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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Shediac, NB, Canada
    Posts
    83

    Default Supercedure Swarm?

    Had a swarm yesterday - saw them go by the barn. Lots of room in our hives, but decided to check anyway. Likely suspect was a hive with a poor laying queen - opened it up first & there are still lots of bees (aggressive now due no queen?) & lots of Queen cells - about 50/50 capped/uncapped. Anyhow, decided not to worry about the swarm as we didn't like that queen, which begs the question; will a queen about to be superseded swarm?

    Golden rod & asters are in full swing right now + some clover, vetch, etc.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Auckland,Auckland,New Zealand
    Posts
    6,145

    Default Re: Supercedure Swarm?

    Sounds like a classic swarm to me.

    Will a queen about to be superseded swarm? well swarming is a form of supersedure in so far as the parent hive does get superseded. Why do you ask?
    44 years, been commercial, outfits up to 4000 hives, now 120 hives and 200 nucs as a hobby, selling bees. T (mostly).

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Sacramento,California,USA
    Posts
    3,872

    Default Re: Supercedure Swarm?

    Yes, not all supersedures stay put, they do sometimes swarm and when the swarm gets established, they may then supersede that old queen and stay in place. So, yes, sometimes they do stay in place, and sometimes they swarm.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Shediac, NB, Canada
    Posts
    83

    Default Re: Supercedure Swarm?

    Thanks. Just wondering as there are 3-4 empty frames in the brood area so it isn't crowded + first year queen (poor layer).

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Campbell River, BC, CA
    Posts
    559

    Default Re: Supercedure Swarm?

    Are they empty frames, or empty drawn frames ? Empty frames with no comb, dont give the queen room to lay, so they dont really equate to 'space in the nest' the way empty drawn frames do.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Auckland,Auckland,New Zealand
    Posts
    6,145

    Default Re: Supercedure Swarm?

    Yes I was going to say supersedure, but then Grozzie raised an excellent point, if there is no flow but it's swarming season, and plastic frames they don't want to draw, they will sometimes swarm with room still in the hive.

    However in fall where you are it's not swarming season, but it is supersedure season, so you should probably leave the queen cells. The old queen does not get killed till after the new one is mated and laying, so you need not worry about your queen getting killed, or at least, not 99 times out of 100. If your queen is failing the greater risk would be not letting the bees supersede, because your old queen may fail completely through winter.
    44 years, been commercial, outfits up to 4000 hives, now 120 hives and 200 nucs as a hobby, selling bees. T (mostly).

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Shediac, NB, Canada
    Posts
    83

    Default Re: Supercedure Swarm?

    Drawn frames - this was a full deep split from another hive that we put a purchased queen in in May. Despite the good start (deep super with 50% brood/20% honey, 30% drawn) the queen never got past 5-6 frames of brood - 2 shallows of honey are fairly full. It is well past the normal swarm season here although we have a good flow going right now.

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