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  1. #121
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    I like Allen Dick's post today on Monsanto in which he basically says the company's products have done no harm to bee except to reduce the amount of available forage within the crops.
    http://community.lsoft.com/scripts/w...1&O=D&P=192152

    But due to public demand for their crops, farmers have been striving to clean up their fields of weeds for decades to help boost yields. Monsanto simply provides the tools farmers need to get the job done. It is wrong to attack the toolmaker when the toolmaker is not the source of the problem. The intensification of agricultural practices is a response to public demand for more foodstuffs and biofuels.

  2. #122
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    BD:

    It's not that they didn't do astonishing things with the technology.

    It's that they left out a 'trump card'.

    Pollinators. Both managed and native.

    Big, big, mistake.

    It's a yield/acreage issue that will bite them (you know where) as producers continue to consoliidate.

  3. #123
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    Quote Originally Posted by jim lyon View Post
    This has actually been tried in some countries throughout history with varying degrees of success.
    They didn't do so well in Anniston, Alabama: $700 million in fines (one of the largest in US history) for lying to the public there for decades about the safety of PCB's.

  4. #124
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueDiamond View Post

    But due to public demand for their crops, farmers have been striving to clean up their fields of weeds for decades to help boost yields. Monsanto simply provides the tools farmers need to get the job done. It is wrong to attack the toolmaker when the toolmaker is not the source of the problem. The intensification of agricultural practices is a response to public demand for more foodstuffs and biofuels.
    And yet Monsanto has a long history of lying to the public and to government regulators about the safety of their products (PCB's, Dioxin, etc). Additionally, many people would argue that GMO's are a technology in search of a problem--not the other way around. Do GMO's help pollinators like bees? Do GMO's taste better? Last longer? Cost less? More nutritious? The answer of course is no, they don't/aren't. The only thing they really excel at is selling proprietary seed and pesticides.

  5. #125
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    Quote Originally Posted by BigDawg View Post
    Do GMO's help pollinators like bees? Do GMO's taste better? Last longer? Cost less? More nutritious? The answer of course is no, they don't/aren't. The only thing they really excel at is selling proprietary seed and pesticides.
    GMO crops were developed to help manage weeds and with a few crops, pests. If the produce tasted better, lasted longer, and was more nutritious, would you accept them then?
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  6. #126
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    Quote Originally Posted by BigDawg View Post
    Do GMO's help pollinators like bees?
    A monoculture of Monsanto's Roundup Ready Alfalfa would sure help bees if the farmers would wait a week or two after the beginning of bloom to cut it.

  7. #127
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    San Mateo, Ca, USA
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    Quote Originally Posted by BigDawg View Post
    They didn't do so well in Anniston, Alabama: $700 million in fines (one of the largest in US history) for lying to the public there for decades about the safety of PCB's.
    Big Dawg, I believe you are confusing Monsanto the chemical company from Monsanto the farm ag company. The farm ag company was a child spin off from the chemical company. PCB's weren't something that the farm ag was ever involved in (before or after the spinoff) so I don't think it is relevant to tie PCB's into the discussion of Monsanto the farm ag company.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monsant...fs_and_mergers

  8. #128
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    The spin-off of the chemical side was done in 1997, long after the GMO's, glyphosate, and neonicotinoids that are effecting bees, were brought to market. This was just a legal and PR move to try and shed the bad image that Monsanto had developed over the years as well as to try and avoid legal culpability over their horrible record on PCB's, DDT, etc. But in 2000, the "New Monsanto" assumed the legal liabilities of the "Old Monsanto" when Pharmacia mandated that the New Monsanto assume legal responsibility for Solutia, the company the Old Monsanto tried to dump all of their PCB and Dioxin problems onto. The bottom line is that the players, the mentality, and the outcomes remain the same no matter what green, fuzzy, "feed the world" kind of spin that Monsanto tries to put on it.

    Quote Originally Posted by BayHighlandBees View Post
    Big Dawg, I believe you are confusing Monsanto the chemical company from Monsanto the farm ag company. The farm ag company was a child spin off from the chemical company. PCB's weren't something that the farm ag was ever involved in (before or after the spinoff) so I don't think it is relevant to tie PCB's into the discussion of Monsanto the farm ag company.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monsant...fs_and_mergers

  9. #129
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    but the farm ag company doesn't even deal with industrial chemicals. Only the agricultural chemicals business was carried forward in the spinoff.

    Lots of companies were involved in PCB's back in the day. Even "green" general electric has their hands dirty in that regard.

  10. #130
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    I feel like we keep going into a critique on monsanto's 100 year history. Slander the company all you want. I really don't care, but we really should be talking about the new varoa mite solutions.

  11. #131
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    Which new Varroa mite solutions?

  12. #132
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    Slander would be making false statements with intent to defame. Monsanto's atrocious safety and environmental record is there for all to see--if you care to do a few quick searches on the web. Of course, they'd very much like it if we'd forget their past, but given their well-documented history of lying about the safety of their products, I believe very little of what they say. Their new effort to work on varroa mite solutions only came up after the EU announced the ban on neonics, so it's not like they've been concerned about bees all along....

    Quote Originally Posted by BayHighlandBees View Post
    I feel like we keep going into a critique on monsanto's 100 year history. Slander the company all you want. I really don't care, but we really should be talking about the new varoa mite solutions.

  13. #133
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    so lets talk about mite treatments

  14. #134
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    If Monsanto will follow its own tradition, they will offer first a poison to kill mites. Poison shall affect bees as well. Than, Monsanto will create GM-bees with resistance to the poison. Bees will be patented and beekeepers shall buy bees every year and destroy them at the end of the season (similar to Monsanto seeds policy, unused seeds must be destroyed) and buy new bees next year. This, everybody will recognize as a huge improvement in beekeeping because it shall eliminate wintering and all associated with this troubles. Also, Monsanto will punish anybody on who's territory Monsanto's patented bee-swarm could come...

    By the way, since poison will get into the wax and therefore into the honey - Monsanto will push FDA to declare that honey is not healthy to human consumption and we must use corn syrup from Monsanto's GM-corn instead. Victory - Monsanto will save the bees and us!
    Серёжа, Sergey

  15. #135
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    Roy, Wa
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    I hate getting into a thread about Monsanto. Too controversial. You can't convince pro GMO folks ( Although I have never actually Met one in person, just folks anonymously singing Monsanto's praises on the Internet) and it invites harsh and degrading comments.

    Some commercial farmers will also be pro Monsanto, but isn't there is a conflict of interest in their opinions? Someone who makes their living with a product cannot be expected to be against it or at least be Publicly against it and therefore probably cannot be considered non partial.

    We are all quite ignorant when talking about Monsanto and companies that are similar. Just like the government, we have no real idea what is going on behind closed doors. Media coverage is biased and censored...

    Average shmucks that just want to err on the side of caution when it comes to our health are attacked as being ignorant and against advances in agricultural development.

    But remember.. All opinions of Monsanto aside...

    He who control the worlds food supply, controls the world.
    Monsanto's controlling efforts ( And others) to control seed DNA and invoke more productive farming methods VIA :GMO and neonicitinoids is just part of the picture. Since many fruits and vegie's are dependant on the honeybee for successful pollination, it doesn't surprise me they are getting into developing a way to control them too.

    Beware though.
    How quickly farmers have come to depend on Round up ready crops, etc. How quickly folks have become dependant on technology, such as cell phones and Internet. .
    In my opinion, dependence can lead to possible control and manipulation.
    Take it away and there would be a disaster. It is the Dependence I worry about. Not so much the product.
    Even if the product was determined to be harmful to human health or the environment, it may become or already has already become 'Too big to fail'.

    Getting rid of Varroa sounds like a dream come true. Just consider the consequences if beekeepers come to quickly depend on that method... and it is taken away.
    Taken away by means of patent infringement and the inability to pay...or because it was not tested thoroughly and had unintended consequences.
    Last edited by Lauri; 06-24-2013 at 08:17 AM.

  16. #136
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    Quote Originally Posted by cerezha View Post
    If Monsanto will follow its own tradition, they will offer first a poison to kill mites. Poison shall affect bees as well. Than, Monsanto will create GM-bees with resistance to the poison. Bees will be patented and beekeepers shall buy bees every year and destroy them at the end of the season (similar to Monsanto seeds policy, unused seeds must be destroyed) and buy new bees next year. This, everybody will recognize as a huge improvement in beekeeping because it shall eliminate wintering and all associated with this troubles. Also, Monsanto will punish anybody on who's territory Monsanto's patented bee-swarm could come...

    By the way, since poison will get into the wax and therefore into the honey - Monsanto will push FDA to declare that honey is not healthy to human consumption and we must use corn syrup from Monsanto's GM-corn instead. Victory - Monsanto will save the bees and us!
    Unused seed must be destroyed? Where did you hear that?
    "People will generally accept facts as truth only if the facts agree with what they already believe."- Andy Rooney

  17. #137
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    "Bees will be patented and beekeepers shall buy bees every year and destroy them at the end of the season (similar to Monsanto seeds policy, unused seeds must be destroyed) and buy new bees next year. "

    That could work as long as it is subsidized like the rest of agriculture!

  18. #138
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    Quote Originally Posted by jim lyon View Post
    Unused seed must be destroyed? Where did you hear that?
    ya, just like all the rest of the mis information floating around this post, Un used seeds do not have to be destroyed....
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  19. #139
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    Quote Originally Posted by jim lyon View Post
    Unused seed must be destroyed? Where did you hear that?
    "When farmers purchase a patented seed variety, they sign an agreement that they will not save and replant seeds produced from the seed they buy from us. More than 275,000 farmers a year buy seed under these agreements in the United States.... Sometimes however, we are forced to resort to lawsuits. This is a relatively rare circumstance, with 145 lawsuits filed since 1997 in the United States... " from Monsanto with love:
    http://www.monsanto.com/newsviews/Pa...ave-seeds.aspx

    My assumption was that if excess of seeds may not be used, it should be destroyed to comply with Monsanto's policy, otherwise, Monsanto could suspect that seeds are saved for future use.... I apologize if I misrepresent Monsanto's policy.

    "Usually, cases come to us when someone reports they believe seed is being saved illegally. Monsanto’s attorneys look into these allegations and may have a licensed private investigator look into the facts..." http://www.monsanto.com/newsviews/Pa...-lawsuits.aspx
    Серёжа, Sergey

  20. #140
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    Default Re: Monsanto & Bayer Working On Varroa Mite Solutions

    "will not save and replant seeds produced from the seed they buy from us"

    The seed and the production from that seed is the producers, and is always the producers as it sits as inventory in the bin, but as soon as that producer tries to use that production as seed, it becomes property of the company,

    anyone who knows anything about the use of hybrids, would understand that in it self deters producers from using second generation seed
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

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