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Hands off Beekeeping.....for the most part.

13K views 59 replies 30 participants last post by  kilocharlie 
#1 ·
I see people talking about weekly inspections, about rotating boxes
and it makes me wonder, does everyone
do this? Is there anyone else out there
that operates on the principal of just
leave them alone?
What I mean is I treat mine with Formic Pro in the fall and in the spring. I might go in them once a month the check the supers.
I never rotate the boxes as I figure they have
been raising bees a longer than I have. I just let them be bees.
I also will not cut comb , I figure they lose
honey production when they are replacing comb.
 
#33 ·
Until you KNOW that your bees have the traits, such as mite biting, required to survive the mites and the diseases that the bees are exposed to in recent decades, "Hands-Off" beekeeping is just cruelty to animals - sacrificing bees to the mites.

Responsible beekeepers are using IPM - Integrated Pest Management methods until they can be sure that the bees can make it on their own. This basically means that we admit that the mites are here, they are here to stay, but we are going to torture them and never let them get a foothold! We economize a regimen of light, moderate, firm, and occasionally a heavy treatment (usually formic acid about August 15th) instead of going "treatment-free". This approach has been documented to deliver more bees each Spring.

No doubt that in the long run, "Treatment-Free" beekeeping will be better, but until you have bees (and beekeepers who are fully armed with the know-how) that can handle today's stresses, both man-made and natural, IPM is the best approach.

To learn more about IPM, check out www.scientificbeekeeping.com
 
#37 ·
Last internal inspection June 29, 2019. We'll see. I'm not pretending this is the best way. It is experimental and I am making observations about different hive designs and entrances.
 
#39 ·
Sure, but that 99% of them died despite having natural comb and not being fed sugar, demonstrates there is more to it than that.

My own reading indicates that a large part of it is genetics. Not the whole story either, which we know because of the way they die when moved to another area. But there is so much anecdotal evidence people report of good results once they get the right genetics, seems to me it must be an important factor.
 
#40 ·
It wouldn't surprise me if diet isn't playing some kind of role. The type of forage differs markedly from one area to another, and is implicated in disease resistance generally. Mono-floral diets are probably none too healthy.
LJ
 
#41 ·
Being in an area where ‘hands off beekeeping’ is possible due to not having the pests in the area it’s still recommended to do regular inspections as this is the difference between having bees and keeping bees. A hands off approach is still viewed as irresponsible but for different reasons. Swarm prevention is the main reason for me breaking the brood nest apart. There’s already too many tree colonies in the area stealing native hollows displacing the local fauna.
Yeah, i know, how do I cope....��
 
#43 ·
Being in an area where ‘hands off beekeeping’ is possible due to not having the pests in the area it’s still recommended to do regular inspections as this is the difference between having bees and keeping bees. A hands off approach is still viewed as irresponsible but for different reasons. Swarm prevention is the main reason for me breaking the brood nest apart. There’s already too many tree colonies in the area stealing native hollows displacing the local fauna.
Yeah, i know, how do I cope....��
Must not have Small Hive Beetles. Contastly letting those out of jail will quickly become a problem!

As far as swarm prevention. Don't let core broodnest area become backfilled and keep the young wax builders depleted dramatically reduces swarming.
 
#49 ·
I think running test hives is the best way to attempt this hands off approach. Like a few others said, inspections help catch problems early so they can be corrected. Also these hives would be more prone to varroa if you aren’t breaking the brood pattern w splits
 
#52 ·
>The honey flows are totally different today.

Yes. People stopped using sweet clover for hay, the farmers started killing every weed in the fields, the ditches are sprayed with 24D, the famers here have stopped growing much alfalfa, and even when they did grow it, they started cutting it as soon as it started to bloom.
 
#54 ·
Not just kilocharley:
"...cruelty to animals"
"the mites are here, they are here to stay, but we are going to torture them and never let them get a foothold!"
I guess we humans advocate for cruelty against some and not others. I have yet to find good fly food and cat swatters (might be a market gap?)
Obviously I can see why we selct some and not others for our support but I don't think there is really good moral grounds for one over the other. Ie suggesting that someone is abusing their livestock (bees) by not abusing the mites just seems like a spurious argument.
Now, being concerned that someone is abusing their neighbor's bees and forcing them to abuse not only their mites but also yours, because you are unwilling to abuse your own mites, is something responsible beekeepers, whether tf or not, should be aware of....
For me, weekly inspections are not needed. Knowing what is going on, what should be going on, and how to tell quickly of things are off track, so I know who to inspect is important. (eg mating nucs that don't get checked in time may become lw if all did not go to plan.) Knowing how and when to do what, does, in my experience, come from checking more often than needed in the beginning. So until you know you can be successful checking less often, I'd suggest checking more often. Besides, that's the fun part! 🙂
Happy beekeeping everyone!
 
#55 ·
Me, I find generally speaking, my gals do far better on their own than with me attempting to ultra manage anything "I" want them to do and whenever "I" want them to do it. Here, SW WA, my bees do according to the seasons, and are simply far better at doing when they should. For instance last year, prior to the 5 month dearth which began mid May, many of my hives had backfilled their upper deeps with the winter crowns by mid may. No way I had any knowledge that would happen in an area where we typically get a blackberry flow in June, but didn't due to the dearth of 2018. And yes, I even added supers to get the non-existent blackberry flow.

Hives too distant for me to micromanage, I often find them better off than those I do micromanage.

But at the same time, I am keeping bees because of my compulsive beekeeping addiction, not for the purpose of making money from pollinating or honey harvesting. The 24 gallons of honey this year was just as much a bother as it was a benefit to me. I'm just in it for the putzing. But for a beek (ie. "not" me) wanting to send bees to the almonds from here, it essentially requires one to be feeding both pollen sub and sugar water, at a time when un-managed hives or feral hives are reducing down their brood chambers, (and in my hives now, there is near no brood, not what one wants for almonds).

My major manipulation in late winter/early spring, when I do not reverse the 2 deeps, but add the excluder directly above the brood chamber and supers above that.

And in the summer/fall, entrance reducers go on during the robbing/YJ season. And if my hives do not defend/protect themselves, "oh well, didn't need them genes in my apiary anyway" Ain't my job to do all in my power to protect from robbers. And when bearding begins in spring, that is my sign to remove the reducers.

Hive management?: Just depends! What exactly are you striving for with your hives? Can/will they do it better without you, or do you need to intervene to pull it off?

If ya want a good nectar flow brought in, ya may just need to help your bees get built up in the spring prior to the flow by feeding sugar water and pollen sub, and here, during a time when spring weather is wet and cold and restrictive to bees going out in it.

Are your bees your animal husbandry force, managed by you, or are they just some feral critters you happened to have supplied a house for, and are to be left alone?
 
#57 ·
I don't break my brood Chambers down. I may check the top super and see if another is needed. Other than that, I only go down to the brood chamber twice a year. Once in the spring and then once in the fall and add Formic Pro strips. I don't try to stop swarming, I just try to have enough traps around to catch them
 
#58 ·
>One of Seeley's papers on bee genetics says that low levels of African genetics are now in the feral bee populations he studies.

People brought African queens and most every other kind of honey bee queens into the US back in the 1800s. Then the USDA was breeding crosses of African and European bees and sending them all over the US back in the 60's with stock they got from Kerr who gets blamed for the whole AHB issue. These were shipped to Madison and Laramie and other places in the US by the thousands. So my guess is that African genetics will show up most anywhere in the US and has been there for more than a century with a new infusion half a century ago.
 
#59 ·
Re: 'hand's off' beekeeping ...

All of my hives are 100% 'hand's off' between Late October and early March. It's the only hard and fast 'rule' I've adopted with beekeeping.

The singular exception to this is if I should spot a colony not putting any bees into the air on one of those sunny Winter days we occasionally get, when fair numbers of bees enjoy a clearance flight - then I'll take a peek to see if anything's wrong. Otherwise the hives remain untouched.
LJ
 
#60 ·
As for me ans my bees, I tend to check them as close to the 1st, the 10th, and the 20th of each month during the Spring, then slow it down somewhat after the nectar flows taper off.

This is not to say that if I'm feeding a drop and I spot a colony or 2 with abnormal beehaviour, I won't check things out immediately (unless it is too cold to do so). I do. This may save a colony, or I might combine two or even 3 weak colonies and make it over Winter because I did.
 
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