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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Marietta, Ohio USA
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    108

    Default Do I wire medium frames?

    I have a quick question as a a total newbee. I am putting all of my equipment together for two 10-frame hives and will be using medium boxes for supers.

    My question is, "Do I run horizontal support wires on the medium frames as I did for the deeps?"

    I am using crimped wire foundation in a wedgetop frame.

    Thanks in advance for your help.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    St. Albans, Vermont
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    5,313

    Default Re: Do I wire mediaum frames?

    I do.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
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    26,632

    Default Re: Do I wire mediaum frames?

    Doing so makes the comb stronger than not doing so. Meaning that the comb will be less apt to blow out of the frame when extracted.
    Mark Berninghausen "That which works, persists."

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Shickshinny, Pennsylvania
    Posts
    827

    Default Re: Do I wire mediaum frames?

    I've been running one wire on Mediums , time will tell but that seems like enough support to me .
    Second Year 4 Hives T USDA Zone 5b

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Bertie County,NC
    Posts
    870

    Default Re: Do I wire mediaum frames?

    with crimped wired foundation...I would not

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    26,632

    Default Re: Do I wire mediaum frames?

    Well, u r a NewJoe. So maybe you might want to ask why an Old Mike says he does.
    Mark Berninghausen "That which works, persists."

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Bertie County,NC
    Posts
    870

    Default Re: Do I wire mediaum frames?

    guess just preference.....heck I run foundationless now and only wire the deep frames. But you are still correct this is only my 3rd spring.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Big Stone Gap, VA
    Posts
    945

    Default Re: Do I wire mediaum frames?

    I do not wire my medium foundationless frames.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Accomac, Virginia
    Posts
    186

    Default Re: Do I wire mediaum frames?

    I do, just finished another hundred mediums.
    Ed

  10. #10
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Algoma dr. Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    717

    Default Re: Do I wire mediaum frames?

    With foundationless it is dead easy to prewire and the bees do the embedding as they build the comb. With the vertical embbed wired wax foundation it all depends on the particular batch of foundation, whether it will hang straight down or turn into a cupcake once the sheets are taken from the bundle and hung in the frames. You might get away with not cross wiring it. I cheated this year and put together super frames with plastic foundation.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Tucson, Arizona, USA
    Posts
    5,320

    Default Re: Do I wire medium frames?

    If it's foundationless or with beeswax foundation, even those with vertical crimp wires, I try to put two horizontal support wires and embed them into the beeswax foundation, or let the bees incorporate them into foundationless comb. Every so often I miss one and it gets drawn without horizontal support wires, but those are the exceptions. I tried fishing line, but didn't really like it.
    Last edited by Joseph Clemens; 03-18-2014 at 08:31 AM.
    48 years - 50 hives - TF
    Joseph Clemens -- Website Under Constructioni

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Marietta, Ohio USA
    Posts
    108

    Default Re: Do I wire mediaum frames?

    Thanks everyone for your responses to my question.

    I think it will be better to be safe than sorry and run at least one horizontal wire across my mediums.
    My concern was addressed in one of the answers above, would extracting honey cause them to blow out.
    Thanks again to the members of this forum for taking their time to anwer my question.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
    Posts
    45,827

    Default Re: Do I wire mediaum frames?

    I've been extracting mediums with NO wire whatsoever for 13 years with no issues. The main reason to put a horizontal wire in with vertical wires already there is to keep it flat. The vertical wires have a tendency to make the comb bow (the wire tries to get back to the curve of the spool…)
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Columbus, ohio
    Posts
    45

    Default Re: Do I wire mediaum frames?

    I run both wire on all my medium frames. It seems to me that running one is just as much work as running both.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Algoma dr. Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    717

    Default Re: Do I wire mediaum frames?

    Quote Originally Posted by ukewarrior View Post
    I run both wire on all my medium frames. It seems to me that running one is just as much work as running both.
    I agree; If the frames are pre drilled and you want to use one wire only, you have to choose top or bottom or else drill a new hole either side midway. You still need the same number of anchors for one wire as for two.

    Even for deeps, I like the nice guaranteed flat foundation that all four wires gives. Tried two wires and was only so, so, pleased with the results and not much savings.

    Frank

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Tucson, Arizona, USA
    Posts
    5,320

    Default Re: Do I wire medium frames?

    Actually, when I wire medium frames with the usual, two wires, I put one small nail on the edge of the End Bar, between the two wire holes, then thread the wire from the end with the nail, fasten the loose end of the wire to the nail (I tie it with a simple knot, so it won't easily come off when the wire is tensioned). I then drop the frame into a Pro-Grip clamp, that is configured like a vice on my bench top. I then tighten the clamp on the frame End Bars, so it puts a little bow in them. I then trim the end of the wire that is still attached to the spool, pull it tight with needle nose pliers, wrap it around the same nail, also with a knot, tap in the nail firmly, break off the wire ends so there are no sharp wires protruding, and finally I slowly release the frame from the vice. I've learned to coordinate how hard to clamp the frame and how tight to pull the wire, so it comes out just right - it is very easy to have the wire so tight with this technique, that releasing the frame from the vice almost immediately snaps the wire. I had two or three fail like this, when I first began using the vice, but soon learned how much tension to use with this technique.

    Instead of eyelets, I use 3/8" leg, T-50 staples, strategically placed adjacent to the wire holes, to keep the wire from cutting into the frame wood and losing its' tension.

    This tensions the horizontal frame wires, very nicely. I've also had some frames where the 3/8" thick Bottom Bars were weak enough that they would bow under this much tension, but since I began cutting my Bottom Bars 1/2" thick, this rarely happens any more. When it did, I would drill a small hole at the lowest point of the bow and another one, opposite that in the Top Bar, then run a wire between the holes, pulling it just tight enough to pull the Bottom Bar straight. I'd tie it around the Bottom Bar, but anchor it with a nail in the top of the Top Bar.

    I put only three horizontal wires in my foundationless deep frames. This requires an anchor nail near the top of the End Bar on one side and near the bottom on the opposite End Bar.
    Last edited by Joseph Clemens; 03-18-2014 at 09:05 AM.
    48 years - 50 hives - TF
    Joseph Clemens -- Website Under Constructioni

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Crown Point, NY, USA
    Posts
    44

    Default Re: Do I wire medium frames?

    I use horizontal wiring on all frames. I use a modified 5 wire on deep frames and 4 wire on mediums. Wrap and tie the wire on the end bars. I use staples from the dollar store for 1000 in a box instead of eyelets. Staples are way faster then eyelets also. Pick up a wire crimper for like 15 bucks from your favorite bees supply and all those wires will be tight w/o having to bow the frames or pull the wires , ect.

    Clay

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Bastrop TX USA
    Posts
    210

    Default Re: Do I wire medium frames?

    As an absolute newbee I am intrigued by this solution, so I have prepared many of my frames with two skewers. My thought is that it should provide as much support as I need, and the 3 sections of comb should lend themselves to cutout comb honey. Time will tell.




    http://www.beesource.com/forums/show...-frames-for-me

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