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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
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    DuPage County, Illinois USA
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    9,603

    Default D Coates Nuc Cutting Guide Spreadsheet

    A Beesource member (beesintrees) put together a spreadsheet to help calculate cutting layouts based on various size changes. I plan to make it part of the Coates nuc plans, but we would like to present it here for final critique/editing. I'm not well versed on spreadsheets, so those of you who are, please look it over and offer feedback. Thanks.

    Download file
    Regards, Barry

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
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    Indianapolis, IN, USA
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    116

    Default Re: D Coates Nuc Cutting Guide Spreadsheet

    Nicely done!

    I was curious as to why cell foundation dimension was included (entered in the spreadsheet in cell C18 as 4.9mm), until I found it used in the total number of cells calculation to be used to determine honey capacity. That's pretty thorough.

    One change I would suggest is locking all the cells that aren't intended to be for user input. It's too easy to overwrite a calculation. (yeah, I did it)

    I also found the dimension tables rather difficult to read (the three yellow sections for different sized plywood). For my copy, I modified these to box in the end, side, bottom and top part dimensions separately.

    Oh, and it works for 3/4 dimension lumber, too, with proper allowances for box joints, rabbets or standard joints added in.


    Thanks to Dale for the hard work.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
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    Springhill, Louisiana, USA
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    94

    Default Re: D Coates Nuc Cutting Guide Spreadsheet

    Quote Originally Posted by Spinner View Post
    Nicely done!

    I was curious as to why cell foundation dimension was included (entered in the spreadsheet in cell C18 as 4.9mm), until I found it used in the total number of cells calculation to be used to determine honey capacity. That's pretty thorough.

    One change I would suggest is locking all the cells that aren't intended to be for user input. It's too easy to overwrite a calculation. (yeah, I did it)

    I also found the dimension tables rather difficult to read (the three yellow sections for different sized plywood). For my copy, I modified these to box in the end, side, bottom and top part dimensions separately.

    Oh, and it works for 3/4 dimension lumber, too, with proper allowances for box joints, rabbets or standard joints added in.


    Thanks to Dale for the hard work.
    Hi Spinner,

    Thanks for the compliment and for taking the time to give the spreadsheet a go.

    The 4.9mm cell size can be changed by the user. I didn't run different cell sizes to calculate honey weight. I suspect it won't make much difference on honey weight, just on the total number of cells on the frames. I thought some beeks might use that feature to estimate brood etc.

    Your suggestion for locking cells is a really good one. I have inadvertently overwritten formulas too. It might be a good idea for those wanting to play with the spreadsheet to load two copies with a slightly different name so if that happens and the error can't UNDOed (lol) and revert the sheet to the original condition he could just open the extra saved original version. But then, everyone isn't as anal retentive as me. I have to admit I haven't learned how to lock just a few cells. I once, several months ago, read on a forum how to lock only certain chosen cells. If I understood it right, the writer had to juggle lock and unlock at appropriate times. I'm not much on mental gymnastics (or physical ones either.) Please advise, or any user has my permission to make that change before its finally released. Teamwork is a good thing.

    Yes, yellow is sometimes hard to read. It showed up OK on my screen, but I'm open to suggestions as to a different color for the final version. (If you don't mind send me your version. It might be arranged in a much more logical way that everyone would like better than mine.) If a user is even a little familiar with writing a spreadsheet that's a simple enough change the user could make manually. I haven't a clue whether locking the calculating cells changes the other formatting such as color, sheet cell size and font size?

    And finally, - 3/4" lumber. Hummnnnnn, I didn't think to make any allowance for rabbett joints, box joints etc. What an oversight - - If it works for all that as it is written its a completely unexpected blessing from Above. If it turns out modifications are needed to correct domensions for user defined joints that could be modified by putting a calculation in some of the cells containing no calculations. The user would then have to be sure to make that input while entering other variables. I modified the "form" of the sheet so it was as compact "on the screen" as possible. But that form doesn't have to be maintained.

    I have no intentions to offer it for sale, so every user is free to modify it to his own satisfaction. If other forums or someone else wants to include it on their web site I only ask they give credit to Beesource or include a link to the Beesource forum page where the sheet resides.

    Thanks again for your time, help and suggestions,
    bnt
    Last edited by beesintrees; 11-19-2013 at 07:50 PM. Reason: clafification
    Let's turn it around
    America Bless God

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Springhill, Louisiana, USA
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    94

    Default Re: D Coates Nuc Cutting Guide Spreadsheet

    Hi Spinner,

    After another read of your comment on the dimensions tables I understood that you weren't referring to the color scheme making the figures hard to read.
    Anyway, I do see what you mean about that and I agree. As I mentioned, if you don't mind send me a copy of the version with your changes. I tried to change the borders on my version, but was unuccessful. I already made every character bold font. So, teamwork is in order.

    After every forum member who desires to do so makes suggestions and / or modifications on the version they have each person can send me their mods and when all is done I'll send the final version to Barry and he can upload that version on the forum page so everyone can load it.

    I might have to get some of the forum's OpenOffice gurus to school me where needed.

    Thanks again,
    bnt
    Let's turn it around
    America Bless God

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Louisville, KY
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    1,599

    Default Re: D Coates Nuc Cutting Guide Spreadsheet

    Overall very good and handy

    1) I think locking the cells could be a problem, for those who may want to change particular variables. I would just use a color code, clear vs grey or something like what you have to designate calculated vs constant vs entry.
    2) What about the the small pieces to close of the end bar area and cleats on the lid.
    3) A helper file (explanation file) or drawing showing the actual dimensions of certain charestics Or add a comment to cell with info may help
    4) Total square footage required without of without blade curf.
    5) Cut layout.
    6) Will it fit on a 4x8. I am pretty sure I was able to do 4qty 6frame boxes on a 4x8. I think I needed additional material for a few cleats

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
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    Springhill, Louisiana, USA
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    94

    Default Re: D Coates Nuc Cutting Guide Spreadsheet

    Quote Originally Posted by burns375 View Post
    Overall very good and handy

    1) I think locking the cells could be a problem, for those who may want to change particular variables. I would just use a color code, clear vs grey or something like what you have to designate calculated vs constant vs entry.
    2) What about the the small pieces to close of the end bar area and cleats on the lid.
    3) A helper file (explanation file) or drawing showing the actual dimensions of certain charestics Or add a comment to cell with info may help
    4) Total square footage required without of without blade curf.
    5) Cut layout.
    6) Will it fit on a 4x8. I am pretty sure I was able to do 4qty 6frame boxes on a 4x8. I think I needed additional material for a few cleats


    Hi burns375,

    Thank you for your ideas.

    1. I think there's a way to lock ONLY the cells containing formulas and their displayed calculations. The cells containing variables can't be locked and still have a useful spreadsheet, so you are correct. I'll have to research how to lock only selected cells. Instead of locking cells I used color codes as is noted in the upper left corner. I wrote the sheet myself and while using it I still made entries into cells which are meant to do the calculations. A different solution is to copy the spreadsheet twice, each time using a different name. If one sheet gets too many input errors to correct using UNDO the user can just revert back to the safety sheet.

    2. I know what you mean about those lugs. After I built my boxes I added lugs at the tops and the bottoms of the ends where the frames hang using, scrap material. I arbitrarily made them about 1-1/2" high and I just made the pieces the same length as the assembled box across the ends. However, some people do like a designation for every single piece of material. It would be easy enough to include those calculations. My lids are just a flat piece of plywood with a flat rock on top. The bees propolize the lids so a hurricane wouldn't blow them off. Well, a hurricane “might” blow the covers off.

    3. I can write a helper file. I will probably need help to edit the help file so it won't be so long winded?

    4. Square feet - That's relatively easy to do with just simple math. However it won't tell the whole story without a layout sheet.

    5. Layout sheet - I have no drawing program except Paint. Could the beekeeper use the same drawings on the Internet which are already available for the Drew Coates Easy 5 Frame Nuc Box? I also remember seeing drawings for 8 frame NUCs, too.

    6. Plywood sheet size. The spreadsheet calculations are based entirely on the dimensions given with the Drew Coates Easy 5 Frame Nuc plans found in several places on the Internet and even on youtube. I can include as many links as I can find to the 5 Frame Nuc plans and the 8 Frame plans as wel as the link to the youtube site showing how to assemble the boxes.

    Oh - one more important piece of information which should be included somewhere is the fact that all the dimensions are calculated based on the frame size the beek wants to use. So, the first variables which should be entered inside the spreadsheet cells are those for frame dimensions. Frame dimensions are found in the table with the dark gray background.
    The frame thickness (honey comb thickness) dimension is input where all the other variables are found in red numerals.
    All calculated numbers are blue and conversion factors are black.
    At this writing the only cells having comments are the conversion factor cells.

    Maybe the most important fact is that I'm a first year beek. Therefore I have very little experience making projects to be used by honey bees. After I built my boxes I found that I could almost insert 9 frames into my 8 frame boxes. I sanded the sides of the frames and now I can insert 9 frames into each box. Maybe that was wrong. Anyway, rather than cutting a dozen boxes using this spreadsheet, instead, make only one box and then insert your frames to see if everything fits as you desire.
    bnt
    Let's turn it around
    America Bless God

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Rader, Greene County, Tennessee, USA
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    6,580

    Default Re: D Coates Nuc Cutting Guide Spreadsheet

    The Beesource Build-it-Yourself section has plans for D. Coates 5 frame nucs:

    http://www.beesource.com/build-it-yo...oates-version/

    This plan gives details for making (4) 5-frame nucs from one piece of 1/2″ plywood 4′ x 8′.
    A cutting layout diagram is included. Design by D. Coates.

    Graham
    USDA Zone 7A Elevation 1400 ft

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Topeka, Kansas, USA
    Posts
    84

    Default Re: D Coates Nuc Cutting Guide Spreadsheet

    To make some cells editable and lock the others, you need to choose the cells you want to not be locked, right click on them and choose format cells, and on the protection tab uncheck the "locked" check box. You then "protect" the worksheet (in Excel 2010 this is on the review tab under the changes group.) All you have to do then when you do want to change variables is "unprotect" the sheet temporarily, make the changes, and then "protect" it again.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN, USA
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    116

    Default Re: D Coates Nuc Cutting Guide Spreadsheet

    Dale, I'll clean up my mess on the spreadsheet and send it to you. Now if I can just remember how to test option buttons.

    Glad to provide input for your hard work!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Springhill, Louisiana, USA
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    94

    Default Re: D Coates Nuc Cutting Guide Spreadsheet

    Hi Spinner,

    I got your PM, loaded your work and replied to your PM. I haven't replied to enough PM to know how to tell when they actually "go", hence this message.

    I meant to, but forgot to, include in my reply that I wrote a short "Help Page" of sorts. I got it simple enough, yet detailed enough to be useful, I think.

    Somehow we'll figure out how to swap version modifications. I included my email when I replied to your PM, so that should enable easy sharing.

    bnt
    Let's turn it around
    America Bless God

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Manning, SC
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    2,378

    Default Re: D Coates Nuc Cutting Guide Spreadsheet

    How would you have "them" do the first cut of the sheet fit in your car?

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Springhill, Louisiana, USA
    Posts
    94

    Default Re: D Coates Nuc Cutting Guide Spreadsheet

    Quote Originally Posted by snl View Post
    How would you have "them" do the first cut of the sheet fit in your car?

    Hi snl,
    Rader Sidetrack has a post just above on this same page. That post has a link which goes to a cut page layout.

    To Spinner:
    Your version looks real good. I could use it easily.

    oldfordguy,
    Would you be so kind as to perform the actions you mentioned and see how it works, please?
    I'm not too sharp on such things. Actually, I'm not too sharp on very much. lol
    If you could do that and share it with Spinner, me and everyone wanting to do the teamwork on this project that would be very helpful. Thanks.

    Also to everyone following this thread:
    Sorry I got distracted (life seem to happen at the most inopportune times) and althought it might look like I abandoned this project I'm happy to teamwork with members of the group so those wanting the worksheeet can have something to play with. Spring is in the air and soon everyone will get in high gear readying for more bees.

    Barry,
    While this project is in the works would it be possible for you to post a link to the most recent version (as you've done above with the original version?) That would help a lot. I have a version by Spinner which looks good to me. Spinner might have made some changes since we last exchanged versions?

    Someone asked for a tab on the sheet showing dimensions for handhold lugs. Hummnnn, That didn't occur to me because I just use leftover material when the cutting for a box is completed, and the make the lugs any convenient width and whichever length fits the place on the box.

    Pieces 1-1/2" to 2" wide will work and the length would be the length of the place on the box where the lug is wanted. I've found that I like lugs at the top AND at the bottom of a box. Those lugs along the bottom close up gaps where each box meets when stacked - wherever the plywood has a bow.

    It might also be good to just measure each time a lug is cut because of the differences in thicknesses of plywood sheets as relates to the stated thickness. Plywood does not actually measure the actual stated thickness. There's some *guvamunt* regulation which states that plywood manufactured MUST NOT measure more that its stated thickness. That is - 1/2" plywood must not be more than 1/2" thick anywhere on the sheet. So manufacturers allow themselves a certain safety factor to comply with that regulation.

    After adding a certain number of layers of plywood at various places the worksheet will become more innacurate for the lugs depending on how many layers are put onto the box. All that, plus my original intention was to make the worksheet to fit on the computer screen so that the entire worksheet could be viewed without any scrolling. And I need larger font than many people because my eyes are old and weaker by the month. The lug measurement feature can be calculated on the sheet if desired and I can continue using my original sheet to accomplish that original size goal, but its alright with me if the newer versions of the work sheet grow larger than I first intended. The main purpose now is to make the sheet have as many features as users desire.

    The only constraints on size are ones dictated by website bandwidth limits - and that is determined by higher plowers than me.

    bnt
    Last edited by beesintrees; 03-19-2014 at 10:51 PM.
    Let's turn it around
    America Bless God

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