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I know, Another 'when to stop feeding question'

6K views 25 replies 12 participants last post by  the doc 
#1 ·
July 1 in southwest Michigan (Zone 5) and bees still taking syrup. Can I stop giving it to them?

Background: 2 first year hives, 5 weeks old. One doing well, just added 2nd deep yesterday and they have been taking syrup consistently... half a gallon a week. 2nd hive struggling some but starting to catch up. They stopped taking syrup after 2 weeks though I've made it avaialble to them. They might be taking a little syrup. Hope to add 2nd deep in a week or two.

Should I continue to feed or is it time for them to rely only on nectar?

Thanks!
 
#4 ·
When I have had colonies that refused syrup and other colonies were taking it it was because of high mite/virus loads. They would start to have bees crawling away from the hive, they would shake and often have disjointed wings. They seldom survived the winter.
 
#5 ·
... they have been taking syrup consistently... half a gallon a week.
You're lucky - my new hive takes a gallon every three days. I feel like I'm chained to the kitchen!

They went through a phase where they stopped taking the syrup - for about a week. Then they started taking it again. I don't fully understand the cause-and-effect of it all, but about that time I had added a second deep, and their first brood was emerging so the population was booming. If your weaker hive has brood on the way, you may want to keep the syrup available.
 
#9 ·
I woould like filet mingon every night also, but not in the budjet......... Why feed a honey when sugar works fine and is cheaper??

Feed them as long as you like to build stores, just be careful they are not backfilling the comb with feed. If they are takeing a gaollon every 3 days I would be checking close for backfilling, or a leak. Most hives a gallon should last about a week.
 
#11 ·
I'm not too far from you in Midland MI. I stopped feeding about a month ago (started with 5-frame nucs in late April) when i had to split hives to prevent swarming. They were backfilling the brood nest and started a lot of swarm cells. Anyways, they have done fine just bringing in forage and i have a fair bit of honey throiuhgout the hives.
 
#14 ·
This is something I come across with my hive. I caught a 7-8lb swarm on June 12th and fed 1 qt/day for 10 days. I started them on 5 frames of old comb and 4 of waxed foundation. by the 10th day I felt like the deep was honey bound since I saw <25% of the frames with eggs or brood and the rest with sugar water. I then installed the second deep and swapped #2and #8 from the bottom deep with new foundation from the top deep and placed the full frames in the center of the top deep. Last Saturday I looked and they have not really done much inthe top deep except the queen was up there laying eggs, no brood yet. The bottom deep had mostly capped brood with a few open brood and otherwise full of sugarwater/nectar and pollen. Should I be worried about the bottom deep being honey bound? Should I swap some more frames from top to bottom? reverse the deeps? Sit in the shade and stop worrying?
 
#15 ·
The reason for wondering about adding honey to the syrup was because of the one struggling hive not taking any syrup. Thought the honey might get them interested. So no budget issue. But hoping for a solution for the weaker hive.[/QUOTE]

Ahhh interesting thought... Make sure your surup is not too thick.... as for the difference between backfilling and storing... In a typical 10frame the outer frame on each side, as well as maybe half the next one in, and possible a small band at the top of each frame filled with food. much more than that is a problem before the end of July or so...you need at least 6-7 open frames for the queen to lay in, A real strong hive that may be as many as 20 frames..... when the area for her to lay in gets to small, its because a lack of space, as soon as a Larve hatches, workers are stuffing nectar into it, before the queen can lay again. in fall its not a problem... early summer is in my book
 
#18 ·
If you are seeing any freshly capped "honey" while you are feeding and the bees are taking the feed, what you are seeing is capped syrup. I have not been able to visually tell the difference between capped syrup and capped honey. As far as the bees are concerned syrup is nectar and is what you make honey out of.

It often goes without saying - anything stored while feeding the hive should not be taken for human consumption.
 
#17 ·
For me freshly capped honey is white, capped sugar has a brown tint to it. Year old capped honey will get tracked up enough to look about the same.
Some of your darker late summer/ fall honey will be darker but the fresh caps will be white.
Sugar also has a slightly greasy look kinda like its trying to seep through. Just my opinion.
 
#19 ·
OK , I should have realized that , so the real nice looking band across the top is most likely syrup or a combination of syrup an honey. When there back filling with syrup are they still using alot of it for drawing comb .One of the nucs I started this spring is now on a second deep and taking syrup at 1 1/2 Quarts a day and I was wondering if they might be backfilling with it .
 
#20 ·
There is no reason to feed when there is a flow. If there is NOT a flow, I would feed a hive that is still getting established. I have very seldom seen bees EVER stop taking syrup under any conditions except extreme cold where they couldn't take it anymore... I have seen packages backfill the brood nest and swarm because they had all that syrup and not enough room to store it, when they were still weak and trying to get established...

http://bushfarms.com/beesfeeding.htm#when

"Q. When is the best time to feed the bees?

"A. The best thing is never to feed them, but let them gather their own stores. But if the season is a failure, as it is some years in most places, then you must feed. The best time for that is just as soon as you know they will need feeding for winter; say in August or September. October does very well, however, and even if you haven't fed until December, better feed then than to let the bees starve."

--C.C. Miller, A Thousand Answers to Beekeeping Questions, 1917
 
#22 ·
I gotta ask as a newbee... how do you know when a flow is on? Is it as simple as time of year and there are lots of flowers blooming or is it observation of what and how much the bees are bringing in? Is it a Zone thing? Is it all of the above?

How does a first year beek know when that flow is happening and just as important I assume, how do you know when it has stopped?
 
#23 ·
>I gotta ask as a newbee... how do you know when a flow is on?

There is usually a steady stream of bees with a real sense of purpose coming and going from the same direction many with pollen. Lots of organized and purposeful effort.

> Is it as simple as time of year and there are lots of flowers blooming

That too. You can see things you know are honey plants blooming.

> Is it a Zone thing?

Weather always affects the flow. It can set things back or forward as much as +- a month.

>How does a first year beek know when that flow is happening and just as important I assume, how do you know when it has stopped?

The bees get testy quickly when the flow stops. They are much more intently guarding what they have. There is still traffic, but that traffic is not as steady and organized and going in the same direction. You also will see them a lot more around your house (if the beeyard is at your house) just looking around.
 
#24 ·
excelent info Michael, I would add that weather has a huge impact on Flow, but not much on timeing of the plants. Most plants work of daylight, so their "flows" are regulated more by sunlight than weather....
This year is a perfect example... real late spring I was thinking the flows from late spring and summer would run together... Nope... Just like clockwork, first weak of june hives started looseing weight, pollen stopped...
 
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