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  1. #21
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Whitla Ab. Canada
    Posts
    489

    Default Re: What do you do when encountering african bees for a cutout?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rader Sidetrack View Post
    I have never had occasion to mix up a batch, but here is a link with more info:
    http://citybugs.tamu.edu/factsheets/...bees/ent-3002/
    Thanks for the link Graham but after reading their description of how it's used I don't think I could ever use it. It seems too much like murder.
    Colino
    But every sunday afternoon he is a dirt track demon
    In a '57 chevrolet- Jim Croce

  2. #22
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    San Mateo, CA
    Posts
    5,041

    Default Re: What do you do when encountering african bees for a cutout?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rader Sidetrack View Post
    Spraying bees with soapy water will kill them. The soapy water method is only as a last resort - if you have no alternative.
    And all of you law abiding beekeepers remember, soapy water is not an approved insecticide for bees, so you are technically breaking the law using it.

    OH - then I read the suggested link:

    Soapy water has been approved for use to control Africanized honey bees (AHB) by the Environmental Protection agency provided that: 1) the detergent used for AHB cannot be sold as a pesticide; and 2) the treatment mixture of detergent and water cannot be used on edible food and feed commodities.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Lakeland, FL USA
    Posts
    835

    Default Re: What do you do when encountering african bees for a cutout?

    .

    I suggest aromatherapy candles and chocolates.

    Don't kill them.
    www.savebeesflorida.com (Honeybee removals and top bar hives)

  4. #24
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Concord, CA
    Posts
    4,194

    Default Re: What do you do when encountering african bees for a cutout?

    I had a large hive acting as if it had gotten africanized a couple years ago. For me in a residential neighborhood soapy water is one of my first considerations, not my last choice.
    Africanized or not it doesn't mater if its overly aggressive & you want to keep it move it to the country.
    Dan

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Worcester County, Massachusetts
    Posts
    3,751

    Default Re: What do you do when encountering african bees for a cutout?

    We were called in by a beekeeper to help with a very, very aggressive hive in a very urban area...in a courtard in the middle of residential buildings with kids playing within a few feet...these bees were overcrowded in their hive, and the mere opening of the hive (with smoke) by the beekeeper almost got her dog stung to death on the other side of the yard (dog had to go to doggie hospital and it was touch and go...not just a stung up dog).

    In this case, as they were in a hive (not a wall), the thing I could do most easily and with least impact on the location wasn't to soap the bees down (certainly you would expect some bees to be flying...even if you got all but 1 or 2). The best thing to do was wait until dusk, smoke the porch sitters in, tape up the entrance and move the whole hive. This was the kind of situation where I wished I had one of those net/bags that can cover the whole hive in case of leaks.

    These were (I think) AMM and not AHB, but they were nasty little things.
    The perils of benefactors; The blessings of parasites; Blindness blindness and sight -Joni Mitchell 'Shadows and Light'

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Jefferson Co, TX
    Posts
    758

    Default Re: What do you do when encountering african bees for a cutout?

    I have seen Silvex that is used for wildland fire fighting (foam) used at 0.5% from a fire hose work with extreme effectiveness. But it had some volume moving as well.

    What about ammonium nitrate mixed in the smoker? - I read somewhere that it will knock them out for about 15 to 20 minutes. They mixed it in the smoker and I think it said it makes laughing gas.

    Anyone tried that. A small container in my beekeeper kit would be nice to keep. I hate containers of liquid soap as it always seems to leak sooner or later.
    Started 9/13, building slowly, now @ 7 Lang hives + 5 nucs, and treatment style not decided yet

  7. #27
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    San Mateo, CA
    Posts
    5,041

    Default Re: What do you do when encountering african bees for a cutout?

    > What about ammonium nitrate mixed in the smoker?

    Here are my instructions for re-queening vicious, runny bees with ammonium nitrate. You could also stun a hive and vacuum them up using this method:

    Ammonium nitrate - Get a few table spoons from a local wholesale nursery or farmer. Have a new caged queen, division screen and drone guard (entrance queen excluder) ready. Light the smoker, drop in a table spoon of ammonium nitrate, don't inhale the smoke as it will blast out of the smoker. Fumigate the hive with the blasting smoke. The bees will fall unconscious. Shake them onto a sheet in front of the hive. Place all the brood in the upper brood chamber. They will awake from their stupor and walk back into the hive, the queen being found on the entrance excluder. Divide the hive introducing the new queen above the division screen into the box containing the brood. These mean bees will kill the new queen if you try a direct introduction. The division screens sends the old mean bees back to the box down below, young bees above to accept the new queen. Either squish the old queen, or mark her and run her back into the bottom. You will then have to find her and squish her after the new queen up above is accepted, then merging the boxes.

    I did dozens of mean hives in the '70s using this method, works great. I now do most of my bee work in shirt sleeves.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Concord, CA
    Posts
    4,194

    Default Re: What do you do when encountering african bees for a cutout?

    How about ammonium nitrate mixed with diesel followed by a match.
    Just kidding, but nasty bees are no joke.
    Dan

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    St. Petersburg, fl, USA
    Posts
    187

    Default Re: What do you do when encountering african bees for a cutout?

    I can not emphasize enough GET A BEE VAC Buy it or build it but it will make your cut outs so much easier and safer. When bees are being vacuumed they generally don't even have a clue whats going on. Start the vacuum before you even open the wall. When you make your first cut have the vac nozzle right there as the guards come out -slurp and they are in the vac. all the alert pheromones are whisked away and things stay relatively calm. On our cut outs the wife usually does all the vacuuming because she has more patience and is willing to spend more time getting most of the bees before she cuts out the comb. With the vac I can usually remove my veil and gloves with in a few minutes will I do the manual work toting and fetching. The only time things get hot is when we bring the bees to the bee yard and let them out. I made our vac so the inner box is the same dimensions as a 10 frame hive. It has a screen top and a slide off bottom. We put the cut out frames into a deep and set an empty box on top of that with the entrance closed.Then I sit the bee vac box on top and slide the bottom off. One quick rap and the bees drop into the empty hive and Becky ( the wife) slides a top on. There are always a few bees that don't go in that are really pissy but with out the majority of the hive backing them up they just don't get far. We leave the hive alone for an hour or two then slide a feeder jar onto the top. We keep them closed up for two or three days during which time they repair and attach the cut out comb and clean up spilled honey. This prevents robbing events and helps get the bees to become attached to their new home. By the way we never use a smoker on a cut out we are always afraid a spark in a wall could smolder and start a fire, and the smoke can drive the queen further in and we miss her. With the vac you won't need a smoker anyway.

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