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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Taylor County, Georgia, USA
    Posts
    713

    Default What went wrong?

    A little over two weeks ago, I made a 5 frame queenless nuc. I replaced the middle frame with a frame of eggs (eggs so young they were standing on end) from a hive whose genetics I liked. I let them draw out queen cells. They drew over 20.

    I marked my dates on the calendar. When the queen cells were ripe (only hours to a day until hatching) I made splits. I made 4 two frame splits with stores and brood and plenty of bees. Then, I put two queen cells apiece into the nucs.

    I struggled to get enough bees in one of the nucs. Eventually, I had to break it down. That left three. Today (over two weeks later) I went into the remaining three. No eggs. No larva. No queens.

    These three nucs have failed while the original queenless hive from which the cells were harvested had eggs as early as last week.

    What went wrong?
    Try it. What could happen?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Gloucester County, New Jersey
    Posts
    216

    Default Re: What went wrong?

    You need to wait longer. Check back in 2 more weeks at least.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Bedford, Indiana, USA
    Posts
    217

    Default Re: What went wrong?

    If he had it timed to where they hatched and he waited two weeks, they should be well mated and laying by then.

    What does your calendar look like JStinson?


    Edit. What did the cells they hatched from look like? A hole at the bottom of the cell or chewed down?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Camas, WA
    Posts
    1,961

    Default Re: What went wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by SRatcliff View Post

    Edit. What did the cells they hatched from look like? A hole at the bottom of the cell or chewed down?
    I would want to know this also. It tells you whether the problem was with the cells or mating. Sometimes they will chew down cells that don't hatch but most of the time they just leave them in place. But in neither case is there a hole in the tip of the cell.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Taylor County, Georgia, USA
    Posts
    713

    Default Re: What went wrong?

    How long had the bees been q-less before you added those cells
    They were queenless for maybe an hour. Does the 24 hour rule apply here?


    I would want to know this also. It tells you whether the problem was with the cells or mating. Sometimes they will chew down cells that don't hatch but most of the time they just leave them in place. But in neither case is there a hole in the tip of the cell.
    I was not able to tell where the hole was because they tore the entire thing down. I placed the cells between the top bars. The bees tore the entire cells down. I do not know if they did it immediately or if they hatched first. The cells were kinda puny. That might be my other problem.
    Try it. What could happen?

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Kingsville, OH
    Posts
    959

    Default Re: What went wrong?

    Puny queen cells may well be the problem, however there are those of us who do not judge the queen cell by it's size.
    If the q cells were torn apart I might think that an other queen (newly hatched) went after the other q cells. Just my 2 cents worth.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Bedford, Indiana, USA
    Posts
    217

    Default Re: What went wrong?

    What equipment did you have these two frame nucs in? Where did you set them up at?

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Taylor County, Georgia, USA
    Posts
    713

    Default Re: What went wrong?

    The two frames were in two frame nuc boxes. Specially built to hold two frames.
    Try it. What could happen?

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Sacramento,California,USA
    Posts
    3,870

    Default Re: What went wrong?

    JStinson says....
    A little over two weeks ago, I made a 5 frame queenless nuc. I replaced the middle frame with a frame of eggs (eggs so young they were standing on end) from a hive whose genetics I liked. I let them draw out queen cells. They drew over 20.

    A little over two weeks ago means your virgins are not a week old yet. Give them at least another week before you panic.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Bedford, Indiana, USA
    Posts
    217

    Default Re: What went wrong?

    ^^
    Yep, misread that, the other guys are right.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Taylor County, Georgia, USA
    Posts
    713

    Default Re: What went wrong?

    A little over two weeks ago, I made a 5 frame queenless nuc. I replaced the middle frame with a frame of eggs (eggs so young they were standing on end) from a hive whose genetics I liked. I let them draw out queen cells. They drew over 20.
    Ok, I've made a huge mistake in explaining this. I'm looking at the calendar now.

    What I should have said is that 2.5 weeks ago, I made splits and put queen cells in them. The hive from which the queen cells came had been there for ~12 days before that.

    So, the queen cells were 12 days old when they were transplanted into the nucs. The queens were scheduled to hatch on June 9. Last week, the queenless nuc that made the queen cells had a laying queen. That tells me that the others should have been mated and laying too.

    I can understand one of them failing. But all three?
    Try it. What could happen?

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Barrie, Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    660

    Default Re: What went wrong?

    If they were due to hatch June 9(day 16), then you are now at day 31. 28 +/-5 is what MB has on his queen calendar. It seems like awful luck to have all three fail to return from mating flights. Maybe give them a few more days to start laying?
    Adam - Zone 5A
    www.adamshoney.com

  13. #13
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Sacramento, CA, USA
    Posts
    3,044

    Default Re: What went wrong?

    If they just hatched june 9th, it's barely been two weeks, still can be early.

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