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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    medina, NY
    Posts
    131

    Default HOS CDL Question

    I was reading the HOS regs and was wondering if this would apply, after dropping off the hives down south, and just returning home with an empty pickup and only the skid steer on the trailer. I still need the CDL-A, but not in the furtherance of the business, just heading home to return to so i can go back to my m-f office job.

    I guess i'll talk to DOT, i was just wondering what you all thought.

    http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/documents/h...to-HOS_508.pdf


    Personal Use of a Commercial Motor Vehicle
    It is possible that occasionally you may not use a truck in commerce at all. You may be moving your
    personal belongings to a new house or, as a hobby, you may be taking your horses to a horse show.
    As long as the activity is not in support of a business, the Federal hours-of-service regulations do
    not apply to you.
    If you are not operating your truck in commerce, you are not subject to the hours-of-service
    regulations

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Montgomery County, NY
    Posts
    1,846

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    I betcha if you have a skidsteer on back and they hammer you about HOS you will NOT convince them you are moving to a new house or that its a hobby to run your skidsteer up and down the road. I would abide by HOS.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Issaquah,WA,USA
    Posts
    2,394

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    I have the same problem convincing them that 80 hives and a forklift on the back is an occasional hobby use. It is a hobby but, by most standards it is a commercial operation. All depends on your perspective and the DOL's is you are taking advantage of them.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Walker, Alabama, USA
    Posts
    915

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    Personal Use of a Commercial Motor Vehicle
    It is possible that occasionally you may not use a truck in commerce at all. You may be moving your
    personal belongings to a new house or, as a hobby, you may be taking your horses to a horse show.
    As long as the activity is not in support of a business, the Federal hours-of-service regulations do
    not apply to you.
    If you are not operating your truck in commerce, you are not subject to the hours-of-service
    regulations
    When I haul horses, one of the first things they ask me is if I file either 1120 or 1040 Sched C and when I say yes, they say I am in the horse business and the HOS do indeed apply. From this I would assume that they would apply to a hobby that is big enough to need a skid steer. It may not be your primary business, but it is still a business.

    JMO

    Rusty
    Rusty Hills Farm -- home of AQHA A Rusty Zipper & Rusty's Bees ( LC and T)

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    27,584

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    When ever I have encountered DOT I have never had to produce a Log Book or to verify my hours of service.

    Besides, there is the "beekeepers are exempt" provision.
    Mark Berninghausen #youmatter

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Montgomery County, NY
    Posts
    1,846

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    Mark if I am not mistaken the apiaries industry provision is only when you have live bees aboard the truck. I could be wrong, but that's my understanding on that matter.

    Personally I have never been bothered by DOT except when I had my initial safety inspection. Other than that I plan my trips around times when there are the least amount of DOT officers working.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    27,584

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    It isn't when you are doing apiary work? Getting home from the apiary is part of the job, isn't it? The last time I was stopped on RT 81 because there was a loose chain on the Bobcat when asked a set of questions I said to the Officer "Aren't beekeepers exempt?", and pointed to the sign on the side of my truck. He went back to his vehicle and a half hour later he let me tighten the chazin and sent me on my way.

    I always keep my fuel receipts and motel receipts. So I can show that I slept somewhere over night and departed there at the time of checkout. Someone who sleeps in their truck, like yourself, can't do that.
    Mark Berninghausen #youmatter

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Montgomery County, NY
    Posts
    1,846

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    Interesting. Yes its true, I do not incur motel expenses. I do generally stop at truck stops and always buy something small when I get there and generally fuel up just before I get back on the road so I do have a papertrail proof if need be, but like I said I have never been bothered by DOT on the highway.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    27,584

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    But no proof that you slept or were not off road for the appropriate amount of time. Not bothered by DOT? It's a matter of time. A matter of luck.
    Mark Berninghausen #youmatter

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Montgomery County, NY
    Posts
    1,846

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    Sure I have proof. Thats why I buy something small like a soda when I first get there and fuel up just before I leave so they can see I get there at 10pm and leave just after 8am.

    I do strategically plan my travels based typical DOT operations schedule. So generally speaking I have NY and Pa where its always an equal craps shoot as to whether you will be pulled over and inspected. Once out of those two states its Va which are roll thru at 40MPH scales. After that I never see an open scale during my travels.

    As far as being a matter of time, I am sure of that. One day I will be pulled off and questioned/inspected.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    27,584

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    Oh, okay, I see. I found NC the toughest State for me. NY and PA a breeze and the others not much of a concern. I was chased down one time in NC for not going thru the Scale House, years ago. Not since then though.
    Mark Berninghausen #youmatter

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Montgomery County, NY
    Posts
    1,846

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    Yes so I never see the scale house in NC on 77 open. Even if I can get that far Friday night Ill hit it around 10pm and they are closed. Usually I dont see that scalehouse until 10am Saturday morning. It seems once south of Va the scales are 9-5 M-F. I have been pulled over once on a Sunday morning just west of Jessup at about 5am because my lights were really dim. Once the deputy see I had a trailer load of bees on he let me go. Of course that was just to the first parts store where I sat until they opened so I could change out my dead alternator.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Salem, Oregon
    Posts
    960

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    Exemptions from section 391 ( 391.2) are strictly related to 391.
    Section 391 deals with "driver qualifications NOT HOS.
    391 has nothing to do with HOS.

    http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regul...px?menukey=391

    Farmers will however gain relief for their <26000GVW trucks under MAP-21
    But be careful; some states are not yet in compliance. States were given 3 years.
    I have exactly ONE hive more than you.
    That makes my opinion beyond question.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Montgomery County, NY
    Posts
    1,846

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    Hey thats a good read. I noticed they added a short break into the 14 hour window. Interesting.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    medina, NY
    Posts
    131

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    ok so i have to abide by HOS, no problem, inconvenient yes, but have to as i am driving tue/wed down thur/fri back. So I have my cdl-a, my dot # and my NYS apiary inspection. anything else I need, or I am forgetting? Do any of you run big trucks? I was wondering about insurance through Farm Bureau for a big truck as I know insurance can be expensive. also If i get a bigger truck be it straight truck or semi, should I put Ag plates on it? just postulating for the future, any insight or thoughts are appreciated.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    27,584

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    What size truck do you have now? Where in FL r u going? What is your planned route?

    R u going down 17 across PA to 81 at Harrisburg,PA and then down to Winchester,VA across to 95 down into FL?
    Mark Berninghausen #youmatter

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    medina, NY
    Posts
    131

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    i have diesel dually 1 ton, its limited out at 11000gvw with towing at 23500. heading to hosford, fl,

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    27,584

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    You are supposed to have your name or company name on the door too. NYDOT guy pulled me over one time years ago and told me to get a DOT#. So I did. Then he pulled me over and asked where my name was. lol "Is there a list somewhere?", I asked. Apparently not.

    Do you have a NYDOT# or a USDOT#?

    I have an F-450 16,000lb GVWR and a trailer w/ 9,900lb GVWR, both w/ AG plates. Not Farm Plates, Agricultural.
    Mark Berninghausen #youmatter

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    27,584

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    You must have about 1600 or more miles to drive, don't you? PA will somewhat slow going across. It's 1000 miles from here to where I go in SC and I figure about 23 hours of driving time, not including sleeping time. You are going to have two long days each way. How many hours do you think you will be driving? Solo?
    Mark Berninghausen #youmatter

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    medina, NY
    Posts
    131

    Default Re: HOS CDL Question

    i have us dot #, and have magnetic signs with business name, town phone # and us dot number, i will be going down 90 to 75 down to talahassi. google says 1201 miles, figure 11hrs first day then finish the second,

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