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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    West Bath, Maine, United States
    Posts
    1,143

    Default Re: If Queen cells are now gone does that mean I have a Queen?

    [QUOTE=livefree88;969173]

    Do I need to brush off the bees from the donor frame? Or just put it in the recipient hive as is?

    You need to not move the queen, other than that, your choice. If you are concerned about weakening your strong hive then eggs only is the best bet.

    "One last thought: Would I be better off starting a new colony by taking 2-3 frames from my strong hive and letting them raise a queen and then adding those bees to my weak hive? Basically doing a split with my stronger hive and then adding them later to my weak hive?"

    I have come to prefer the LaFerney split (not named because he invented it, but because David said it in a way that gave me the Duh! moment.) Move the queen and frames away from the larger hive. It is a better balance of resoruces and gives a brood break as well.

    If you split it is better to add the layers to the new rather than the other way around. Home court and size advantage. You do not need to add all at once either.

    I do think there is a queen there now, just not cranked up yet. Worst case is drone laying Queen, that would be rare this time of year.
    4 yrs, Peak 14, back to zip, T lite; godfather to brother's 3.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Cookeville, TN, USA
    Posts
    4,141

    Default Re: If Queen cells are now gone does that mean I have a Queen?

    Asymmetrical split.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    adair county, kentucky, usa
    Posts
    461

    Default Re: If Queen cells are now gone does that mean I have a Queen?

    {Would I be better off starting a new colony by taking 2-3 frames from my strong hive and letting them raise a queen and then adding those bees to my weak hive?}

    I will be looking for Mr. Bush's answer to your question as I am soaking in as much of this as I can, also. I would say though, don't split or make a nuc from your good hive that will weaken it to much, and basically you wind up with 3 weak hives.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
    Posts
    46,593

    Default Re: If Queen cells are now gone does that mean I have a Queen?

    >@Michael so basically you are saying just keep adding open brood on a weekly basis until they build a queen cell?

    I've never seen it take more than three times, but yes. If they are early on in the laying worker scenario, it could be you'll only need one, but usually it takes three.

    >Do I need to brush off the bees from the donor frame? Or just put it in the recipient hive as is?

    The two issues here are if the donor hive is strong enough to lose the bees and if you are confident you can make sure you don't get the queen. If the donor hive is not strong enough or you are not sure you can spot the queen, then I would shake them off.

    >One last thought: Would I be better off starting a new colony by taking 2-3 frames from my strong hive and letting them raise a queen and then adding those bees to my weak hive? Basically doing a split with my stronger hive and then adding them later to my weak hive?

    In my experience, doing a combine with a queenright nuc and a laying worker hive only works some of the time. Not often enough to be worth all the work. The open brood is what suppresses the laying workers.

    http://bushfarms.com/beeslayingworkers.htm#pheromones

    See page 11 of Wisdom of the hive:

    "the queen's pheromones are neither necessary nor sufficient for inhibiting worker's ovaries. Instead, they strongly inhibit the workers from rearing additional queens. It is now clear that the pheromones that provide the proximate stimulus for workers to refrain from laying eggs come mainly from the brood, not from the queen (reviewed in Seeling 1985; see also Willis, Winston, and Slessor 1990)."
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Salt Lake City, Utah
    Posts
    24

    Default Re: If Queen cells are now gone does that mean I have a Queen?

    Ok, another update for those of you that are following this thread.

    This has been my fifth week in a row to add a frame of open brood to my queen less hive. So as of today I have put in five frames total from my other hive.

    Still no queen cells? And still no queen?

    I did not see any eggs this time. I think that is a good sign as the open brood may have stopped the laying workers. I'm hoping now that they will build a queen cell cause I don't know how much longer I can do this.

    If nothing happens when I check them again in a week, I will probably add one more frame. Which would be double the recommended frames and time.

    Crossing my fingers.
    Follow my new beekeeping adventure HERE.

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