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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    moravia,ny
    Posts
    1,199

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    some things change as you grow such as the honey price recieved. no 6 dollar per lb. once it goes into the barrel your more at the mercy of the packer. expect $2.25+ per lb. big difference to bottom line. good luck

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Stafford, Virginia
    Posts
    290

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Western, see below:


    Feed: $4,500 (mine 2600 in 2013)
    Yard registration: $50 (none)
    Forklift rental: $600 (784 x 2 in 2013)
    Transport to almonds: $13,420? (45.00 per colony in 2013)
    Extractor rental: $700 (Own my own 20 frame extractor)
    Broker fees @ $20 per hive: $3,500 (none)
    Requeening: $3,500 (2000.00 in 2013)
    Honey packaging: $3,000 (bottling our own and selling it at 6-10.00 a pound, 5345.00 in 2013)
    Gas: $3,000 (Gas and travel 9100.00 in 2013)
    Truck insurance + maintenance: $1,200 (Insurance: 1200.00/Main 5600.00
    Loss: $2,850 (28 colonies in 2013)
    Treatments: $875 (1500+ in 2013)

  3. #23
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    San Mateo, CA
    Posts
    4,844

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Is that a 30 year old truck you are buying for $4000?

  4. #24
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Cheyenne, Wyoming, USA
    Posts
    1,693

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Quote Originally Posted by odfrank View Post
    Is that a 30 year old truck you are buying for $4000?
    prolly!

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Greensboro, North Carolina
    Posts
    2,719

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Quote Originally Posted by matt1954 View Post
    I run a 150 colony operation. I migrate from Virginia to Florida (Second Year) and am now looking at purchasing some land in Florida verses renting.
    Nice work Matt.

    What you have right now was something of a goal for me in the next few years. Personally, I didn't really know what to do when I'm between 50 and 100 hives. 50 became too many to treat as a hobby, but not enough to really get into pollination contracts with. Hives don't put on enough honey around here to be really profitable (35 lbs per hive state average, with some years in the 15-20 lb hive range), at least as the only business. And queen production (while a blast) requires such specialized equipment, you really need to be ready to get big into it. It's refreshing to see someone not too far from me making a go at it. Congrats.

    In doing the math in my head, it didn't really seem profitable for someone in the central eastern seaboard to run 50-100 hives to oranges in FL, Almonds in CA, Blueberries in ME, or Apples in MA (just to name a few). I thought we were more stuck with what we can do locally. Good to see you breaking out of that.

    Quote Originally Posted by matt1954 View Post
    This is our first year going to the Almonds so we will see how things turn out.
    So this upcoming year, as in February, will be the first Almond trip for you? Or was 2013 your first trip to Almonds, with this upcoming year being your second?

    Just checking, cause your expenses appear to indicate that you went in 2013.

    Quote Originally Posted by matt1954 View Post
    Transport to almonds: $13,420? (45.00 per colony in 2013)
    Is this an average? Or did you contract with someone to transport literally on a per colony basis?

    Quote Originally Posted by matt1954 View Post
    Broker fees @ $20 per hive: $3,500 (none)
    If you don't mind me asking, how did a Va guy with 150 hives get an Almond contract without a broker? What rate did you get?

    Quote Originally Posted by matt1954 View Post
    Gas: $3,000 (Gas and travel 9100.00 in 2013)
    Which I assume counts your (and the bee's) travel to and from FL, as well as your travel to and from CA, but not the cost of the bee transport to CA, right?

    Thanks for the insight. Extremely helpful.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    26,743

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    My bees haven't made me enough money to afford land in SC, let alone FL. Guess I don't work hard enough.
    Mark Berninghausen "That which works, persists."

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Menomonee Falls, Wis.
    Posts
    2,664

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Did I miss the expense line for 90 percent CCD losses, that no one knows how to cure?

    And the 4000 dollar truck needs more repair costs projected, unless you are also a mechanic.

    Good Luck,

    Crazy Roland

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    26,743

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    How do you expense colony loss Roland? Only way I know of is Queens Purchased Expense or Package Bees Expense.
    Mark Berninghausen "That which works, persists."

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Lakeland, FL, USA
    Posts
    60

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Bought my truck for 4500. Paid for it twice in repairs

  10. #30
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    San Mateo, CA
    Posts
    4,844

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    >And the 4000 dollar truck needs more repair costs projected, unless you are also a mechanic.

    Making payments on a new truck might cost less than repairs on a $4000 truck. I bought a used 722 Bobcat in 1982 that was like that, Ford Pinto engine.

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Solano, California, USA
    Posts
    1,315

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Quote Originally Posted by westernbeekeeper View Post
    Yearly expenses for 175 hives

    Yes, I probably forgot some things, but that's why I'm posting. Please comment.

    Feed: $4,500 Maybe? depends on the year.
    Yard registration: $50 Pretty fixed
    Forklift rental: $600 How many times you renting?
    Transport to almonds: $13,420? Bit steep! you could get a load to Florida and back for this amount and have some left over.
    Extractor rental: $700 Buy a cheap one yourself. Have your brother crank it by hand till you can buy a better one.
    Broker fees @ $20 per hive: $3,500 Close
    Requeening: $3,500 LOW!!!!
    Honey packaging: $3,000 what is this for?
    Gas: $3,000 DEPENDS ON WHERE YOUR YARDS ARE AT?
    Truck insurance + maintenance: $1,200 ABOUT RIGHT for insurance not sure about tires oils and brakes etc....
    Loss: $2,850 WHATS THIS?
    Treatments: $875 Depends on what you use and how often.

    How about vehicle depreciation, Suits, hive tools,liability insurance, trips to bee conventions for "edumacation" ??

    See answers filled out inside your "quote"

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Issaquah,WA,USA
    Posts
    2,344

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Quote Originally Posted by odfrank View Post
    >And the 4000 dollar truck needs more repair costs projected, unless you are also a mechanic.

    Making payments on a new truck might cost less than repairs on a $4000 truck. I bought a used 722 Bobcat in 1982 that was like that, Ford Pinto engine.
    And know you cant take the truck into the state of CA. Also why are you budgeting for queen excluders. There are plenty of ways to do it without them. I don't use them and run 300 hives just fine.

  13. #33
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    26,743

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Quote Originally Posted by Sadler91 View Post
    Bought my truck for 4500. Paid for it twice in repairs
    Bought my F-450 brand new. Haven't put another $50,000.00 in it yet. But I have bought other peoples problems in the past and found Sadler's statement to be my experience. I can laugh about it now.
    Mark Berninghausen "That which works, persists."

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Greensboro, North Carolina
    Posts
    2,719

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Quote Originally Posted by Honey-4-All View Post
    How about vehicle depreciation . . .
    Are we talking about cash accounting, or accrual accounting?

    Most of his expenses appeared to be based on a cash system. If that's the case, he should count the truck purchase/maintenance in the year he used it, and not depreciate it over a number of years.

    That doesn't mean he can't do that on his tax return though. Tax accounting and day-to-day accounting are miles apart, and should be remembered as such.

  15. #35
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Cheyenne, Wyoming, USA
    Posts
    1,693

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Feed: $4,500 Maybe? depends on the year. Yah
    Yard registration: $50 Pretty fixed yep
    Forklift rental: $600 How many times you renting? 3 times a year?
    Transport to almonds: $13,420? Bit steep! you could get a load to Florida and back for this amount and have some left over. I just found out that is will be half this
    Extractor rental: $700 Buy a cheap one yourself. Have your brother crank it by hand till you can buy a better one. I have a 20-frame maxant power extractor
    Broker fees @ $20 per hive: $3,500 Close good
    Requeening: $3,500 LOW!!!! will adjust
    Honey packaging: $3,000 what is this for? BOTTLES AND BUCKETS
    Gas: $3,000 DEPENDS ON WHERE YOUR YARDS ARE AT? Within a half hour of home
    Truck insurance + maintenance: $1,200 ABOUT RIGHT for insurance not sure about tires oils and brakes etc.... you're right
    Loss: $2,850 WHATS THIS? colony loss
    Treatments: $875 Depends on what you use and how often. right

    How about vehicle depreciation, Suits, hive tools,liability insurance, trips to bee conventions for "edumacation" ?? will do some figuring


    See bold answers above

  16. #36
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Menomonee Falls, Wis.
    Posts
    2,664

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    SQKCRK asked me:

    How do you expense colony loss Roland? Only way I know of is Queens Purchased Expense or Package Bees Expense.

    Replacement bee expense
    Replacement queen expense

    Crazy Roland

  17. #37
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    26,743

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Yeah, that makes sense.
    Mark Berninghausen "That which works, persists."

  18. #38
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Hamilton, Alabama
    Posts
    1,209

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Guess I don't work hard enough.
    And here I was thinking you need to get your bees to work harder. After all, if one colony makes twice the honey, your overall efficiency of production increases.
    DarJones - 44 years, 10 colonies (max 40), sideliner, treatment free since 2005, 11 frame broodnest, small cell

  19. #39
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    D/FW, TX
    Posts
    32

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Do you already have all your woodenware for these hives? We have bought a lot of our stuff from beekeepers who went out of business and saved a lot of money.

    It takes a lot of sanding and painting, but it saves a lot of money.

  20. #40
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Cheyenne, Wyoming, USA
    Posts
    1,693

    Default Re: Yearly expenses estimate NEW - 175 hives - please input!

    Quote Originally Posted by Crabo View Post
    Do you already have all your woodenware for these hives?
    Nearly all of it. Been accumulating over the years.

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