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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Herrick, SD USA
    Posts
    5,940

    Default Re: Ceder hives : worth it?

    Yes, cedar does "help" prevent decay and insect attack. But NO it most definitely will not prevent wax moth, shb, or varroa damage. None of these are pests of wood but instead they are pests of what lives within these wooden hives. It's important to note that wax moth and shb are much worse in some climates than others. Leave dark, pollen filled comb unattended in the heat of a Midwestern, southern or western US summer and I guarantee you that you will have wax moth pretty much everywhere regardless of the type of wood and you will find shb in most southeastern coastal climates. MB is quite correct, I am sure I wouldn't have much trouble finding some old cedar boxes rife with wax moth cocooning scars.
    "People will generally accept facts as truth only if the facts agree with what they already believe."- Andy Rooney

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Grahamsville, NY
    Posts
    450

    Default Re: Ceder hives : worth it?

    Quote Originally Posted by jim lyon View Post
    Yes, cedar does "help" prevent decay and insect attack. But NO it most definitely will not prevent wax moth...
    Show me the REAL proof of your statement please.
    Do you have some cedar hives?

    Boris Romanov

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Rader, Greene County, Tennessee, USA
    Posts
    8,900

    Default Re: Ceder hives : worth it?

    > Show me the REAL proof of your statement please. Do you have some cedar hives?

    Quote Originally Posted by jim lyon View Post
    MB is quite correct, I am sure I wouldn't have much trouble finding some old cedar boxes rife with wax moth cocooning scars.


    Jim Lyon maintains thousands of hives, and has been in the business for many years. I have no doubt that the wood in his hives over the years has come from many types of trees, including some from cedar.

    Also note that there are multiple varieties of cedar trees and not all cedar trees/lumber have the same moth/insect characteristics. Eastern red cedar is known as aromatic cedar for its reputed moth repellent properties. But there are other commercially available cedar lumber varieties that are not the same, for instance, western cedar:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thuja_plicata
    Graham
    . . . . . . "those who want to see, can see". - - [Oldtimer - 2016]

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
    Posts
    50,911

    Default Re: Ceder hives : worth it?

    >will not prevent wax moth...
    Show me the REAL proof of your statement please.

    I have nothing to prove. If you wish to believe your lack of wax moths is due to cedar, you are welcome to that opinion. I simply don't have time to sort through hundreds of boxes to find the cedar ones and then through the cedar ones for the wax moth scarred ones and then take pictures and then post them. I had hoped the same as many have hoped, that cedar would help with wax moths and varroa etc. and I looked for evidence to that effect. Cedar did not help. There is certainly nothing wrong with cedar boxes and they will resist rot, but I wouldn't pay the difference in price to buy the cedar.

    I am simply sharing my experience. You are welcome to ignore it.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 41y 200h 38yTF

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Grahamsville, NY
    Posts
    450

    Default Re: Ceder hives : worth it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Bush View Post
    ...I have nothing to prove...
    I expected to get a such type of your answer...
    In my opinion statements without real proofs are useless.

    Boris Romanov

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    McLeod, TX
    Posts
    6

    Default Re: Ceder hives : worth it?

    Quote Originally Posted by zorares View Post
    Very Interesting. Salt. Gotta try that. I've been sprinkling cinnamon to help control ants. I'll have to make a mix of salt and cinnamon.
    I'm a newbee and I'm curious about the cinnamon controlling fire ants. Since you live in Texas, zozares, I assume it will. Is cinnamon effective with fire ants? Also have you tried that salt and cinnamon mixture? If so, what do you think of that?

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Winona, Minnesota, USA
    Posts
    2

    Default Re: Ceder hives : worth it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Bush View Post
    > Then I saw these cedar hives. Do they help keep out the nasty bugs and pests that plague hives?

    No, it does nothing to keep out wax moths, Varroa or small hive beetles. Cedar boxes age well, but the wood is expensive and brittle. It splits easily when assembling it. If it's free, I love cedar (scrap wood)... if I have to buy it, it's too expensive.
    You speak of the vast number of micro-organisms as part of a healthy hive, do you believe that cedar would in any way inhibit them?

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
    Posts
    50,911

    Default Re: Ceder hives : worth it?

    >You speak of the vast number of micro-organisms as part of a healthy hive, do you believe that cedar would in any way inhibit them?

    I don't know. I've never thought about it. I only have a few cedar hives and never noticed any difference in the health of the bees. I was not monitoring (nor am I now monitoring) levels or distribution of microbes in the colonies. If you're asking my gut feeling, I doubt it makes any difference. Black walnut would be more likely to make a difference than cedar from my experience...
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 41y 200h 38yTF

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    Willow Wood, OH. Lawrence co. USA
    Posts
    85

    Default Re: Ceder hives : worth it?

    hive.JPG

    I have 2 eastern red cedar hives. I like them very much. I've only used them for about a year now, so it may be to early to really tell how much they repel pest. I did not taste cedar in the honey. I had a swarm trap made out of eastern red cedar, and a swarm moved in, so they must like it ok. Of course there was some other good stuff in there too, like lemongrass oil and swarm lure. So far no ants, moths, or beetles. We will see how it goes over the next few years.

  10. #30
    Join Date
    May 2014
    Location
    Lexington, SC, USA
    Posts
    411

    Default Re: Ceder hives : worth it?

    Unscented Swiffer pads work well for me. Like them better than the oil traps.

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Austin, Texas
    Posts
    439

    Default Re: Ceder hives : worth it?

    We run about half cedar and half pine on our langs. I don't see any difference in the health related to the material. With my bees, the inside is coated with propolis in about a season so I don't think that anything comes into direct contact with the material after that.

  12. #32
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Champaign, Illinois
    Posts
    1,203

    Default Re: Ceder hives : worth it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Bush View Post
    >will not prevent wax moth...
    Show me the REAL proof of your statement please.

    I have nothing to prove. If you wish to believe your lack of wax moths is due to cedar, you are welcome to that opinion. I simply don't have time to sort through hundreds of boxes to find the cedar ones and then through the cedar ones for the wax moth scarred ones and then take pictures and then post them. I had hoped the same as many have hoped, that cedar would help with wax moths and varroa etc. and I looked for evidence to that effect. Cedar did not help. There is certainly nothing wrong with cedar boxes and they will resist rot, but I wouldn't pay the difference in price to buy the cedar.

    I am simply sharing my experience. You are welcome to ignore it.
    Interesting. I'm fighting a war with walnut trees my father convinced us to let grow. They're making baby trees everywhere and the only thing that grows under a walnut tree here is poison ivy. What was he thinkin? (thought he was going to sell timber or something I guess).
    Internet credibility is an oxymoron

  13. #33
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    Location
    Winona, Minnesota, USA
    Posts
    2

    Default Re: Ceder hives : worth it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Bush View Post
    >You speak of the vast number of micro-organisms as part of a healthy hive, do you believe that cedar would in any way inhibit them?

    I don't know. I've never thought about it. I only have a few cedar hives and never noticed any difference in the health of the bees. I was not monitoring (nor am I now monitoring) levels or distribution of microbes in the colonies. If you're asking my gut feeling, I doubt it makes any difference. Black walnut would be more likely to make a difference than cedar from my experience...
    Thank you, yes, gut feeling was what I was asking, not a scientific study. I plan on making a couple of cedar hives to see if the longevity is much better than pine, but got to thinking about all those microbes that I want to welcome into our hives.

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Jackson, MO
    Posts
    696

    Default Re: Ceder hives : worth it?

    Quote Originally Posted by aunt betty View Post
    Interesting. I'm fighting a war with walnut trees my father convinced us to let grow. They're making baby trees everywhere and the only thing that grows under a walnut tree here is poison ivy. What was he thinkin? (thought he was going to sell timber or something I guess).
    Probably. Or the walnuts that fall to the ground each year. 2-4-D works wonders on the poison ivy, roundup does ok. Walnuts are a money maker with the nuts and the lumber when they mature. But they are one of the worst trees, they loose leaves first in the fall and put them on the latest in the spring. They are messy and they kill out the competition around them.

    Making a hive out of them is expensive. Red cedar is more efficient.

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