I started 2 lang. hives in early spring. One of them has 2 deeps now and is doing very well. The other was started a few weeks later and abscounded on me a few days after the queen came out of cage. It had a screen bottom board with no tray under it. The other had a tray. Both were packages of italians but the last was a russian queen. Well I had a +$100 show and contributed to the feral bee pop. I read up during the winter but keep learning more and especially since I found this site. I find trying to get bees free exciting. I did a cutout on a small hive with a novice trying to get back into beekeeping. (He just lost both of his hives afterwards to a flash flood a month ago)! Found out afterwards someone sprayed wasp spray before we got there and it was a loss. Started reading more here on the swarms section. Learned a lot. Anyway getting back to trapouts. I have a hogan trap. 4 homemade nucs out as traps(lemon grass oil only-no access to old drawn comb yet). One moderately strong hive. Relatives told me about 2 trees with honey bees. I was wanting to go into winter with 2 strong hives but at least have one now. Was going to split this hive next spring to get start on 2nd hive. Both trees have cavities knee to waist high and seem very populated and still bringing back pollen. I read where Mr Hogan replied to some posts and said to wait till spring and I see why. Cash cows too. I'm trying to hold back and wait. New hive and limited resources for drawn comb and open brood(eggs). I use Hive Tracks and inspect every 2 weeks. One tree is about 1 1/2 foot dia and other maybe 3 feet dia. These bees have been here a few yrs each I've been told. I don't want to eliminate whole hives but maybe get starts and requeen or if not too late let them raise own. My queen in my hive is VSH hygenic italian doing a great job. I'm the kind of person that just has to do things now and can't wait! I will though. Don't want to weaken my good hive either and keep it strong for winter. Maybe I'll have enough drawn comb etc. next spring and go from there? Was going to split anyway but instead use resources from this hive to do trapouts Hogan style? Do swarms happen in late summer and get lucky and catch one? I'll feed all I have to if I get a small one or nuc size. @ nucs are in area of the hives in trees and also near a pollinator with a trailer of bees. That trailer is a 1/2 mile from large tree with bees. I believe I just have to be patient. At least I know where I can get some if they make it thru winter. I enjoy reading the replies from all the experienced beeks here. I wish I read these forums before I got started in beekeeping. There is a bee club about 60 miles from me and meet once/month. Haven't made it yet due to work and kids baseball tournies lately. I'm 55yrs old and an ex-merchant mariner engineer. Came on land in 96 and got hitched and started a family out here in the country side of upper nw Tn. Got gardens and enjoy purple martin landlording too on 3 acres.Work in a powerhouse now. As soon as I get home I sit and watch the bees now. My wife likes Pintrist and I told her about all the rewards of beekeeping. She didn't like the part about using up her sugar when I got started! Hopefully I'll have some honey next year for her! Maybe I should of posted this in beekeeping 101? See you all later.