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  1. #241
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    hpm:

    Monsanto is constantly developing new products and in motion. Recently, they've made some big moves with Bayer, Dow, and Dupont.

    I think that they've anticipated the EU ban and already have replacements for the banned products.

    I also think that they're going to catch BASF and Syngenta 'flat footed'.

    I seriously doubt that Monsanto is going to lose any ground whatsoever.

    On the contrary, I think they're going to gain ground.

  2. #242
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    As long as you talk generally enough, and drop enough players names, it might sound like you know whats going on.
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  3. #243
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    Originally Posted by Barry
    Yes, that's exactly what he said, it not good for you. It's garbage.



    Quote Originally Posted by Ian View Post
    has nothing to do with the GM tech ,
    Maybe not, but the point I am making, and one you need to hear, is that no one wants to be told their contribution to a discussion "is garbage." It's obvious you're passionate about this topic, as are others, but I still expect civil dialog. Thank you.
    Regards, Barry

  4. #244
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    They inexplicably settled major suits with them right about the time the EU commission was making its decision.

    There's no other way to read it. They've closed ranks.

    In case you missed it, Syngenta, Monsanto's main competitor in the seed business, recently launched and open licensing program for its technology.

    I would say that Monsanto is reacting to that.

  5. #245
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    >>Maybe not, but the point I am making, and one you need to hear, is that no one wants to be told their contribution to a discussion "is garbage." It's obvious you're passionate about this topic, as are others, but I still expect civil dialog. Thank you.<<

    okay, I apologize to that reference,
    my intention was to point out that what was being contributed was simply made up
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  6. #246
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    I think I already jumped in once many pages ago, but this topic is how GMO relates to CCD, so let's head back in that direction.
    Regards, Barry

  7. #247
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    It doesn't take a rocket scientist to recognize that GMO's will not benefit an insect as it has been modified to inhibit many forms of insects. Has it caused 30% loss? Maybe, Maybe Not, But it sure hasn't helped our bees! Just my 2 cents!

    The fact that Monsato is a monoply, controlling governments and our food supply is an entirely different subject! Again, my 2 cents!

  8. #248
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    Quote Originally Posted by Huntingstoneboy View Post
    It doesn't take a rocket scientist to recognize that GMO's will not benefit an insect as it has been modified to inhibit many forms of insects.
    Has it? I know that GMO plants are often modified to be resistant to certain types of herbicides, but that is all I know. Perhaps you are correct, where did you get your information? Hopefully not off the internet
    “Don’t tell me how educated you are, tell me how much you have travelled.” - The Quran

  9. #249
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    http://www.beyondpesticides.org/gmos...ofactsheet.php. This is just one of many! If it is on the internet it must be true!!! LOL. Little sarcasm there, but why go to the trouble of modifying a plant species if you are not going to make it insect resistant, as well as herbicide resistant?

  10. #250
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    the beauty of GMO is that it can replace pesticides altogether and you can target specific individual pests in a way that pesticides could never do. You wouldn't call this an organic method of farming, but the next generation probably will. There's noting unnatural about transgenic species. You probably didn't know it but you are one to (assuming you've ever come down with the flu)


    http://scientificbeekeeping.com/sick...dified-plants/

  11. #251
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    Quote Originally Posted by BayHighlandBees View Post
    You probably didn't know it but you are one to (assuming you've ever come down with the flu)
    Please correct me if I'm not thinking correctly here, but adaptation vs. Genetically modified seems to be a big difference. I take the aspect of becoming resistant to a given "cold" to be more of an adaptation, not Genetically modified. My kids aren't ammune to it just because I am? Other animals can adapt to slightly different climates and food that's available, but they're still at the root level that specific animal. Correct? Because a crow perhaps eats the same food as a sparrow in a different area doesn't make it a crorrow. Is this what you're saying or did I miss something?

  12. #252
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    He is saying viral rna/dna can actually be incorporated into your Genome.
    “Don’t tell me how educated you are, tell me how much you have travelled.” - The Quran

  13. #253
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    Are we talking about the Beeologics tests again?

    Although Randy is correct in substance...

    ...let me quote Joachim de Miranda,

    "The third claim that IAPV-integrated Honey bees are "naturally transgenic" (Maori et al., 2007) represents an unfortunate use of terminology, in that it links the data to a highly controversial industry that too often tries to justify its commercial aims by finding parallels with naturally occuurring processes. This obscures the significant difference between instant transgenic evolution by man, and similar natural accidents scattered throughut the evolutionary history of the entire biosphere covering millions of years."

    From 'The Acute bee paralysis virus-Kashmir bee virus-Israeli acute paralysis virus complex', Journal of Invertebrate Pathology 103 (2010) S30-S47.

    They're already using RNAi in plants. Yes, there was an attempt to do the same for Honeybees.

    Unfortunately, RNAi seems to go off target, even in Honeybees.

  14. #254
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    What's off target? Yes, some viruses naturally integrate into host genomes and can lay dormant or become part of the genome even. I think the main issue so far is only 60% effective and the $10k cost to treat a hive. What have you heard in terms of the oligos reacting with offtarget genes in the bee?

  15. #255
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    Jarosch and Nunes (seperately) have shown that control RNAi caused changes in transcription in Honeybees. That's off target since the controls should not have had that effect.

    Some of the Beelogics investigators have shown that Varroa and Honeybees can interchange dsRNA. That's an off target effect.

    And one of the original field trials for Remebee reported an off target effect in a control colony. That one suggests that the product can affect non target insects as well.

    So, while RNAi is being developed for crops, I don't think that we can say that it won't have off target effects in Honeybees.

    There's a convoluted relationship between Monsanto, RNAi, Beeologics, and CCD in Honeybees here. A product designed to prevent CCD (IAPV) in Honeybees will likely go off target.

    I think that the same can be said for RNAi technology in general.

  16. #256
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    [QUOTE=WLC;957274]Are we talking about the Beeologics tests again?

    I was talking more in regard to plants

  17. #257
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    RNAi in plants will likely replace current GM technology. I'll agree to that with some caveats.

    One point I'd like to make is that while Monsanto is blamed by some for causing CCD, they acquired a company, Beeologics, that was developing a cure for CCD (RNAi).

  18. #258
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    (from Randy in the above link)

    What is genetic modification?

    The knowledge of genetics was not applied to plant breeding until the 1920′s; up ‘til then breeders would blindly cross promising cultivars and hope for the best. With today’s genetic engineering, breeders can now take a gene from one plant (or animal, fungus, or bacterium) and splice it into the DNA of another plant. If they get it just right, the new gene can confer resistance to frost, drought, pests, salinity, or disease. Or it could make the crop more nutritious, more flavorful, etc. Such genetically modified crops are also called “transgenic,” “recombinant,” “genetically engineered,” or “bioengineered.”

    There’s nothing new about transgenics

    There is nothing new about transgenic organisms, in fact you (yes you) are one. Viruses regularly swap genes among unrelated organisms via a process called “horizontal gene transfer” [3]. For example, the gene which is responsible for the formation of the mammalian placenta was not originally a mammal gene—it was inserted into our distant ancestors by a virus. If a gene introduced by a virus confers a fitness advantage to the recipient, then that gene may eventually be propagated throughout that species’ population. Until recently, we didn’t even know that this process has occurred throughout the evolution of life, and didn’t know or care whether a crop was “naturally” transgenic!

  19. #259
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    BHB:

    I posted a quote from a noted Honeybee virologist to illustrate that Randy is 'obfuscating' the issue.

    GM technology has been shown to impact Honeybees, and it's even considered to be a contributing factor to CCD (by some).

    RNAi isn't a proven technology in Honeybees.

    I personally believe that it's the knockdown of a core component (AGO2) of the Honeybee's RNAi system by pathogens that is the root cause of CCD (not Monsanto).

    While we all understand the importance of GMO technology, I'm not going to 'worship' it like it's a golden idol.

    In the final analysis, it's just another technology that has some spectacular benefits with many terrible impacts.

  20. #260
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    Default Re: Monsanto GMO products contribute to ccd

    what are the terrible impacts that you are worried about?

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