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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Santa Monica, CA, USA
    Posts
    1,544

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    Quote Originally Posted by robherc View Post
    Herein lies the key to pandora's box! Irresponsible use of chemical treatments for anything unavoidably leads to chemical resistance, followed by having to find new (usually more toxic & with more adverse side-effects) chemicals to use for the same problem...then the cycle repeats.......ad infinitum.
    yes, agree!
    Серёжа, Sergey

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Herrick, SD USA
    Posts
    4,639

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    I am aware of no resistance issues with formic, oxalic, thymol or hop guard. All except hop guard have been in use for quite a few years now. Amitraz products, though still effective, have had some reports of resistance starting to show up.
    "People will generally accept facts as truth only if the facts agree with what they already believe."- Andy Rooney

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Wausau, WI, USA
    Posts
    212

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    Robherc; I can understand and respect your position in regards to treatment resistance. That does not mean I agree with it. Here in lies the secret to IPM. rotating treatments, and only treating when the infestation level warrants. This greatly reduces the probability of breeding for resistance.

    Let me state it another way. Fair chance that the mites will increase in population. Too high and the colony will possibly collaps. If he treats he will most likely reduce the mite and virus loads, so he still has bees next spring. If he doesn't treat, and the hive collapses, what will he pay for a new package? $2.40. That's all it will cost to treat the hive with Hopguard. That's a lot less then the cost of a package of bees. It's cheap insurance. Good management.

    Wisnewbee
    Honey Luv Farm

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Santa Monica, CA, USA
    Posts
    1,544

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    Quote Originally Posted by jim lyon View Post
    ... Amitraz products, though still effective, have had some reports of resistance starting to show up.
    I do not remember where, but it was clearly stated in some official document (related to bees) that Amitraz is not effective anymore because of overuse and improper use (saving money - using 1/2 dosage) by beekeepers... I guess, it was EPA report or something... sorry for not providing proper link, but we have a million threads there discussed this issue.
    Серёжа, Sergey

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Calhoun Co, Texas, USA
    Posts
    1,310

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Wisnewbee View Post
    Robherc; I can understand and respect your position in regards to treatment resistance. That does not mean I agree with it. Here in lies the secret to IPM. rotating treatments, and only treating when the infestation level warrants. This greatly reduces the probability of breeding for resistance.
    Actually, what you & I said is pretty compatible...notice I qualified my statement that irresponsible use of chemicals.....
    My personal conviction is to try very hard to use no, or at least VERY little, chemicals in my hives & on my crops; that said, I believe others have that choice to make, or not make, for themselves, so long as they use responsibility & good sense if they choose to use chemical treatments

  6. #26
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Garland, Bladen County, NC, USA
    Posts
    3,195

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    Quote Originally Posted by cerezha View Post
    I do not remember where, but it was clearly stated in some official document (related to bees) that Amitraz is not effective anymore
    I wonder if you are not thinking of Apistan?
    “Don’t tell me how educated you are, tell me how much you have travelled.” - The Quran

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Wausau, WI, USA
    Posts
    212

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    No, he's talking about Amitraz. Randy Oliver's website scientific beekeeping mentions it in a couple places. Randy comments on Amitraz loosing it's effectiveness in areas such as California. Around here we have not seen this happening yet. It will happen, it's just a matter of time. Please remember that continued use of chemical controls do result in a more hardy mite population. Nothing is 100% effective (and still have live bees) so those survivors are going to be tougher to control. I'm convinced the solution is in the genetics and that's the path I've chosen to pursure. But until I get to that point, I will still have to use something to control the mites chemically. I rotate treatments and test for mite levels several times a year. I take mite control VERY seriously.

    Wisnewbee
    Honey Luv Farm

  8. #28
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Garland, Bladen County, NC, USA
    Posts
    3,195

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Wisnewbee View Post
    No, he's talking about Amitraz. Randy Oliver's website scientific beekeeping mentions it in a couple places.
    Randy Oliver's website says Amitraz is not effective anymore.... that is a pretty definitive statement.
    “Don’t tell me how educated you are, tell me how much you have travelled.” - The Quran

  9. #29
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Concord, CA
    Posts
    4,198

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    I agree that 9 mites out of a 600 bee sample isn't a high number when the hive is building up. That's only 1.5% A 1/2 cup sample of bees = 300 bees.
    Dan

  10. #30
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    San Francisco, CA
    Posts
    2,477

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    Every hive has mites. It's a matter of keeping the mite population at a managable level. MAQS every summer before August 15th kills enough mites to survive the winter with no brood break here in California. If you don't treat with something, your hives will surely die. Small cell, essential oils and all other "old wives tale" remedies don't work.
    President, San Francisco Beekeepers Association
    www.habitatforhoneybees.org

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Fort Walton Beach, Florida
    Posts
    1,256

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie B View Post
    Every hive has mites. It's a matter of keeping the mite population at a managable level. MAQS every summer before August 15th kills enough mites to survive the winter with no brood break here in California. If you don't treat with something, your hives will surely die. Small cell, essential oils and all other "old wives tale" remedies don't work.
    I'm curious how you view those beekeepers who don't treat, and whose hives do not die.

  12. #32
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    San Francisco, CA
    Posts
    2,477

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    I view them as good beekeepers who are lucky.
    President, San Francisco Beekeepers Association
    www.habitatforhoneybees.org

  13. #33
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Jacksonville, Florida
    Posts
    1,764

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    I think your mite counts are ok and you can wait until the flow stops. Our Tallow is normally finished by the first part of June. I treated last year with Apigaurd right after Tallow but, before Cabbage Palm with very good results. I would be very careful of using Quick strips this time of year in Fl. It can be pretty hard on brood and queens when temps get into the upper 80s.

  14. #34
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Concord, CA
    Posts
    4,198

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    Come on Charley you where one of us.
    You know I haven't treated with anything other than powdered sugar for 5 years & my winter loss numbers are lower than most members of my club. Its a little more than luck.

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie B View Post
    I view them as good beekeepers who are lucky.
    Dan

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Destin, FL
    Posts
    24

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    Sorry for not responding. I wasn't getting notifications. Fixed that. Anyhow the bee inspector said it was time to treat due to deformed wing virus and recommended hopsguard. Said it was safe for use during the flow. We are in nectar now but it only gets better into July. Then seems to slow a little until Fall. We make honey just about year round here!

    So now knowing that my bees have DWV. Should I treat?

  16. #36
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Destin, FL
    Posts
    24

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    Oh yeah. What the heck is MAQS?

  17. #37
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    LaGrange; Oldham County; Kentucky
    Posts
    158

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jared Waites View Post
    Oh yeah. What the heck is MAQS?
    Mite away quick strips

  18. #38
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Garland, Bladen County, NC, USA
    Posts
    3,195

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jared Waites View Post
    So now knowing that my bees have DWV. Should I treat?
    Yes.

    To me, DWV means a pretty serious and evil bunch of mites and I would want to do something fast. Hopguard seems too iffy and weak.. at least IMHO... and I would use MAQS if the temp. range in FL is right.
    “Don’t tell me how educated you are, tell me how much you have travelled.” - The Quran

  19. #39
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Fort Walton Beach, Florida
    Posts
    1,256

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie B View Post
    I view them as good beekeepers who are lucky.
    Hmm. This sentiment reminds, in a sort of reverse vampire way, of what John Miller, the bigtime beekeeper, said about CCD when it first made the news. He attributed CCD to PPB-- Piss Poor Beekeeping. After he lost most of his hives, he had to change his tune.

    My own feeling is that someone who seems to be consistently lucky is probably relying on something other than luck.

    If you don't treat with something, your hives will surely die.
    I don't think the available evidence supports this view.

  20. #40
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Destin, FL
    Posts
    24

    Default Re: Did a mite count, got 8-9 in 1 cup of bees! HELP!

    It's 74 degrees here. Is that too hot to apply MAQS?

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