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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Browns, Illinois, USA
    Posts
    59

    Default Do I kill the queen before she gets superseded?

    Should I kill my queen about to get superseded or do I allow nature to take it's course? And what is natures course? Either way how long until I should check to see how things are going. The supersedure cell was started June 20 or 21st.
    I don't want to get into the hive before things have happened and disturb them, but I also want to get into them to see what the honey flow looks like at some point and make sure I have a laying queen.

    If anyone knows of a post feel free to give me a link, but I couldn't find what I was after.
    As Grandma says "Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me"

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Roy, Wa
    Posts
    1,685

    Default Re: Do I kill the queen before she gets superseded?

    Good Lord! NO!

    Most of my better hives will hatch out the new queen and she will be mated and laying right along side the old queen for a while before the old queen is naturally eliminated. With those genetics in my yard, my hives never miss a beat. I have even seen two laying new queens with the older queen in a hive close to fall.
    I am most certain some of my hives go into winter with the older queen and a laying daughter.

    I have yet to be able to reproduce that myself by the way. Even Grafted daughter cells introduced are not successful in co habitation with the old queen like supercedure cells are. There was a thread about the difference in swarm cell use because of environmental
    conditions and their possible predisposition to be more likley to swarm themselves because of the conditions they were developed under(Swarming impulse).

    Same would hold true for supercedure cells then too. Some sort of message they may get not to kill the old queen..at least right away, due to the conditions they were constructed under-Queen replacement without swarming intentions. Probably has something to do with day length. I see it in the fall and never see doubles in the spring or early summer.

    Some hives will eliminate, or the virgin will kill the old queen right away, leaving the hive vulnerable to it's demise if the virgin is not successful in her mated return. That's exactly what you would do if you killed the residing queen yourself.

    It depends on the type of bee variety, genetics in the hive and time of year.

    Just my opinion. A lot of people here with a lot more experience than I.

    What gave you the idea to do that?
    Last edited by Lauri; 06-25-2013 at 08:48 AM.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Browns, Illinois, USA
    Posts
    59

    Default Re: Do I kill the queen before she gets superseded?

    [QUOTE=Lauri;962352]What gave you the idea to do that?[/QUOTE

    I've seen other beeks kill their queens before they installed a purchased queen, so I just wondered if this was the same way.
    I guess not. Glad I asked.
    As Grandma says "Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me"

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Roy, Wa
    Posts
    1,685

    Default Re: Do I kill the queen before she gets superseded?

    With a supercedure, The bees WANT a new queen..thats why they made the supercedure cell. The hive is prime for it and it and it is also a daughter of the existing queen. Probably has the scent of related genetics.

    An Introduction of a new mated queen in a hive with an existing queen they LIKE, That's a totally different situation..You have to remove the exisiting queen before the new introduction..and for long enough the bees are looking for and somewhat receptive to a new a replacement. Even then, since they did not make the cell, the new introduced queen takes a couple days and some careful handling to assure acceptance.

    Here is the queen rearing calendar I use:
    http://www.thebeeyard.org/queen-rearing-calendar/
    Last edited by Lauri; 06-25-2013 at 08:50 AM.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Bunker Hill, IL
    Posts
    503

    Default Re: Do I kill the queen before she gets superseded?

    Quote Originally Posted by Edaw View Post
    Should I kill my queen about to get superseded or do I allow nature to take it's course? .
    very few reasons for killing a queen, this is not one of them.

    if anything you can make a split move her to the new hive and use an exluder to keep her from flying off.

    your about 3 hrs south of me. I dont have my hives on scales, but judging from inspections we hit peek flow about 2 weeks ago. although sweet clover is still going strong.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
    Posts
    46,341

    Default Re: Do I kill the queen before she gets superseded?

    >Should I kill my queen about to get superseded

    If she is being superseded they have things well in hand. If she is failing and they are not superseding her, then it might help to remove her.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

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