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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
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    Sacramento, CA, USA
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    1,639

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    I read up on the infos already last year. Every bits of infos in my minds now because this issue very hard to deal with. There are posts
    after posts from people here with many links to argue about what method is better to solve this problem. An amazing thread I would say.
    Learned a lot from different perspective here. Many did a shook out because they don't want to deal with laying worker anymore. Too
    time consuming and at the end did not work out well for them. I have to say very good luck to you if it works out for you this time.
    Getting a queen is easy now in the spring. Imagine I have to paid 3x the price at $36 each in the winter. And they killed 2 of them even
    though these are not laying worker but just some aggressive Italian bees I have to dealt with. I pray for you that everything will work
    out at the end.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    218

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    The thing is being in Australia we are in early fall now, so getting a queen locally will be a bit harder than it was last time I needed one. I might have to order one from up north where it's still quite warm and "summer like" as far the bees are concerned.

    One thing I'm not sure about is, should I destroy the queen cells (more than likely occupied with drone larvae/pupa), now that I've gone the transferring brood once a week for three weeks route?

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Sacramento, CA, USA
    Posts
    1,639

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    Fall queen is o.k. to over winter with. I don't know how cold is winter there.
    Does it snow in your area? They need to build up in population as well as honey stores to
    over winter by now. Make sure to feed them too to keep them populated.
    The drone/queen cells not an issue now. You need the drones for a mated queen anyways. Since beeks said
    the emerging queen will not mate with the same hive drones, you can move them to a different hive also to
    conserve more resources. So no need to destroy the drone cells. At the moment you are not sure if they
    really are the drone cells or not, right.
    Schedule wise this will set you back in one month or two. That is not good because you have to baby sit
    them all winter long into next spring if they do not have enough stores for going into winter. You can shorten
    the time by buying a new queen up north. Do this only if you don't see multiple eggs in a single cell.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    218

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    No snow here, in fact our winters are a lot like Florida winters, so I think they will remain active all winter (and there is good forage just about year round here anyway). Well We'll see what we will see. I can keep feeding them brood comb for a bit without over stressing the other hive, both have lots of honey stored (was thinking of robbing the queenless one) so should be ok on that front..... LOL probably should be moving this thread to a more appropriate forum though ;-)

    Cheers, and thanks for all the help everyone!!!
    Thomas.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Sacramento, CA, USA
    Posts
    1,639

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    This forum is fine. Because we all lurk on almost all the major ones anyways. You are good!
    Yes, you can divide the resources on the queen less hive to give to the other hives as well.
    In time you can make more splits from the other hives. Almost right way and not have to deal
    with this situation to cut your time one month shorter. One frame of resource from each hive is all you need.
    Better than dealing with this unknown, potential drones hive.
    The easiest way is the OTS notch method. Are you familiar with that? It is on here also. Easy to do.
    I had 4 beautiful queens all mated using this method. And fun too because the success rate is very
    high. I can do this on every hive too to make 20 queens easily with this method. No special skills or
    equipments are needed.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Victoria, Australia
    Posts
    660

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    If there was a laying worker you would continue to see more and more drone brood (eggs and larvae) in existing frames.

    Also, they will make queen cells on the frames you add if they are queenless.

    Leave the queen cells and you'll get a queen. The bees know what they are doing.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    218

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    I'll be checking on the first donated brood frame tomorrow if the weather clears, rain is really annoying sometimes!

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Sacramento, CA, USA
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    1,639

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    If your brood frame not ready to hatch then it is still the same as when you put in few days ago.
    Not too hurry to check on them now. But maybe just a peek will do to see if any queen cells are made.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    218

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    That's the idea. I just want to check to see if queen cells are/have been made. I might also pinch a frame of honey for the hive I'm stealing brood from, figure they might be needing the help. ;-)

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Sacramento, CA, USA
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    1,639

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    Honey will help but the pollen mix with honey frame will help too. Because they need the pollen to start
    brood rearing so more royal jelly to feed the queen larvae.

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    218

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    Yep so true, that protein is the key to healthy brood. Well fingers crossed the weather keeps cooperating and it doesn't rain today.

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    218

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    Well, I checked on the first donated frame of brood, no queen cells built, and it's mostly all capped now, so tomorrow another frame will be inserted and I'll pull a honey/beebread frame to put in the donor hive. No reason they should be over worked for no return. This problem hive is most certainly a laying worker hive,there are so many drones now that it's getting hard to spot workers. If they don't come round soon I might be forced to let the hive die out to be repopulated at a later date.

  13. #33
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Sacramento, CA, USA
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    1,639

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    I have not deal with drone hives before. What would you say is the estimate of drones versus workers population now?
    If even at 80% or above then I am think you are wasting valuable bee resources to try to make a queen. Might as well give them
    another queen bee if you have one. Or if you can get one from another stronger hive. The drones are eating like pigs inside my hive.
    And I only have 40 of them in a nuc box. However, the worker bees are quickly taking over because of a good laying queen. I put a new laying spring queen in there too. Nevertheless this is a good learning lesson for us here.

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    218

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    At this point the drone population would be EASY 20-25% of the colony, if not more. And they are emerging from the eggs laid by workers now too, so another week or two of this and it will be a drone only hive. I think it's a lost cause now, I'll give them this frame, but unless I see a queen cell built that's it. I'll save what honey I can and I'll end up with a mess of drawn comb too, so restarting from a swarm or package come spring will be easier.

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Belfast, Ireland
    Posts
    396

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    Quote Originally Posted by beepro View Post
    beeks said
    the emerging queen will not mate with the same hive drones,
    That is not actually true as a virgin queen will mate with any drones in the area irrespective of where they may have come from.

    Praxis, I would not waste any more time on that drone layer hive.
    If it were mine I would just shake it out in front of another hive.
    Concentrate on your other colonies and make sure they are well prepared for winter.
    A colony with laying workers is rarely worth the bother.

  16. #36
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    218

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    The reason I've persisted with it so long is that it's one of the two hives I have..... Sigh, well one hive now.

  17. #37
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    Dec 2012
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    Sacramento, CA, USA
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    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    You are right, Jonathan. There are drone congregation areas within the hive place. Who knows what drone
    come from which hive, right. This is not an isolated hive area anyway. Thanks you for the correction.

  18. #38
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
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    Sacramento, CA, USA
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    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    I think you can split the strong hive into a nuc. Now you have 2 nucs 5 frames in each.
    Be careful though that they might make more queen cells than you can handle. Or buy a
    queen for your split too. Two fall nucs going into winter.

  19. #39
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    218

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    And we have queen cups on the first frame of donated brood, three atm, I added another frame of mostly eggs seeing as it looks like progress is finally being made. If this doesn't work I'll shake them out in front of my other hive and call it quits.

  20. #40
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    218

    Default Re: Two larvae in one queen cell?

    Ok, so after 6 frames of brood, and and doing a dummy split on my other hive (tricked them into raising a queen to 1 day before capping), my laying worker hive is now queen right. more than two months of hard work and finally I find the new queen, no eggs as yet, but she is big and she is beautiful! I can go into winter with a bit less to worry about now.... Thanks to everyone who helped, it really was a team effort this time!

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