How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees - Page 2
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  1. #21
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    Hey - I have an idea!

    Why don't we discuss the actual issue, instead of the way I chose to present it?
    The Barefoot Beekeeper http://www.biobees.com

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  3. #22
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    Quote Originally Posted by buckbee View Post
    Hey - I have an idea!

    Why don't we discuss the actual issue, instead of the way I chose to present it?
    There are so many "books" and so little time. Claim not to as one might, you must judge a book by it's cover. One might want to choose a better book cover next time. The inflamitory post title indicates no one is actually wanting to discuss, they've already made up their mind and just want to spout off on it.

    Or as buckbee says, "That way lies narrow-mindedness and, in extremis, fascism."

    If someone appears on your doorstep looking suspiciously in your window with a bloody brick in hand are you going to open the door to see what they want or leave it closed? I bet Neville Chamberlain wishes he would have judged a certain book by its cover and left the door closed.
    Ninja, is not in the dictionary. Well played Ninja's, well played...

  4. #23
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    "On the other hand, if you all want to understand what is really going on in the world (and I'm not targeting D Coates here), may I suggest you look for sources of information that are not Fox News, and concede that there are people out there who actually care about the future, the environment and yes - bees - and who are concerned when a conglomerate of Monsanto and Dow start pushing crops onto farmers - with government incentives."

    ahhhhhhh you think Fox News is biased? Doesn't give valid information? Are you with the same group of English scientists caught fudging the data on global warming? and now people who disagree with you don't care about the future or the environment?
    "If all you have is a hammer, the whole world is a nail." - A.H. Maslow

  5. #24
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    Quote Originally Posted by StevenG View Post
    Are you with the same group of English scientists caught fudging the data on global warming? and now people who disagree with you don't care about the future or the environment?
    Do you understand the term 'ad hominem'? You might like to look it up - but to save you the trouble, it means 'attacking the person instead of the argument'.

    And, for the record, I am not 'with' any group of scientists - whatever that means - and the fact that you still seem to think this is British research simply proves you have not bothered to read the article and chose instead to attack me because it requires no mental effort.

    Clearly, few here are interested in actual issues, so I will let you get back to rearranging the furniture on the Titanic.
    The Barefoot Beekeeper http://www.biobees.com

  6. #25
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    I did not know bees worked corn..learn something everyday! Corn is wind pollenated..it's why you have to plant several rows for it to make. Neat to know bees will forage it anyway.... I agree that Monsanto and Dow probally use their influence in Washington to protect their market...not a big fan of that. However, the development of GM plants, particuliarly with the stuff that can be oversprayed with Round-Up has led to LESS pesticide/herbicide usage. Whereas farmers had to use more expensive, and IMO more dangerous selective herbicides and spray them more often, now they can overspray once or twice with a realitively safe product, that is not very mobile once it contacts the soil and breaks down rapidly. Sounds like a boon for those concerned about the environment..that is if the goal is to actually use less pesticides. It may have even reduce pesticide use to the point that bees can work large cotton fields again...I'm still looking into that though... Just my 2 cents.
    Buffalo Lick Farm & Nursery
    http://www.buffalolick.com

  7. #26
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    Oh and I forgot to add that the science of splicing genes onto a virus in order to modify the cells and the overall organisim has applications beyond just Round-up tolerant plants...could one day cure cancer and HIV and all the other genetic diseases.
    Buffalo Lick Farm & Nursery
    http://www.buffalolick.com

  8. #27
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    Here's a good watch on Hulu about them... (It is free)

    http://www.hulu.com/watch/67878/the-future-of-food

    They are going to mess everything up if they aren't carefull.
    Find A Beekeeper - Swarm List
    "There's nothing wrong with me, it's the rest of the world that has a problem"

  9. #28
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    Leith ND USA
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    Getting past the sensational title of this thread, it does lead to some interesting questions.

    In our small corner of the world, we have noticed a huge increase in the amount of corn planted, along with oil sunflowers.
    Our beeyards are on alfalfa hay fields, and sweet clover pasture. Most of the yards are within 3 miles of the row crops. The bees seem to get some pollen from both corn and sunflowers.
    There are several beekeepers near us. This year, many of them have lost at least half of their hives, including us.

    It was an odd summer, cool and moist. The bees made more honey than some of the dry years, and were heavy with honey stores. They were fed pollen patties, and were treated on schedule.

    It actually was much like the summer of 1997, which was also cool, and wet, but we did not have high numbers of bee dieoffs.

    If there actually is a correlation here between bee dieoffs and corn, what is the next step?

    Tina Huelsdonk
    Opp Honey

  10. #29
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    Just because one believes this is an actual issue and supports it with questionable Internet sources does not make it so. This is not personal and this is no attack. We all have the right to question the motives of others. There's nothing facist about that. Unfortunately, the title of the post clearly shows bias, and inflammatory bias at that.

    At this point taking this post seriously as something to consider as neutral is like openly talking about ones personal investment strategies with someone who's got snake oil to sell.
    Ninja, is not in the dictionary. Well played Ninja's, well played...

  11. #30
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    yup my bees was workin corn last year. had em on watermelons an it seemed
    they worked gmo corn early til flowers opened. cant say it hurt em none.
    as far as what the goverment will do. there is old orchards round here folks cant live on cause of recomendations from goverments on sprayin fruit.
    bees matters always take a backseat on fundin if at all.
    they hopein to make bees irelivent for pollination.
    some of the chemicals that aint allowed here is openly sold in other countrys.
    have intrest in pecan. wont able to spray a fungicide in this country an in mexico they do then ship the nuts into the states. with some crops you gotta rotate fungicides cause they build up reistants. with that spray you
    didnt have to.

  12. #31
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    Here's where the original post at least appears to disintegrate into propaganda:

    *Smartstax can end bees* -posted by buckbee
    *Smartstax can end bees* -posted by buckbee
    The real charges leveled in the quotations are accusations of chemicals used as seed treatments. Only very nebulous "GM seems to be bad, too" statements are made.

    "Smartstax" is not synonymous with "seed treatment." The two are quite different things.

    Oh, and by the way, the chemical named by trade name in the post is patented by a corporation that remains unnamed in the title and in the original post. Most of the accusations are actually made against that chemical. What gives?

    Odd that these threads are coming from overseas. Have you witnessed beekeeping in the areas that have most widely adopted the agricultural practices that you're condemning?

  13. #32
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    sutton this has nothing to do with monsanto or bayer it has to do with someone who knows better posing as an expert.

    The references in the article are not what is considered peer reviewed science. The references are a mix of product literature, newspaper articles and opinion articles.

    Call your local university bee researcher or other university researcher and show them this piece of crap and see if they agree with me. Just the title of the article puts it in the same arena of Glenn Beck and Jeff Rense with the anti government rant that appeals to fear factor.

    I find this kind of anti people junk news distasteful and hurtful to our society. You have to believe in something when you get up in the morning and I believe most people and even those whom work for big corporations are decent people not out to get bees etc.

    One final thought sure there are instances where bees can feed on corn pollen but for the most part its a last resort in drought etc. How many of us here on bee source have hives surrounded by corn and have good bees and a honey crop?

  14. #33
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    i was figurein feral bees was like the canarys in the mines. bees is in trouble.
    how many on bee source would rather have there bees only work organic
    growed crops or flowers. only fokes that gonna truely no how our action of today afects the tomarows of bees is historians an seems some of them got biasis to.
    as far as corperations. cant say that i seen to many registered as non profit
    organizations. there job is to seperate you from your money our job is to make sure all the blood sweat an tears it cost to get it is worth it.

  15. #34
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    I'm no conspiracy theorist but it has been very well documented that the chemical companies have created and sold many pestisides and herbicides over the years and claimed there were no adverse affects to anything other plant or animal than what they said it would affect. We know now from there own documentation they knew otherwise and all they were doing were trying to fill there own coffers and keep there stock holders happy. I'm not saying they have'nt improved the life of many people over the years I would be very wrong to say otherwise. But the pursuit of the dollar has become more important than the saftey. I do not begrudge a company the right to make a profit but in this case the ends do not justify the means. I am 42 years old and have helped spray some chemicals over the years that were legal but are now outlawed and for good reason. We now know that many of them never go away and have contaminated wells and caused birth defects and a host of other things sometimes the ground is so permiated with the chems you can smell it in the soil. the chem companys new this in most cases and hid and lied about it. There is no doubt because of the sheer amount of the world poulation we need chems just to make the amount of food to feed the world. Over the years we have screwed the balance of nature up so badly that the checks and balances are no longer there. So what do we do. Vicious trap we have created.

  16. #35
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    99.99% of questions can be answered by Just reading books.

  17. #36
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    Quote Originally Posted by trapperbob View Post
    There is no doubt because of the sheer amount of the world poulation we need chems just to make the amount of food to feed the world.
    This is a myth. Pro-chemical lobby is all over the media with this argument but it is far from truth...

    See here :

    http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/...other.ssl.html
    http://ec.europa.eu/agriculture/orga.../true-false_en

    The thing is that more and more farmers are deciding to go without chemicals and the crop is the same. One interesting thing is that some of the farmers around here don't even buy corn seeds anymore. They use their own seed now. 5 years ago if you told them to use their own seed they would just laugh at you. Today is completely different story. I also see more and more green manure and crop rotation than just 5 years ago. There is hope.....
    Sig

  18. #37
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    Its all just talk untill someone goes to jail or at least gets litigated successfully. In the meantime, hand me that tin foil please.

  19. #38
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    Beenovice if we used are seed around here there would probably be a mutimillion dollar law suit because the seed here is under patents. In your country this might work fine and I think that its great you can do that. There are many farmers that dont use chems here but the stuff they are growing has been genetically modified to be resitant. Thats one more thing that chem companys have tied up here. Monsanto and a few others have cornered the market here. A farmer would not have a chance those companys would mow him down under such a legal battle he would go out of business because ofthe sheer money involved.

  20. #39
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    Tin Foil hats for all!
    99.99% of questions can be answered by Just reading books.

  21. #40
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    Default Re: How Monsanto, Dow and the US Govt are planning to kill your bees

    Quote Originally Posted by trapperbob View Post
    Beenovice if we used are seed around here there would probably be a mutimillion dollar law suit because the seed here is under patents. In your country this might work fine and I think that its great you can do that. There are many farmers that dont use chems here but the stuff they are growing has been genetically modified to be resitant. Thats one more thing that chem companys have tied up here. Monsanto and a few others have cornered the market here. A farmer would not have a chance those companys would mow him down under such a legal battle he would go out of business because ofthe sheer money involved.
    It's old seed....not GM...not patented.
    Sig

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