lauri View Post

    I enjoy the natural wide variation of nectar and pollen producing plants in my area, with no commercial crops around. But I still feed them a brew or two of my own.
    We have a very mild winters (16C/61F at 21.20) with a reasonable amount of flowers and apis iberiensis is very well adapted to the climate which is why we usually don't have to do anything special to get the hives through winter.

  7. #66
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Ojai, California
    Posts
    2,572

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    I've read testimonials to queens mating with from 1 to 55 drones. Many have quoted an average of 17 stated by one study, but averages aren't individuals, are they? NMQ performance may be poor due to not enough drones flying, by not finding a DCA, and especially by getting eaten by a bird, dragonfly, or other predator! I always hope to breed too many of every combination of queen colonies and drone colonies I can get my hands on in order to get at least some good variety of bees.

    Some queens max out on a poor year laying about 1,000 eggs a day in the peak of the season, 2,000 eggs/day is considered good by most standards, 2,500 a day very good. A hot AHB queen in a large hive in premium conditions may lay as many as 5,000 eggs/day, and for a fairly long season, but usually interrupted by an abscond/usurp event or one or more swarming events, or a combination thereof. Russian queens sometimes lay 3,500 eggs/day.

    I'm not so sure about 250,000 eggs per year, that sounds pretty low. That's only 100 days at 2,500 eggs/day - a good springtime with zero left for rearing brood the rest of the year. Also, a queen may release 5 to 7 sperm at the time the egg goes out the oviducts. Both of these factors reduce the "sperm longevity" of the queen.

  8. #67
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Portugal
    Posts
    1,288

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by kilocharlie View Post
    I'm not so sure about 250,000 eggs per year, that sounds pretty low. That's only 100 days at 2,500 eggs/day - a good springtime with zero left for rearing brood the rest of the year. Also, a queen may release 5 to 7 sperm at the time the egg goes out the oviducts. Both of these factors reduce the "sperm longevity" of the queen.
    Hello Kilocharlie
    The numbers are huge and I will not give you my opinion, because I did not dare to have an opinion about this. I will introduce you to some other recent data that I have no reason to doubt them.

    A newly established queen bee flies out of the hive and will mate with one or several "drones." Most likely, this one mating event will allow her to lay eggs for the rest of her life. A queen bee may lay up to 2,000 eggs a day and up to 1,000,000 in her lifetime. in http://www.colostate.edu/Dept/CoopEx...Pests/bees.htm

    "Virgin queens mate early in their lives and only attend one mating flight. After several matings during this flight, a queen stores up to 100 million sperm within her oviducts. However, only five to six million are stored within the queen’s spermatheca. The queen uses only a few of these sperm at a time in order to fertilize eggs throughout her life." In http://www.orkin.com/stinging-pests/...ey-bee-mating/

  9. #68
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Portugal
    Posts
    1,288

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    "Those queens that live 4-5 years; do the bees supersede her because of her health or because she runs out of sperm? I thought the latter."
    This is the original question that I answered.

    Quote Originally Posted by kilocharlie View Post
    but averages aren't individuals, are they?
    At this point I completely agree with you. The average of a population or sample does not necessarily reflect the reality of each individual.


    NMQ performance may be poor due to not enough drones flying, by not finding a DCA, and especially by getting eaten by a bird, dragonfly, or other predator!
    In this respect I can tell you according to my experience that a poorly mated queen is quickly replaced by bees , not getting 2 or 3 months , and therefore does not reach the 4 or 5 years as asked .
    Those that are eaten by birds etc ... these are out of these accounts it seems to me. Thus nor live 4 or 5 years.

    A hot AHB queen in a large hive in premium conditions may lay as many as 5,000 eggs/day, and for a fairly long season, but usually interrupted by an abscond/usurp event or one or more swarming events, or a combination thereof. Russian queens sometimes lay 3,500 eggs/day.
    If the scenario was this I could not read as well as you between the lines.

    I'm not so sure about 250,000 eggs per year, that sounds pretty low
    "Queens lay the greatest number of eggs in the spring and early summer. During peak production, queens may lay up to 1,500 eggs per day. They gradually cease laying eggs in early October and produce few or no eggs until early next spring (January). One queen may produce up to 250,000 eggs per year and possibly more than a million in her lifetime." in https://agdev.anr.udel.edu/maarec/ho...-organization/

    I'm not the family of flying brothers. I have this tendency to believe in the research that speaks to me of things that I do not know or I can not count. And I have given to me well so far and so I think that will not change.
    Last edited by Eduardo Gomes; 12-10-2014 at 07:47 PM. Reason: Sentence correction

  10. #69
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Ojai, California
    Posts
    2,572

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo Gomes View Post
    "Those queens that live 4-5 years; do the bees supersede her because of her health or because she runs out of sperm? I thought the latter."
    This is the original question that I answered. ...

    "Queens lay the greatest number of eggs in the spring and early summer. During peak production, queens may lay up to 1,500 eggs per day. They gradually cease laying eggs in early October and produce few or no eggs until early next spring (January). One queen may produce up to 250,000 eggs per year and possibly more than a million in her lifetime." in https://agdev.anr.udel.edu/maarec/ho...-organization/...
    The 4- and 5-year old queens are rarely discussed anymore. Since the advent of large-scale die-offs, we are very happy with queens that lay sufficiently past one year, and re-queen whenever necessary. Those living to 6 years are lucky girls indeed, and usually live in an environment that does not have the stresses that occur in the continental U.S.A. near monoculture agribusiness, pesticides, and varroa. Places like Pitcairn Island come to mind, I'm sure the gal there gets some queens that live a long time. I had one from 2008 to 20012 (she went 5 years + 7 months) that was my best producer, and some others went 4 1/2 years, but nothing over 3 years since, and recently only some 1-year- and a single 2-year-old queens. Conditions are precluding the expression of longevity in the genetics.

    The 1,500 eggs a day figure sounds like A.M. ligurica, the north Italian strain of honeybee. I've seen well-bred queens of this race laying 2,000 to 2,200 eggs a day for several months in good conditions, filling up half a side of a deep frame in 2 days.

    My AHB queens used to go well over twice that egg-laying rate, filling up both sides of a comb in less than 2 days, but they'd go stir crazy when they ran out of brood comb. I had them under 3 layers of queen excluder cage so they could not swarm, nor send out drones. If I could have kept them a little less remote, I could have done more intense management and gotten better data off these amazing bees. I'm sad to have lost them when their cave collapsed.

    Here in Southern California, in early December, I inspected a friend's hive yesterday that had 5 1/2 frames of brood. The weather got colder suddenly with a storm October 31, and one rain last Tuesday & Wednesday (Dec. 2nd & 3rd), and the drones are gone (first time in 2 years with no drones over the winter), but that queen is laying a nice, solid brood pattern, and dealing with a varroa population (he has not treated for them yet). From this I conclude that laying season is a local thing, having much more to do with local temperature and nectar / pollen flow than with scientific studies.
    Last edited by kilocharlie; 12-10-2014 at 10:30 PM.

  11. #70
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Sacramento, CA, USA
    Posts
    7,861

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by kilocharlie View Post
    If I could have kept them a little less remote, I could have done more intense management and gotten better data off these amazing bees. I'm sad to have lost them when their cave collapsed.

    Here in Southern California, in early December, I inspected a friend's hive yesterday that had 5 1/2 frames of brood. The weather got colder suddenly with a storm October 31, and one rain last Tuesday & Wednesday (Dec. 2nd & 3rd), and the drones are gone (first time in 2 years with no drones over the winter), but that queen is laying a nice, solid brood pattern, and dealing with a varroa population (he has not treated for them yet). From this I conclude that laying season is a local thing, having much more to do with local temperature and nectar / pollen flow than with scientific studies.
    KC, I don't know the laws on keeping AHB in CA (California.) In Florida any swam that they caught need to be requeened with the EHB queen. Keep in mind that the queen will slim down so she can fly in a swarm so 3-5 layers of qe may not hold her in. Maybe to raise big head queens with smaller qE openings and preventing the brood nest from back filling which is hard to do on a flow. If you would like to have a source of AHB genetics I know who has them. Maybe to open up the cave again with railroad ties to reinforce the cave opening. My first thought was to pinch this aggressive queen in which we did. After dealing with them my first season and vid on this process I finally had enough. Now I only keep the gentle type bees.
    To have a long live queen with the quality genetics that you would like to graft from she must be confined in a single frame or 2. Look at the example on oldtimer's queen nuc thread. This will prolong her lifespan and all the good eggs that she carried. Of course, naturally being fed all those good RJ there is a detox mechanism built into every bees including the queen, I think. Then good nutrition and the nice local environment will help tremendously too.
    With the changing weather pattern this year, we are warmer than usual with lots of rains so far. Like KC's friend, I did not let my Italians goto sleep or on a brood break this year. Already 4 frames of young winter bees are hatching with the mites they have to dealt with also. I did not treat hoping to test these late Fall queens to see their mite resistant capability as advertised. Because this year we have a drought just like the last 3 years, there isn't much pollen to be stored. Now they are picking on the eucalyptus pollen and nectar with some overwintering Borage too. So far they are brooding up nicely feeding on Lauri's sugar bricks and patty. Yes, the local environment has many to do than with any scientific studies since we don't know the local conditions at which they have done these studies on. But still a good read to get an idea though.


    Today's hive check:
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by beepro; 12-11-2014 at 12:50 AM.
    Don't mix foreign bees into a virgin hive. She might get balled 100% of the time! When will you ever learn, huh?

  12. #71
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Portugal
    Posts
    1,288

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by kilocharlie View Post
    The 4- and 5-year old queens are rarely discussed anymore
    I answered a rare question then. I did not know that . Rare matters not deserve the most accurate answer possible in your opinion?

    Since the advent of large-scale die-offs, we are very happy with queens that lay sufficiently past one year, and re-queen whenever necessary.
    Sorry to hear that. In your opinion what are the causes?

    The 1,500 eggs a day figure sounds like A.M. ligurica, the north Italian strain of honeybee. I've seen well-bred queens of this race laying 2,000 to 2,200 eggs a day for several months in good conditions, filling up half a side of a deep frame in 2 days.
    You still insist on the idea that 250,000 is a low number. Let's put the numbers in another way: in the spermatheca are usually 5 million to 6 million sperm. For a queen exhausts this reserve in 5 years would by 1 to 1.2 million eggs per year . Laying 4000 eggs per day was to keep this standard approach for about 300 days year. Do you think this is credible? Do you think there is any place in the world one that can happen?

    From this I conclude that laying season is a local thing, having much more to do with local temperature and nectar / pollen flow than with scientific studies.
    I have seven winter apiaries. 2 of them are in one side of my country and the other 5 are in the other side of the country . In recent queens stop laying. In the other two have my strongest Lang with 7 to 8 frames with compact brood. And there are still a peak. 4 years ago that I see it every year. No wonder nothing what you say. But I think that was not the point of our analysis.

    "Those queens that live 4-5 years; do the bees supersede her because of her health or because she runs out of sperm? I thought the latter."
    This is the original question that I answered. ... Your answer to this question you still not given .

    Can you give me the reference on the assumption "a queen may release 5 to 7 sperm at the time the egg goes out the oviducts". Thank you!
    Last edited by Eduardo Gomes; 12-11-2014 at 01:32 PM.

  13. #72
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Canterbry, UK
    Posts
    2,480

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo Gomes View Post
    You still insist on the idea that 250,000 is a low number. Let's put the numbers in another way: in the spermatheca are usually 5 million to 6 million sperm. For a queen exhausts this reserve in 5 years would by 1 to 1.2 million eggs per year .
    Eduardo, this assumes that the queen uses a single sperm to fertilise each egg. It may be that does happen, but do we know it does?

    Mike (UK)
    The race isn't always to the swift, nor the fight to the strong, but that's the way to bet

  14. #73
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Portugal
    Posts
    1,288

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by mike bispham View Post
    Eduardo, this assumes that the queen uses a single sperm to fertilise each egg. It may be that does happen, but do we know it does?
    "Virgin queens mate early in their lives and only attend one mating flight. After several matings during this flight, a queen stores up to 100 million sperm within her oviducts. However, only five to six million are stored within the queen’s spermatheca. The queen uses only a few of these sperm at a time in order to fertilize eggs throughout her life." In http://www.orkin.com/stinging-pests/...ey-bee-mating/

    Mike, so far this is the best answer I have for your question. But I will research the research of others. I am a beekeeper , I am no researcher. When I can not find the solution for my questions or problems I look for the answers or the most experienced beekeepers or the researchers. You already know my method of approach. This matter does not seem to be answered by the former. So will be the latter.

  15. #74
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Canterbry, UK
    Posts
    2,480

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo Gomes View Post
    "Virgin queens mate early in their lives and only attend one mating flight. After several matings during this flight, a queen stores up to 100 million sperm within her oviducts. However, only five to six million are stored within the queen’s spermatheca. The queen uses only a few of these sperm at a time in order to fertilize eggs throughout her life." In http://www.orkin.com/stinging-pests/...ey-bee-mating/
    Thanks Eduardo. It was kind of an idle question on my part! I'm not really burning to know the answers to this stuff, so don't do lots of work on my behalf!

    Mike (UK)
    The race isn't always to the swift, nor the fight to the strong, but that's the way to bet

  16. #75
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    ceredigion (yes, its a county in West Wales UK)
    Posts
    166

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by kilocharlie View Post
    Also, a queen may release 5 to 7 sperm at the time the egg goes out the oviducts. Both of these factors reduce the "sperm longevity" of the queen.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo Gomes View Post
    The queen uses only a few of these sperm at a time in order to fertilize eggs throughout .
    Hi Eduardo and kilo, my googling has failed me, do you have any links to work on this = how many sperm a queen releases to fertilize an egg, (your above link wouldn't work for me Eduardo)
    It seems more likely to me she would release a squirt each time, containing many sperm.

  17. #76
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Portugal
    Posts
    1,288

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by mbc View Post
    your above link wouldn't work for me Eduardo).
    http://www.orkin.com/stinging-pests/...ey-bee-mating/
    Sorry but after a while it seems that the link no longer works . I'll try to find another access.
    Last edited by Eduardo Gomes; 12-11-2014 at 11:10 AM.

  18. #77
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Location
    ceredigion (yes, its a county in West Wales UK)
    Posts
    166

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Many thanks

    Having looked over the piece in the link, it's not really provided the enlightenment I was hoping for, anything a bit more authoritative?

  19. #78
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Ojai, California
    Posts
    2,572

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo Gomes View Post
    I answered a rare question then. I did not know that . Rare matters not deserve the most accurate answer possible in your opinion?
    Good to hear somebody still has 4 & 5 year old queens! I note the good 2-year-olds for candidates go to the drone yards, if they score high enough. Strong colonies of 2nd-year queens seem to always have more drones.


    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo Gomes View Post
    Sorry to hear that. In your opinion what are the causes?
    My opinion is that Americans are screwing up so much, so bad, and so fast we can't even identify, nor measure all the causes. This attitude of, "What's in it for me?", "If it doesn't agree with my opinion, you must suck!", "Not my problem", "That kind of thinking is so obsolete, I already saw it on YouTube last week!", "I'm better than you", "Don't inconvenience me, I need to get high" - it seems to be at, or very near the cause of many of the problems. The national personality is and has been going away from sustainability at high speed for a long time. Some are starting to talk about it, but to begin practicing it won't happen until the last tree is a national park. Pesticides are a problem, perhaps carbaryls and pyrethrins are a couple that are worse than neonicotinoids, but don't tell the liberal non-beekeeper I said that. They only want to have a march against neonic's down Main Street, then go have an organic beer or 12 and tell everyone how bitchin' they are. Agribusinessmen have tripled the amount of fungicides they used a few years ago, coincided with huge die-offs in 2012. Related? Maybe, bees do need fungi in their digestive tracts to digest the proteins from the pollens. I have no studies to prove nor disprove either way. I'd like to see it NOT HAPPEN, but's too late now - 2012 is gone with wind and the dead bees. They made a small increase in yield, and many beekeepers got 60% losses across the country.

    Chief Seattle, of the Dwamish and Squamish tribes concluded a speech, "...One thing is certain, continue to defecate in your own bed, and one day you will not awaken, having suffocated in your own waste."

    Many Americans seem to do a lot of things because they can, because it's cheaper, or because the saw it on TV (OK, the internet nowadays), or because they think it's "cool", not because they "should", nor do they listen to the Buddhist when he says, "Do nothing, time is precious." The don't give a thought about, "Is it wise?" If they do, wisdom to them is in a magazine about Feng Shui, or a cool line in a movie, or "how many Karma points do I get for it?". Few of them first master the self, few become caretakers of the earth and it's creatures, few are the seekers of truth, as passionate about wisdom as a drowning man is for a breath of air. Beekeepers are a shade to the brighter side. They are actually doing something that, done properly, leads toward "wisdom"! Especially those who study and ask lots of questions while practicing and revising this trade / craft / art, that is, they seek the wisdom in it and practice it. A yogi, a bodhisatva, or a guru would smile.


    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo Gomes View Post
    You still insist on the idea that 250,000 is a low number. Let's put the numbers in another way: in the spermatheca are usually 5 million to 6 million sperm. For a queen exhausts this reserve in 5 years would by 1 to 1.2 million eggs per year . Laying 4000 eggs per day was to keep this standard approach for about 300 days year. Do you think this is credible? Do you think there is any place in the world one that can happen?
    The part about 4 to 7 million sperm in the spermatheca I have read many studies with similar numbers, so agreed there, but the math applied to the days per year and number of years for EGGS seems skewed a bit. I think you assume one sperm per egg. The queen probably releases several sperm (5 to 7 released at a time was mentioned in a study - though I don't have it handy to back up the statement) with each egg to be fertilized when laying in a worker or a queen cell (my guess is perhaps more variability than this within a queen, and from queen to queen) If this is true, that immediately brings either the number of days per year or the number of years down to numbers consistent with what what we recognize as observed queen longevity - as much as 3 to up to 8 years. 2,000 eggs a day for 8 months (~240 days) is about 480,000 eggs, close to half a million eggs. Multiply that by 5, and you have about 2.4 million sperm per year. But she slows down that 3rd year, so she runs out in her 4th year if she is very prolific, and in good conditions for a lot of months, like I get to see in good years here, and what my friends report farther south in Mexico. In today's scene, with so many stressors (seen or unseen by us beekeepers or scientists) acting against the success of the hive, she gets superceded in year 2 or 3 before she runs out of sperm. Different locales, different numbers. Poorly mated queen, lower numbers. I'll have to get back into gambler mode and run a spreadsheet on all the sperm-to-longevity scenarios. I think queens get 86'ed (superceded) for running out of sperm, running out of eggs, or just plain slowing down too much to keep the colony viable (call it poor health or just old age).

    Tropical queens seem to be prolific, laying year-round, and tend to not live as long as temperate zone queens, who lay fewer eggs per year but last a few more years.

    I think that bees exposed to some chemicals have been shown to possibly lose some of their sensitivity to the quality of nectar and/or pollen, causing the bees to take interest only in very sweet, high-protein sources of nectar/pollen, thereby reducing both the total amount of nectar/pollen brought home and most certainly the total range of varieties down to a much narrower band of "acceptable" foods. This may be interpreted by the bees to render a "not enough bees in the house, therefore supercede the queen" reaction. Beekeepers interpret it as poor queen performance, when the reality was possibly imidicloprid or other chemical. If this is true, you see why I think more like 1 million to 2 million sperm per year are used by queens in strong colonies situated in mild climates, yet the hives aren't performing like the amount of brood would make me think they should. More bees bringing in less food. Plus, there's mites and other cooties subtracting from the score.


    Quote Originally Posted by Eduardo Gomes View Post
    I have seven winter apiaries. 2 of them are in one side of my country and the other 5 are in the other side of the country . In recent queens stop laying. In the other two have my strongest Lang with 7 to 8 frames with compact brood. And there are still a peak. 4 years ago that I see it every year. No wonder nothing what you say. But I think that was not the point of our analysis.

    "Those queens that live 4-5 years; do the bees supersede her because of her health or because she runs out of sperm? I thought the latter."
    This is the original question that I answered. ... Your answer to this question you still not given .

    Can you give me the reference on the assumption "a queen may release 5 to 7 sperm at the time the egg goes out the oviducts". Thank you!
    I don't clip all my queen's wings, so I rarely keep one that many years. I do lose some to swarming, mostly drone mothers. I call that "giving back to mother nature". But my oldest queens were both tired AND running out of sperm (or perhaps eggs). Which ever it is, or perhaps both reasons, she gets superceded. If I catch this in time, I'm harvesting supercedure cells and making nuc's or re-queening hives that need it for as long as I can. I will feed profusely and newspaper combine several weak hives to keep this going. Supercedure cells usually make good queens (probably average better than grafted E-cells from queenless starters), usually in low numbers like I want late in the season, when I have some time to play with this.

    I do not recall the study that mentioned in passing that "several" sperm are released with the eggs to be fertilized, nor the study referenced in the footnotes that explained it. I will ask the next PhD's I talk to, someone will likely say, "Oh, that's Dr. X over at the University of Gilligan's Island. Here, I'll text him." That, or they forward my email to a scientist who was in on that experiment. Then I get a study in a pdf download the next day with an answer. Gotta love people like that! So far, a lot of them seem to have a good idea about who knows what, and it's been fairly easy to get incredible help. Most of them seem delighted to help us beekeepers. Wish me luck, though, that can't hurt. I've certainly been very lucky so far
    Last edited by kilocharlie; 12-15-2014 at 01:54 AM.

  20. #79
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Portugal
    Posts
    1,288

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by kilocharlie View Post
    My opinion is that Americans are
    Kilo thanks for your good slow reply. Also in Portugal and in Europe there are many people with this "style" . Alessandro Baricco , an Italian writer, calls these "characters" new barbarians.

    Bees teach us to be more " slow ", more patients, more observant, more respectful of the rhythms of the natural cycles .

    On the question in debate I'm from an assumption that is capable of being wrong . I will also do my research. Good luck to you and good luck to us all!

  21. #80

    Default Re: Honeybee Genetics and Breeding Bees

    Quote Originally Posted by JSL View Post
    Queens can be re-inseminated. Harbo and perhaps others looked at this.
    Really, after first weeks and initial mating, as JRG13 doubted?

    Do you have any studies to link?

    Insemination becomes trickier.

Page 4 of 5 FirstFirst ... 2345 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •