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  1. #41
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Canterbry, UK
    Posts
    1,656

    Default Re: Competition for breeding bees suitable for commrcial operation

    Quote Originally Posted by Juhani Lunden View Post
    This would be a test between the tf bees, so all participants would be faced the same stress factors.
    Complex, but if you could have different classes corresponding to the severity of efforcts of different kinds abuse handed out by large commercial outfits, not only could you have your competition, you'd find out how 'deep' into the industrial model bees could be taken. You'd also highlight the depth and nature of the correlation between industrial beekeeping and the need to treat. As well as show that backing off some (and how) allowed non-treatment commercial beekeeping.

    All that would give a lot of info that could be used to develop a division between harmful/non-harmful beekeeping that would allow non-harmful beekeepers to ask for a premium on their product, and also supply impetus to breeders to get in on the game.

    Note: mass breeding is very much part of the bee health problem too.

    Mike (UK)
    Last edited by mike bispham; 12-22-2013 at 09:56 AM.
    Anti-husbandry: Medication + Reproduction = Continuing Sickness
    http://www.suttonjoinery.co.uk/CCD/

  2. #42

    Default Re: Competition for breeding bees suitable for commrcial operation

    Competition is on. We would like to call all bee breeders of the world to participate in this "Competition to breed Varroa resistant bees for commercial purposes".

    Time for breeding work is 10 years. After 10 years, in January 2024, we come back to this thread and ask for participants to enter to the testing phase.

    At the moment we have not set up the rules, but it seems that because of import/export restrictions, different needs and environmental factors, there will be several classes in this race. The meaning of this competition is to make beekeepers more aware of tf beekeeping, make honey consumers aware, that beekeepers are concerned about the welfare of bees and above all, to breed better bees.

    The breeds which enter the test phase are somehow in scientific manner tested and a jury will make the decision of the winner. Breeding work is always local, therefore it might even be, that there are as many classes as there are participants. Donīt take this too seriously, after all it is just life. The winner will get some publicity, but not much more.

  3. #43
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Amador County, California, USA
    Posts
    138

    Default Re: Competition for breeding bees suitable for commrcial operation

    I've been trying this for 4 years and have only had 1 hive survive more than 2 years (it's still alive and well). Most of my hives, whether bought, swarms, or splits, live through the first year and die their second winter. This year I had several very strong hives going into winter die suddenly for no apparent reason (they had enough stores and lots of bees).

    But who knows maybe I'm not doing it right.

  4. #44
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Canterbry, UK
    Posts
    1,656

    Default Re: Competition for breeding bees suitable for commrcial operation

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeTheBeekeeper View Post
    I've been trying this for 4 years and have only had 1 hive survive more than 2 years (it's still alive and well). Most of my hives, whether bought, swarms, or splits, live through the first year and die their second winter. This year I had several very strong hives going into winter die suddenly for no apparent reason (they had enough stores and lots of bees).

    But who knows maybe I'm not doing it right.
    Maybe you are doing it right.

    I'd get hold of more bees as a matter of urgency and unless you have good reason to think they're more resistant, requeen using grafts (of one sort or another) from your surviving hive.[1] Make new splits (they need only be tiny) as soon as you can and try mating them in relatively wild places. Try to keep all mating clear of treating apiaries as much as possible. They're your worst - your only - enemy.

    You need to build numbers to overcome the natural losses experienced with genetically inadeequate bees, and work up resistance through as much genetic control as you can manage. Feed routinely outside of flows to promote growth - you need the bees and the comb.

    Keep at it Mike and good luck.

    Mike (UK)

    [1] Its just occurred to me - this is malappropriated plantsman's terminology. When I graft apples a 'scion' carrying the genetic material (variety) I want to grow on is united with a rootsock.

    Taking that to bees: the new queen material is the scion: the bees that will accompany her (till she raises her own) are the equivalent of the rootstock. The process is grafting.

    I suppose 'the graft' can refer to the scionwood as well as the union and the process...

    In queen raising the 'grafted' larvae are actually scions. I think using the term 'graft' to describe that part of the process is rather out of place. Hmmm
    Anti-husbandry: Medication + Reproduction = Continuing Sickness
    http://www.suttonjoinery.co.uk/CCD/

  5. #45
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Amador County, California, USA
    Posts
    138

    Default Re: Competition for breeding bees suitable for commrcial operation

    I have only raised queens once (only 3 I think) but am making plans to raise more (a lot more) this spring right after almonds (February-March).

    I had that in mind what you say about keeping clear of treated apiaries. While I don't treat mine, I get my bees and queens from people that do (except if I make splits from my own hives, but even then I add a laying queen from treated bees). Not to mention a commercial beekeeper places at least 100 to at most 1200 hives less than half a mile away from my own hives all throughout the season.

    I have only one that I would consider of relatively good "survivor" stock (3 year old hive & queen, never treated, 10 frames of bees now). I plan on using that hive for my queens. I'm thinking of setting up a mating yard (far away from here) with 3-4 other strong hives I have (only 1 year olds however).

    We'll see how it goes.

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