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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Red Wing, Minnesota, USA
    Posts
    4

    Default Hived a new swarm, 5 minutes later they moved into an occupied hive.

    I do not see much information on this. Caught one of my own swarms last night(large swarm) and dumped them into new box. (I have done this before successfully). This time they streamed with purpose to the occupied hive right next to them and began keening like mad. 10 minutes later they were all in the occupied hive. This hive is an established new spring package built up nicely to 3 mediums and 2 honey supers. Saw no fighting as they entered the entrance. So whats going on? Im assuming the swarm queen is in there along with the package queen? Killing each other? The packaged hive had a ton of bees to begin with, now I can only imagine what there is now. Has anyone had experience with this and what should I do or expect with this hive? We are in the middle of a major honey flow. Would appreciate some feedback. Thanks so much, Sara Alms

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    hinesville ga usa
    Posts
    343

    Default Re: Hived a new swarm, 5 minutes later they moved into an occupied hive.

    I have seen swarms do that with a new split before they had a chance to raise a laying queen. My best guess is that your established colony were in the middle of getting rid of their old queen and raising a replacement queen, if the new queen wasn't mated they would have welcomed your new swarm's queen. But it is unusual.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Stockton, CA
    Posts
    306

    Default Re: Hived a new swarm, 5 minutes later they moved into an occupied hive.

    Could they have swarmed from that hive originally? Maybe go throw that one and see if there's open queen cells or newly torn down ones.

    Have you ever put a frame of open brood in a new swarm? I've done it to ever swarm and yet to have one leave.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Hudson, WI USA
    Posts
    2,195

    Default Re: Hived a new swarm, 5 minutes later they moved into an occupied hive.

    Try a search for "usurpation". There was an article in Bee Culture or the ABJ on this by Wyatt Magnum a while ago.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Red Wing, Minnesota, USA
    Posts
    4

    Default Re: Hived a new swarm, 5 minutes later they moved into an occupied hive.

    Quote Originally Posted by stan.vick View Post
    I have seen swarms do that with a new split before they had a chance to raise a laying queen. My best guess is that your established colony were in the middle of getting rid of their old queen and raising a replacement queen, if the new queen wasn't mated they would have welcomed your new swarm's queen. But it is unusual.
    I am sure they did not swarm from the new package, I checked today for swarm cells/queen cups, none found. I suspect it was from a hive that threw a previous swarm exactly a month ago. The activity around that hive today is zero, all other hives look busy as usual and pulling a ton of nectar. The new package together with its new swarm has twice the foragers coming and going as they did the day before. Still wondering what I will end up with queen wise. Thank you for the response, Sara

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Red Wing, Minnesota, USA
    Posts
    4

    Default Re: Hived a new swarm, 5 minutes later they moved into an occupied hive.

    Quote Originally Posted by beesohappy View Post
    Could they have swarmed from that hive originally? Maybe go throw that one and see if there's open queen cells or newly torn down ones.

    Have you ever put a frame of open brood in a new swarm? I've done it to ever swarm and yet to have one leave.
    I know thats a great idea, but it was getting dark when I discovered them and I did not want to go through hives to find brood. Last year I saw one of my hives swarming to a tree, ran to get a bait box and lemon grass, 20 minutes later I came back and the swarm had left the yard!!. Never found them. Thanks

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Red Wing, Minnesota, USA
    Posts
    4

    Default Re: Hived a new swarm, 5 minutes later they moved into an occupied hive.

    Quote Originally Posted by Adrian Quiney WI View Post
    Try a search for "usurpation". There was an article in Bee Culture or the ABJ on this by Wyatt Magnum a while ago.
    Adrian, I found the article, thanks so much for that! Sounds like in most cases, the swarm queen wins out and the occupied hive bees except her within a very short time. I better put on more supers!! Thanks so much, Sara

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