testing treatments
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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Concrete, WA, USA
    Posts
    760

    Default testing treatments

    i sure hope that im not alone in saying that information is hard if not impossible to find or get out of companies
    having said that ill start with this - we treat and hope that the makers have done the testing ...but have they??? if so where are the reports? there findings?
    so for instance -- if i test a hive and find 5 mites per 300 bees - and i treat with say apiguard .... how long before for i do a post test ? a day,a week, month ??
    if i test for nosema and treat -- how long do i wait to test that hive again ??? to see if what i used even worked???
    if i test for mites and decide to dust with sugar - how long do i wait to test ??? 30 minutes or 3 days???

    so can you see more then just the tip of the ice berg???
    i think as beekeepers its our right to know this information - but yet NO COMPANY gives out this info??? why ?? i think its just because they really dont know either -

    i have to say that Randy Oliver is about the only one - but even then ive not found a true date to post test
    anyone else finding this ???
    Doing the Right things Right
    http://thevalleysbuzz.webs.com/

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  3. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
    Posts
    53,748

    Default Re: testing treatments

    One nice thing about a board under a SBB is you can do a 24 hour count to decide if you're going to treat, and now you have the baseline. Then you can do a count of how many died DURING the treatment and you have both a total and if you divide by the number of days you consider the treatment to be killing bees, you have the number killed. Then a week or two later you can see what the natural drop is and compare that to the baseline.

    I am only speculating. I think how long would depend on the type of treatment and when you removed it (in the case of strips, formic acid, thymol etc.). But after Oxalic vapor I would say they were still falling from the treatment for about a week. With powdered sugar I would expect that to be much shorter. With strips etc. I would expect it to end a few days after they are removed. Again if you use a board and you count every day, you could track the drop and have a pretty good idea when the numbers dropped off with that particular treatment.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 42y 40h 39yTF

  4. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Concrete, WA, USA
    Posts
    760

    Default Re: testing treatments

    i dont run sbb's on my hives - i find that a sample of 300 bees before treatment and 300 bees after is faster method -
    but id just like to find more info on the treatments they sell - like MAQS for example -- NOD has nothing as far as results but yet they sell it ??? dont make sence to me
    Doing the Right things Right
    http://thevalleysbuzz.webs.com/

  5. #4
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    moravia,ny
    Posts
    2,095

    Default Re: testing treatments

    your right about there is a lack of of info in this area. everyone has their own ideas but lack of proof. If there was a correct answer we would not have the problem.

  6. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Rhineland-Palatinate, Germany
    Posts
    855

    Default Re: testing treatments

    Check out where the products are developed and registered and you will find the answers you are looking for.

  7. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Volga, SD
    Posts
    2,792

    Default Re: testing treatments

    A lot of this depends on the persistence of the product you're using. If the product is put into a hive for a very short period of time, and if it is not persistent (that is, it kills for a short period of time before it breaks down into other things), you should be able to check for its effects very soon after the application. If it's a slower, more persistent product, you may have to wait longer.

    For example (like Michael Bush pointed out), powdered sugar is applied very quickly and is not persistent. Any drop of mites should happen very quickly. Within 24 hours -- 48 hours at the outside, I think -- the knock-down period should be over. Checking after that period of time would give you a good indication, I suspect.

    Something like Apistan is applied over a much longer period of time and persists for a while after application. Checking to so how effective it was a week after putting strips into hives wouldn't even complete the full application period and would give no idea of how well it worked.

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