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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Manitoba Canada
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    5,905

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    Harry, what was the cost per square foot?
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Salem, Oregon
    Posts
    948

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian View Post
    Harry, what was the cost per square foot?
    Well this is one of those, "Either I can spend two hours looking up two year old invoices, or you can get current material prices."
    One way gives you out dated info and wastes my time, the other gives you meaningful info and starts you on the path.
    Sorry Ian; I have already gone through it all and you will have to also.
    Just remember to factor in the floor machine rental, abrasive pads, degreaser, beer, etc..
    I repeat; go to YouTube and watch every single epoxy video that you can first.
    If I had not done that, I would have had no idea of how sorely deficient the prep info was on the Rustolium videos.
    That said, with proper prep their floor is to die for.
    I have exactly ONE hive more than you.
    That makes my opinion beyond question.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Menomonee Falls, Wis.
    Posts
    2,689

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    I can not accurately answer whether a single story or 2 story building is cheaper. As a general rule, going up is cheaper than going out, but the cost of the prestressed concrete floor may equal the savings in roof area.

    In the 60's, we had an agitated tank in a 4 foot pit with a Moyno pump feeding a spin-float. The majority of the stoppages in production involved the agitated tank and pump. Broken frame pieces and wax balls would stop the pump.

    In the 80's, the shop was moved to a 2 story building. fewer barrels where overfilled, mostly because a bigger tank with a bigger valve was used. The operator stayed with the barrel as it filled.

    Crazy Roland

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Manitoba Canada
    Posts
    5,905

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    Quote Originally Posted by HarryVanderpool View Post
    One way gives you out dated info and wastes my time, the other gives you meaningful info and starts you on the path.
    Sorry Ian; I have already gone through it all and you will have to also.
    thanks Harry
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Manitoba Canada
    Posts
    5,905

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Crabo View Post
    We are considering building a new honey house
    Say Crabo, I have just built a new one. The most useful thing about my building is the office area. I centralize my entire operation around this space as it provides a place to separate your house from the honey house. If you have a corner in your building, make space for it!
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Manitoba, Canada
    Posts
    432

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Ian View Post
    what kind of sealer do you use Allen?
    Have used a couple and have settled on sealer from Menards. Cost me about $50 a year for the 2000+ square feet for the hot room and extracting room.

    Prep work would be similar to what Harry described. In new concrete etching or a good scrubber does the trick. I acid etched the concrete in the extracting facilities and only used the floor scrubber in the super storage building with equally good results. Annually we pressure wash the floor, scrub it with a floor scrubber and then seal it. Sealing it only takes a couple hours.

    I am sure the epoxy finish is superior, but I am very satisfied with the sealer. Very easy to clean, sweep or mop. The only negatives for me is that with snow on the feet it can be slippery - not sure how this would compare with epoxy. Some moisture does seem to get through and if the floor gets a lot of water on it, spots get a wet look but it dries much faster than untreated concrete. If you don't wash with bleach water periodically so mold does appear. After 5 years I have no mold spots on the floor. I am not sure how much build up there will be after a lot of years, but as of now this is not a problem.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    D/FW, TX
    Posts
    32

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    Thanks for everyone's advice so far. It looks like we will start with a 30x40. We have a 60 frame Cowen and are waiting on some plans from them. It is not a lot of space, but we are going to build it and place it where we can add on to it at a later date.

    One of the things we want to do is include some area where we can process deer and make sausage. We found some used stainless steel sinks that we can get cheap and I think we can make that work also.

    I was thinking for the walls of the hot room, and cold storage, that it might be a good idea to use metal studs instead of wood. Anyone have an opinion on that?

    What is the most cost effective way to do the walls since they will get power washed from time to time?

    Any opinions on using a tankless water heater for cleanup? I understand that one that will heat to 180 really helps with the cleanup.

    My background is Paint and Body. My wife is the beekeeper and this is new to me. She has some really good friends who are helping and mentoring her.
    Last edited by Crabo; 06-12-2014 at 12:40 AM.

  8. #28

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    As a painting contractor the best prep for a Epoxy floor is in order of best blast track, diamond grind, acid wash is the poorest. Even a new floor will get blast track for the main reason it provides tooth for the epoxy.
    David

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Montgomery County, NY
    Posts
    1,716

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Roland View Post
    I can not accurately answer whether a single story or 2 story building is cheaper. As a general rule, going up is cheaper than going out, but the cost of the prestressed concrete floor may equal the savings in roof area.

    In the 60's, we had an agitated tank in a 4 foot pit with a Moyno pump feeding a spin-float. The majority of the stoppages in production involved the agitated tank and pump. Broken frame pieces and wax balls would stop the pump.

    In the 80's, the shop was moved to a 2 story building. fewer barrels where overfilled, mostly because a bigger tank with a bigger valve was used. The operator stayed with the barrel as it filled.

    Crazy Roland
    Living history and excellent feedback. Spin float in the 60's.

    What was the serial number? Was it 3?

    Roland thank you very much for more insight.

    Please elaborate on the cost of prestressed concrete floor being = to roof area?

    So I agree with the operator staying with the drum. Nothing like natural sight and the operator I speak of doesn't have a large crew. 2 person crew in fact. I offered to set them up a CC video feed to downstairs so they can see if disaster happens without being down there every two minutes.

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Montgomery County, NY
    Posts
    1,716

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Crabo View Post
    What is the most cost effective way to do the walls since they will get power washed from time to time?
    Any opinions on using a tankless water heater for cleanup? I understand that one that will heat to 180 really helps with the cleanup.
    I am convinced with White roofing tin on the entire interior. Its accepted here for both butcher shops and honey houses.

    I know one person who uses a tankless hotwater heater and he is an engineer and swears by it. With that said he uses a lot of hot water as he owns and operates a commercial winery.

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    D/FW, TX
    Posts
    32

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    [QUOTE=BMAC;1121731]I am convinced with White roofing tin on the entire interior. Its accepted here for both butcher shops and honey houses.

    /QUOTE]

    How do you prep the walls behind the tin? How are the windows and door trimmed out to keep water from running behind the tin?

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Menomonee Falls, Wis.
    Posts
    2,689

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    For equal floor space, a 2 story building will have half the footings and roof costs. That will be offset by the higher cost of precast spancrete foor for the upstairs. A person would have to talk to a contractor and find out the exact costs.

    I do not know the number on the Spinfloat, but the Cowen was the first one delivered East of the Mississippi, I believe in a Datsun pickup by Mr. Cowen.

    For drum filling in the 60's, I made a float that activated a door bell buzzer when the drum was full. Xan't trust them teenagers(me) to be on the ball.

    It would be interesting to examine the costs on a staggered 2 story building, The down fall of the spancrete is that it stays cool, and creates a basement humidity problem. If the 2 stories where shifted(built on a hill like ours), so that the lower section had it's own roof over half it's area, and half the upper was on a slab, it might be an improvement. Our downstairs is for full and empty barrel storage, and is really too low, barrels can be stacked only 3 high.

    I would be careful with the white steel on the walls vs. freezer board. Talk to your inspector and get his opinion first.

    Crazy Roland

  13. #33
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Montgomery County, NY
    Posts
    1,716

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    Yes so it does depend upon your inspector and state regulations. Fortunately here we are allow to use the white roofing tin. As far as trimming the windows and doors, the company that rolls out the tin also make trim and installs it for me. Zero wall prep behind it set aside insulate and wire the walls. keeping water out from behind the walls is done with caulk. Only need to caulk outlets, windows and such as the tin is overlapped.

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Gallatin, Montana, USA
    Posts
    80

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    We recently remodeled a vet clinic we built 10 years ago and there was no sign of moisture in the walls. We have also replaced the fiberglass panels in a vet clinic and a couple of dairy barns with metal panels because the metal is easier to keep clean and they last longer. The metal panel we use has a finish warranty of 45 years when used on the exterior. The metal is smooth and the fiberglass is rough. We also do quite a few 2 and 3 story buildings and the cost per sq. foot on the multi story buildings is quite a bit less. Here in Montana we pay about $3.50/sf for an 1-1/2" light weight concrete floor. We also use a product called diamond seal. It is very hard, and easy to apply. The solvent based sealer products are a lot better than the water based products. The other thing to consider with the sealers is when you apply. Some you apply within 24 hours of the pour and some 30 days after the pour. The ones you use 30 days later are better but sometimes you just can't wait that long.

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Saskatchewan, Canada
    Posts
    252

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    We built a 48 x 64 honey house. The floors have been epoxied. The building is divided into 4 rooms, extracting, hot, storage and office with bathroom and shower.. Honey sump is surface to meet inspection standards. We have 2 U floor sumps, one for the extracting room and the other does the hot room and storage area. They are pumped to septic system so as to meet inspection standards. All walls and roof were engineered panels insulated at R35. All floors other than the extracting room are heated. Wiring is done with Tech cable. Lighting is florescent.

  16. #36
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Manitoba Canada
    Posts
    5,905

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    Just got my electrical done, waiting on my hydro hook up. Everything is just about in place, just a few things to finish up. Cant wait to get the place into production!
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  17. #37
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Montgomery County, NY
    Posts
    1,716

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    PIC Ian. We demand PICS!

  18. #38
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Manitoba Canada
    Posts
    5,905

    Default Re: Honey house questions

    ya I guess its been a while since I posted pics of the set up. Will do within the next week or so!
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

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