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  1. #41
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    Quote Originally Posted by sqkcrk View Post
    Something w/ a higher price tag is perceived as a better product only because one thinks it's so. Is it unethical to take advantage of human nature? Is it economically unethical not to?
    If you are selling honey, the answers come very easily.

    If you are buying gasoline, perhaps after a major storm, and the price at the pump is now $8 a gallon, somehow the ethics seem to be very different.
    Graham
    USDA Zone 7A Elevation 1400 ft

  2. #42
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    Quote Originally Posted by Rader Sidetrack View Post
    somehow the ethics seem to be very different.
    Not if it's all-natural, organic gasoline and the buyer can just go to Walmart and get the regular stuff for $3.
    Is it solipsistic in here, or is it just me?

  3. #43
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    > Not if it's all-natural, organic gasoline and the buyer can just go to Walmart and get the regular stuff for $3.

    So do the ethics of the discussion change when Walmart runs out of their $3 gas, and the only gas available is
    all-natural, organic gasoline at $8 a gallon?





    Are all-natural, organic honey sellers ethically obligated to reduce their price when Walmart runs out of the cheap honey?

    Graham
    USDA Zone 7A Elevation 1400 ft

  4. #44
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    If Walmart runs out, the price is going way up.
    Is it solipsistic in here, or is it just me?

  5. #45
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own






    .... .... Mark ? .... ...
    Graham
    USDA Zone 7A Elevation 1400 ft

  6. #46
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    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    What, Rader?
    Mark Berninghausen "Ships at a distance have every man's wish on board." Zora Neale Hurston

  7. #47
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    Do I need to point out that my single source craft refinery all-natural gasoline is also vegan?
    Is it solipsistic in here, or is it just me?

  8. #48
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    Although supply and demand is a very real thing it is not as simple as most people understand it.

    What do you consider a higher price? Lets look at a competing product. Since Honey is a sweetener. it is a direct competitor with sugar. sugar selling at 40 something since a lb. honey at wholesale is $2.00. Btu I do not sell honey to wholesalers. I sell it direct fro $6.00 a lb minimum. A 1200% increase in price and no problem getting it sold. In the past couple of days I have started selling it at $15.00 a lb or a 3000% increase. That is also a 450% increase over the wholesale price of honey itself.

    So how is supply and demand really taking effect n all this.

    I can sell all the honey I can produce as soon as I produce it at wholesale. Demand is huge but then so is the supply. it is where everyone unloads their honey. it is is simple and quick making supply easy to do.

    Btu $6.00 a lb honey requires a lot more time effort and expense. Due to this alone the price must go up. I add a $0.75 bottle to every lb of my honey alone. I then have to take the time to fill those bottle transport them to the customer make them available to the customer promote my product so the customer is even aware of it. and often have some sales conversation even if ti is a short one. Yes the price goes up but every cent of it was earned. I did what it took to put that honey in my customers hand the way they chose to buy it.

    Again the $15.00 a lb honey is taking the same service to the next level. I have to work harder. Accept more expenses and reach further to inform my customer. In fact it cost me $205 to package up 48 lbs of honey. That is just cost of packaging. I also worked to land the market where people do not bat an eye at $15.00. So nobody is just handing it to me. I am working for it and I have every expectation of being paid for my work.

    So supply and demand has a lot more to do with the cost of supplying than people are desperate to get it. I provide a quality product that is worth every cent I charge for it. for those that do not want it. they have Walmart and the fake crap. Again worth every cent they pay for it. Well maybe.
    Stand for what you believe, even if you stand alone.

  9. #49
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    Only if it makes it sell better.

    One tenent of marketing is knowing your customer. Who are we selling our honey to? How do we connect w/ them in the best way. If I am selling honey to folks from The Hamptons I would put a lot of thought and hard work into presentation, how my honey looks and is displayed. The kind of jar and the label. Pairing honey w/ other food items and other ways of using honey. Facial scrubs come to mind.

    Know your customer and let them get to know you. You are not simply selling honey, you are selling yourself, your connection w/ Nature through your bees, etc.

    Sell your honey.
    Mark Berninghausen "Ships at a distance have every man's wish on board." Zora Neale Hurston

  10. #50
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    Daniel, I disagree. Honey is a sweetener, but it is more like Maple Syrup than it is like Sugar. Or it should be. We beekeepers should market it more like Maple Syrup than like Sugar. Promote the qualities of your honey. The distinct flavor. How it should best be used to enjoy the distinct qualities of your honey.
    Mark Berninghausen "Ships at a distance have every man's wish on board." Zora Neale Hurston

  11. #51
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    Ft. Collins, Colorado
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    All I can say is enjoy you $15 lb. honey profits while you can. There is a beekeeper near you, coming soon to your area that will or already has purchased honey at $2.20 a lb. in either 5 gal. buckets or 55 gal. drums. Packs it locally and calls it local honey with a very nice label. If your at $15 lb. he'll go $14. If you're at $12 he'll go $10. If you sell comb honey, he'll cut the price in half. Just be ready to up your game to compete! It's happening now! They also call it marketing.

  12. #52
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    Daniel, honey is sweet.

    But it may be direct competition to sugar, but sugar is certainly no competition for honey.
    Ever hear of someone looking forward to a peanut butter and sugar sandwich?
    And sugar topping ice cream is a completely different experience to topping it with honey.

    I don't know anyone who eats sugar to improve their health, though I get a premium for the honey I sell to health foodies.
    I've never heard of burn or wound dressings pre-impregnated with sugar, either though honey has been used as an antiseptic, antifungal healing ointment for centuries.

    I could go on, but I think the point is made.

    The demand for honey is not the demand for sugar, nor is the demand for sugar the demand for honey.
    There is a limited overlap in their usefulness.

    The demand for sugar, and its supply has little effect on the demand for honey while present transportation infrastructure permits cheap importation and shipping.

    Getting a premium price for honey has a lot more to do with marketing than with supply and demand.

  13. #53
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    > Ever hear of someone looking forward to a peanut butter and sugar sandwich?

    When I was a kid, I looked forward to my mother's freshly baked bread coming out of the oven. A slice of that, add some (dairy) butter, and sprinkle sugar on top!
    Mmmm good ...

    Other than that, I agree with Beregondo's comments.

    Graham
    USDA Zone 7A Elevation 1400 ft

  14. #54
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    Suffolk, NY, USA
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    sqkck==
    Only if it makes it sell better.

    One tenent of marketing is knowing your customer. Who are we selling our honey to? How do we connect w/ them in the best way. If I am selling honey to folks from The Hamptons I would put a lot of thought and hard work into presentation, how my honey looks and is displayed. The kind of jar and the label. Pairing honey w/ other food items and other ways of using honey. Facial scrubs come to mind.

    Know your customer and let them get to know you. You are not simply selling honey, you are selling yourself, your connection w/ Nature through your bees, etc.
    A necessary piece of knowledge for making sales is to know your customer, good point.
    Other marketing principles include representation and positioning the product.

    'let them get to know you' ?
    If someone is selling honey that was purchased from another producer, possibly from another area, and re bottled this honey into their own jars and slapped their label on it, leading the purchaser to believe it is what the label says it is, at what point does one 'let them get to know you' and one tells them the truth? The truth being that although the label portrays the honey in the jars as from xyz apiary in Anytown XX, it is actually honey that was purchased in Sometown XY from abc apiary and re-packaged. And that the seller in order to be able to make honey sales, doesn't think this is important enough to disclose.

    It's being suggested that 'let them know' only what you want to in order to sell the product.
    Marketing does not have to be misleading or untruthful.

    What part of yourself are you selling?

    For example - A 3 hive beekeeper that sells 5000+ lbs of honey retail has more connections with honey producers than with nature.

    Brandy has hit the nail on the head above:
    There is a beekeeper near you, coming soon to your area that will or already has purchased honey at $2.20 a lb. in either 5 gal. buckets or 55 gal. drums. Packs it locally and calls it local honey with a very nice label. If your at $15 lb. he'll go $14. If you're at $12 he'll go $10. If you sell comb honey, he'll cut the price in half. Just be ready to up your game to compete! It's happening now! They also call it marketing.
    Here anyway, these are large, well capitalized companys. Formidable competition.



    Full disclosure and truth in labeling is the only way to eliminate misleading and at times untruthful claims. Down the road every smaller honey producer and retail seller will have to consider this labeling issue as a means of staying competitive and in business.
    Last edited by clyderoad; 11-26-2013 at 08:41 AM.

  15. #55
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    Colorado Springs, CO United States
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    Quote Originally Posted by rmdial View Post
    .If I am going to compete with these beeks, should I mention this to buyers?

    Your thoughts please.
    Yes you should! I look at it like this, I am selling everything I don't do to my bees/hives on their way to produce our honey, and the time this takes. Our honey is very distinct, and would never consider adding anything to it, nor would I consider buying someone elses honey and putting our label on it, not even for the mighty dollar!

  16. #56
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    All this has assumed that the resold honey was from far away and of inferior quality. What if one were to be approached by neighboring beekeepers, with known practices, who didn't want to be bothered with bottling and selling their honey?
    Is it solipsistic in here, or is it just me?

  17. #57
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    Colorado Springs, CO United States
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    Quote Originally Posted by cg3 View Post
    All this has assumed that the resold honey was from far away and of inferior quality. What if one were to be approached by neighboring beekeepers, with known practices, who didn't want to be bothered with bottling and selling their honey?
    Cg3, And the odds of that, I would guess would be rather slim. Also if it is not from my own hives, it is of inferior quality!
    Last edited by fieldsofnaturalhoney; 11-26-2013 at 03:12 PM.

  18. #58
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    That's exactly where I find myself.
    Is it solipsistic in here, or is it just me?

  19. #59
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    Nov 2004
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    Owen, WI, USA
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    Quote Originally Posted by cg3 View Post
    All this has assumed that the resold honey was from far away and of inferior quality. What if one were to be approached by neighboring beekeepers, with known practices, who didn't want to be bothered with bottling and selling their honey?
    We are asked several times a year if we would be interested in purchasing honey from hobbyist beeks and decline because we can not know their practices.
    On the other hand, we are approached by an increasing number of beekeepers every year with local markets they are struggling to supply. Basically they are consistently better at marketing their honey than producing it. I would not consider them unethical unless they expressly tried to pass this honey off as their own if asked, or labeled it as "local" if it is not.

    While there are of course customers strictly concerned that the honey they buy is local, many don't care one way or another. We occasionally sell some varietal honeys and they are popular with customers not only for their different flavors, but also for the novelty that they were NOT produced here in Wisconsin.

    In the case of producer only farm markets, selling someone else's honey is beyond the pale. I think it commonly happens with all sorts of produce, not just with honey. If it is expressly against contracted agreement terms, this should be brought to the attention of the market administration. If they don't care, you can consider informing your potential customers. Either way, you need to decide if pointing out the uneven playing field is worth the headaches that doing so might entail.

    Sheri

  20. #60
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    Default Re: Ethics of selling honey as your own

    Quote Originally Posted by Rader Sidetrack View Post
    > Ever hear of someone looking forward to a peanut butter and sugar sandwich?

    When I was a kid, I looked forward to my mother's freshly baked bread coming out of the oven. A slice of that, add some (dairy) butter, and sprinkle sugar on top!
    Mmmm good ...

    Other than that, I agree with Beregondo's comments.

    I used to eat Wonder Bread butter and sugar sandwiches when Mom wasn't around.
    Mark Berninghausen "Ships at a distance have every man's wish on board." Zora Neale Hurston

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